Donald Trump

[PDS]

Here's Trump's statement in all its glory:

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Michael

"We have no choice." 3 times in a row, with some Pew poll numbers thrown in as window dressing. Bullshit.

Did another 9-11 happen while I wasn't paying attention? The Obama Administration is incompetant. Yes. This is undeniably true. But Trump is making shit up as he goes along. But Trump's proposal is disgusting, and worse, I think he knows it is. He curls his lips down a little when he is bluffing.

So, if "we have no choice," and we shut down Muslim immigration, what happens if we have another mass shooting by a pair of Bonnie and Clyde radicals?

Do we then throw all the "Muslims" out of the country? Or just put them in prison camps? Apparently Trump already believes that Americans who happen to be Muslim should not be let back in the country. Nothing fascist about that. If you happen to be a Muslim and a citizen of the grand Ole USA, I just hope you have some stout borrowing limits on your American Express card.

After all, "we have no choice." Right?

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Do we then throw all the "Muslims" out of the country? Or just put them in prison camps? Apparently Trump already believes that Americans who happen to be Muslim should not be let back in the country.

David,

Did we read the same article?

Here is an exact quote from the article you just linked:

During a Tuesday morning interview with ABC's "Good Morning America," however, Trump clarified that American Muslims would still be able to travel freely under his plan.

"If a person is a Muslim and goes overseas and come back, they can come back. They are a citizen, that is different," Trump said.

I don't understand how you parsed these words to mean the opposite.

Michael

[Marc]

Regardless of all the statements such as " Ronald Reagan was not a politician " , although he was the freaking Governor of California and all the other mantras on this amazing thread ( my mantra of " zero chance" included ) DT has no shot .

Even Brant is back on DT , which for me shows a classic stock trader mistake . Buy , oh no sell , oh no buy again strategy . No disrespect sir intended .

When DT now decides to start running against Hillary as he is so confident of his win for the Nomination, as if the game even started- is the dagger to his heart . My " Black Swan " , in a sense .

I need to remind people here that it aint a baseball game , DT is not up 19-3 in the 9th and the other side needs hits , homers , doubles , etc etc etc and bat around the order at least twice and virtually impossible to overcome ( in baseball ) .

This is pre primary stuff , then its the actual race , then its the Presidency race .

One mistake ( and yes MSK my beloved leader ) only 1 mistake so I really am not too interested in hearing about how invincible he is . One wrong word , one idiotic bullshit thing to say . One . Next day , the real time polls show him not up 19-3 , but down 24- 19 .

He is now running against establishment ( meaning Democrats , Republicans , Tea Party and all the money , the Senators , Congress ) , and the establishment will not go down NOT swinging . They will swing - not like a boxer in the first round , but like Muhammad Ali in the later rounds against Foreman and Liston and Frazier ( although there was no rope a dope , or Liston strategy in that fight ) .

This is a guy who is brilliant , builds stuff ( MSK , I agree ) , and knows that he is getting to the point of believing himself , the polls ( which are not accurate , obviously as what buddy thinks in Minnesota has any effect on what the Republican machine is gonna roll out in Iowa , etc etc etc .

To bet that DT , is going to waltz through this before the real money even comes in - is to give a Carson style quote - like believing in the freaking tooth fairy .

How Trump deals when he really gets hit hard ( will be the real test ) . No MSK , I do not even believe he has actually had a jab land against his chin yet .

He ain't Ali , he ain't Reagan .

He is an amazing business man , and to remind all the cool aid drinkers - The election is Nov 4th 2016 .

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

After the hostilities go away and the enemy surrenders

?

What's the question?

[Selene]

Regardless of all the statements such as " Ronald Reagan was not a politician " , although he was the freaking Governor of California and all the other mantras on this amazing thread ( my mantra of " zero chance" included ) DT has no shot .

Even Brant is back on DT , which for me shows a classic stock trader mistake . Buy , oh no sell , oh no buy again strategy . No disrespect sir intended .

When DT now decides to start running against Hillary as he is so confident of his win for the Nomination, as if the game even started- is the dagger to his heart . My " Black Swan " , in a sense .

I need to remind people here that it aint a baseball game , DT is not up 19-3 in the 9th and the other side needs hits , homers , doubles , etc etc etc and bat around the order at least twice and virtually impossible to overcome ( in baseball ) .

This is pre primary stuff , then its the actual race , then its the Presidency race .

One mistake ( and yes MSK my beloved leader ) only 1 mistake so I really am not too interested in hearing about how invincible he is . One wrong word , one idiotic bullshit thing to say . One . Next day , the real time polls show him not up 19-3 , but down 24- 19 .

He is now running against establishment ( meaning Democrats , Republicans , Tea Party and all the money , the Senators , Congress ) , and the establishment will not go down NOT swinging . They will swing - not like a boxer in the first round , but like Muhammad Ali in the later rounds against Foreman and Liston and Frazier ( although there was no rope a dope , or Liston strategy in that fight ) .

This is a guy who is brilliant , builds stuff ( MSK , I agree ) , and knows that he is getting to the point of believing himself , the polls ( which are not accurate , obviously as what buddy thinks in Minnesota has any effect on what the Republican machine is gonna roll out in Iowa , etc etc etc .

To bet that DT , is going to waltz through this before the real money even comes in - is to give a Carson style quote - like believing in the freaking tooth fairy .

How Trump deals when he really gets hit hard ( will be the real test ) . No MSK , I do not even believe he has actually had a jab land against his chin yet .

He ain't Ali , he ain't Reagan .

He is an amazing business man , and to remind all the cool aid drinkers - The election is Nov 4th 2016 .

Marc:

So we can agree that The Donald is a long shot correct?

He will probably come up a little short in Iowa and finish second.

That will be an important place in this race to see how well The Donald works this into his messaging.

I think he wins in New Hampshire and it will be a "surprise."

Additionally, my perception is that he wins South Carolina big which will tell me a lot. Heavy military vote in the Republican primary prime voter in South Caroling and Lindsay Grahamesty's home turf and election day organization.

Then I will know.

A...

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

One mistake ( and yes MSK my beloved leader ) only 1 mistake so I really am not too interested in hearing about how invincible he is . One wrong word , one idiotic bullshit thing to say . One . Next day , the real time polls show him not up 19-3 , but down 24- 19 .

Marc,

Heh.

One wrong word?

One?

How is that any different than what people have been saying since July?

Let's choose a word, shall we? How about the politicians he bribed comment, the immigration "rapist and murderer" comment, the border wall comment, the McCain "captured" comment, the vaccination and autism comment, the Megyn Kelly "blood" comment, the Carly Fiorina "face" comment, the Ben Carson "child molester" comment, the bomb the shit out of ISIS oil fields comment, the mocking the handicapped reporter comment?

Shall I go on?

I'm looking at a particular crow in my murder, thinking, how shall I barbecue thee? Let me count the ways.

Like Rush Limbaugh says, the media did not make Donald Trump so the media will not be able to take him out. He has an authentic connection to his supporters, not a media-manipulated one.

For the record, here's a prediction. I believe the polling will dip after this Muslim kerfuffle. This will probably happen because:

1. The establishment manipulates polling enough to distort one round (but only one round, then it has to back off for credibility of the polls themselves), and

2. The manipulated poll will happen before Trump's idea settles and contrasts against the moral grayness bandwagon that is erupting right now.

And here's the second part of that prediction. The next round of polling, after the manipulated poll, will show support rising even higher for Trump than right now. And his crowds will continue to get bigger at his rallies.

I'm merely basing this on the patterns I have seen so far.

Michael

[Peter]

It is moral to restrict immigration. I don’t think you need a reason. But is it moral to do it on the basis of religion? Of course. If the religion poses a threat, then it is rational and moral to stop them from entering. But again America doesn’t need a reason.

The danger can be demonstrated with Islam. If even 10 percent agree with the policies of ISIS in general and a mere 2 percent if Muslims think murder is OK in the name of Allah, then they should be kept out. If they believe in Sharia Law or using force to make Islam the only religion, they should be kept out. Those percentages are correct but what if those percentages go up after they have been here a while because they don’t assimilate, Americans dislike them, and they hide their faces, which violates all ideas of public safety?

What if Islam just seems to be a nuisance to a majority of Americans, is it still the right thing to do? I have no problem with Trump’s anti immigration policy, even if he and a majority of Americans just don’t like the bastards. We have no moral imperative to associate with them or to let them immigrate. At other periods in our history we have limited or halted all immigration. We should do that again.
Peter

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

The following is a pretty good interview with Trump on "Morning Joe," even though in the middle, Joe cut him off for a break out of frustration. That's why there are two videos.

 

 

The media is playing up Joe cutting Trump off, but the second half is more important as to what is actually going to happen in the press over time. After the break:

 

 

Also, as gravy, here are reactions to Trump's Muslim comment from people at the rally last night (also covered by "Morning Joe"):

 

 

I see all the hot-button elements in this to bait a perfect media shit-storm, with all the due escape clauses. In other words, eventually the media will have to cave after doing a lot of blah blah blah soapbox crap like they did with all the other Trumpisms.

 

And Trump's support will continue growing.

 

 

Michael

[PDS]

Do we then throw all the "Muslims" out of the country? Or just put them in prison camps? Apparently Trump already believes that Americans who happen to be Muslim should not be let back in the country.

David,

Did we read the same article?

Here is an exact quote from the article you just linked:

During a Tuesday morning interview with ABC's "Good Morning America," however, Trump clarified that American Muslims would still be able to travel freely under his plan.

"If a person is a Muslim and goes overseas and come back, they can come back. They are a citizen, that is different," Trump said.

I don't understand how you parsed these words to mean the opposite.

Michael

From this quote in the article: "Asked by The Hill whether that would include American Muslims currently abroad, Trump spokeswoman Hope Hicks replied over email: “Mr. Trump says, ‘everyone.’ ”

And, logically speaking if one accepts Trump's premise, why shouldn't that apply to Americans who happen to be Muslim?

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

David,

Come on.

He later qualified it. In the same article. Right after what you quoted.

I quoted it.

Is this a gotcha thing or are you interested in what Trump actually means?

His supporters know perfectly what he means. And they see the gotcha people as those arguing with gotchas. Fun at times, but not reality-based.

There is one exception re Muslim citizens who are American. Trump believes if any American goes over to join ISIS and fight against Americans, they can't come back. I agree with that.

Michael

[PDS]

David,

Come on.

He later qualified it. In the same article. Right after what you quoted.

I quoted it.

Is this a gotcha thing or are you interested in what Trump actually means?

His supporters know perfectly what he means. And they see the gotcha people as those arguing with gotchas. Fun at times, but not reality-based.

There is one exception re Muslim citizens who are American. Trump believes if any American goes over to join ISIS and fight against Americans, they can't come back. I agree with that.

Michael

Yes, he did qualify it--the next day.

With other politicians, this is called "walking back" a dumb idea. Is this supposed to make us feel better--that on Monday afternoon it's everybody on Tuesday morning it's not everybody? All so we can have, in effect, a "time out" to figure out what's going on?

If it makes you feel better, go ahead and attack my motives, but I actually could care less about gotcha stuff. That's tactical, short term thinking. It doesn't matter in the long run. But that's alot of what everybody is talking about, i.e., that Trump is stealing new cycles, that he's twisting the press's tail, etc. What matters to me is whether we have somebody who is making stuff things up as he goes along. You don't think he does. I beg to differ. My bullshit meter is in the red with this guy, and not just because he's a blowhard.

I think Trump gets nominated we will have bought 8 years of Hillary Clinton and probably the Senate too. Then the last slight vestige of a check against the continual whittling of freedom, i.e., the Supreme Court, is gone.

[Peter]

I thought the Morning Joe grilling of Trump wasn’t good but wasn’t too badly done. When Trump did not have the facts he didn’t fabricate any, but he should have boned up more on American immigration history. Trump mentioned that when we are at war with a country its citizens can’t immigrate here. So, can you be at war with a religion? Not really, but reality indicates who we should associate with because it is not always possible to tell the peaceful from the violent. If a large percent of Muslims are violent, then don’t let any of them in until we sort the mess out, was Trump’s advice.

In the past who has been denied entrance into the US? Anarchists, Chinese, epileptics, polygamists, women traveling alone, beggars, physically defective people, ill people, black West Indians, etc. The 2001 Patriot Act bars anyone from the U.S. who supports terroristic groups. Literacy, English, and IQ tests have also been used to screen immigrants. Sealing the borders is a life and death situation for America, and so for now, keeping Muslims out is imperative.
Peter

From Fact Check.com. During Hoover’s four-year presidency, roughly 121,000 persons were officially deported or induced to leave through threat of deportation, Truman signed legislation protecting the rights of Mexican migrant laborers recruited legally to help harvest U.S. crops, and was unable to win congressional approval of measures to crack down on employers of illegal immigrants. During his nearly eight years in office, about 3.4 million were deported or left "voluntarily" under threat of deportation. Eisenhower deported 1.3 million Mexicans during "Operation Wetback," and officially, just over 2.1 million were recorded as having been deported or having departed under threat of deportation.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Rush Limbaugh gets Donald Trump in the same manner I do.

How Donald Trump Plays the Media
December 08, 2015
Rush Limbaugh
(transcripts from his radio show)

From the transcript:

Some days they just tee me up. Some days are just too easy. Question: Has Loretta Lynch arrested Trump yet? Well, isn't that the kind of stuff she said she's gonna start arresting people for? Why hasn't he been arrested?

. . .

Inside the Beltway, the Washington establishment, the establishment is aligned and unified on a number of things, Republicans and Democrats alike. And one of those things on which they're aligned is that the Drive-By Media is an acceptable, coequal branch of what they do. They accept the media as, for lack of a better term, the great equalizer. The media is always the institution that makes or breaks people. If the media wants to make somebody, they can, and it's allowed. If the media wants to take somebody out, it's allowed, and they try and oftentimes get away with it.

You do not hear the Republican Party condemning the media much. And the reason for this is that inside the Beltway within the Washington establishment, the elite, the ruling class, whatever you want to call it, the media is a coequal member. And members of the media are coequal. That fact and the fact that Trump now owns the media -- and this episode is just more proof of it -- is one aspect that has everything else in this campaign turned upside down. The great equalizer, the media, the great level, the media, the institution relied on to keep things within the guardrails, as the establishment wants it, can't do it. And that's why there's panic, and that's why there's outrage, and that's why there is anger.

. . .

Why is Donald Trump still a candidate? Why hasn't anybody been able to force him out? Why hasn't anybody been able to humiliate him? Why hasn't anybody been able to destroy him? Why hasn't anybody -- and by anybody, I mean, the media, 'cause that's who both parties rely on to do this. Why can't the media touch the guy? He's given them all kinds of ammo. If anybody else says what Trump says, and they're history, they're shamed, they're humiliated, they are forever forgotten, and they have gotten so low they could never recover from it.

Trump is leading the Republican presidential primary. Why can't they touch him? Why do they keep covering him? Why don't they just ignore him? They can't. And that and therein lies something fascinating. Trump has direct access to his voters, his supporters, the American people. Trump has direct access to people around the world. I've got the Trump Stack of Outrage today. It's comical. It's predictable. It's sameness. Even I, El Rushbo, am blamed for it on the BBC, if you can believe that. Yeah. I'm responsible. You know why? Because I have been saying this kind of thing 25 years or more. Trump is just picking up where I left off, according to the BBC.

Meanwhile, I've never said anything like anything Trump says. But despite it all they can't take him out. They can't stop covering him. They can't humiliate him. They can't embarrass him. They can't diminish his support. They're powerless, and this has them in a panic. The media that can make-or-break anybody cannot touch Trump, and every time they try, all they do is make him bigger. They can't explain this. They are frustrated to no end, and so are both political parties who rely on the media to be the great equalizer in all of this.

Nothing's working. No matter what Trump says, the media is there, and every member of the media is there. Every network, every camera, every microphone is there.

. . .

It may be true to say that the Drive-By Media has covered politics, for better or worse, in a predominant way for years and years and years -- and that's the horse-race aspect.

Who's leading? What do the polls say? Who's losing? Who's surprised by who's winning? Who's surprised by who's losing? But it's the horse-race angle. And that's completely backfired on 'em. Their primary technique, their primary way of reporting these campaigns and thereby shaping the outcome of them is backfiring totally on them. There is a deep panic, I believe, in the Drive-By Media. Because, in their world, in their mind, they control the horse race.

They are the ones that are the greatest factor in determining how people vote or what they say in polls. And the fact that they are having absolutely zero impact on Donald Trump is blowing their minds. Donald Trump has a more loyal audience than the media has at this point, which is also what this is showing. And it is causing a lot of people in the establishment -- the elites, the ruling class, whatever you call 'em both parties, the Washington crowd.

It's causing them to come unglued and unhinged, while they think it is Trump who is unhinged and coming unglued.

. . .

Take the events of the recent past, last week, last month, last six months. And then add the presidential to those events. Those events have been dominated by Islamic terrorism and illegal immigration and the failing US economy and the absolute disaster that is Obamacare. On the Democrat side, I don't have any recognition of any of that.

And on the Republican side, after Trump's statement here, there's only one guy. I'm just addressing the politics of this, folks. Forget substance, comments, whatever. It's the politics of this. There's only one guy in all of the presidential campaign occupying the position he occupies. Everybody else sounds the same. Everybody else... I don't care if it's Hillary or if it is Carly Fiorina. I don't care if it's Bernie Sanders or if it's John Kasich. They all sound the same. What do they all do? They are condemning Donald Trump.

Donald Trump is condemning ISIS. Donald Trump is condemning illegal immigration. Donald Trump is condemning a weak, stupid United States leadership. Over here, everybody else is not. They are condemning Donald Trump. In a political sense, Donald Trump, leading the presidential campaign, is the sole occupier of his position. He has no competition for it. Just in a political sense, that's pretty brilliant positioning to me. He owns the media. They can't stop talking about him.

And what's it costing him?

Zero.

He's not spending a dime.

. . .

This latest Donald Trump episode is a glittering, glaring example of how he is playing the media like a Stradivarius. And I tell you, folks, for all of you people who have complained and whined and moaned about the media over the years, and how unfair they are to Republicans and how unfair that makes the whole process and, "What are we gonna do?" You need to be studying Donald Trump. I don't care whether you think what he says is outrageous or wrong or whatever. That's the wrong way to look at this right now.

This latest quote/unquote "outrage" from Trump is a perfect example of how he plays the media, how he knows exactly what to do and how to do it to own their attention and airtime. He says things that he knows will drive them crazy. He says things over and over that he knows will drive them insane, and then when they go insane, he doubles down on it and drives them even crazier. He also knows that his audience is in on what he is doing.

He knows that a lot of Americans agree, to a certain extent, with things that he says. He also knows he's the only one reaching those people. And then he sits back and watches (no doubt with a huge smile) the media cover what he says over and over and over and over again. Then they analyze it over and over and over, and they talk about it over and over and over again. He's confident that a lot of his voters are gonna be able to strip away the bombast and be able to get to the nuts and bolts of what he's saying, the kernel of truth of what he's saying.

In the meantime, he ends up occupying political positions exclusively that many support.

I forced fair use a little here. The whole thing is worth reading, so I recommend you go to the link and read it.

I don't know why people don't see this, but, to me, it's as plain as the nose on my face.

Trump punks the media time after time. His followers know this and are not too worried about any rhetorical excess. They are those who look to what a person does and what he says, then goes with what he does.

That's how they filter out Trump's hyperbole. They know what he does.

They know what he will do when a job needs to be done. He will do as he always does. He will get the job done legally, on time, under budget and with polish. And for those who think Trump is simple-minded, it would be interesting to look at a few long-ass Trump contracts drafted by his high-powered lawyers.

The mainstream press lost its soul decades ago and only looks to what people say. I think these folks have been lying to themselves for so long, they don't know the difference between reality and their own words.

And, I agree with Limbaugh. They go insane, absolutely berserk, when faced with a situation where their words are not only impotent, they are irrelevant.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

If it makes you feel better, go ahead and attack my motives, but I actually could care less about gotcha stuff.

David,

I am not attacking your motives. But what do you say to the following person? (I'm paraphrasing what you said according to how I understood it.)

A. That jerk said XXXXXXXXXXX.

B. Actually, he said the contrary. Here's the quote.

A. That jerk said XXXXXXXXXXX. See? He used this word (YYYY).

B. Er... Did you read what I just wrote? He said that word, then later clarified what he meant. He means the contrary.

A. Don't you get it? His explanation means nothing. That jerk said XXXXXXXXXXX. He used this word (YYYY).

That, to me, is gotcha.

That's not a motive. That's an action.

I only have what you write to go on, so where did I misunderstand?

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Here's the deal.

The media has been the henchman of the war-profiteering DemoPublican establishment for so long, look what it's gotten us.

Wars and terror on our shores.

Look at how Trump has made his money.

No war profits.

So who am I going to believe in a clutch?

Hellooooooooooooo...

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Even Rupert Murdoch, who can't stand Trump (despite owning Fox) and was blasting him the other day for intolerance, is now starting to repeat some of Trump's positions:

 

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Has Trump gone too far? Regardless, public is obsessed on radical Muslim dangers, Complete refugee pause to fix vetting makes sense.</p>— Rupert Murdoch (@rupertmurdoch) <a href="

8, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

He's almost there. Give it some time.

 

However, I'm not too impressed. Murdoch would greatly prefer a war-profiteering Republican candidate so he can manipulate things backstage.

 

Michael

[Wolf DeVoon]

A couple quick points. There is no provision in the U.S. Constitution as amended requiring admission of non-citizens or refugees. Speaker Ryan and White House spokesmouse Josh Earnest are dead wrong on constitutional law.

Trump should play his cards close to his vest, carry on as a Republican candidate and come out swinging in the next TV debate. Let primary voters of New Hampshire and South Carolina decide whether Trump is on the right track in terms of immigration policy and plain speaking, plus other issues like U.S. involvement in Syria and U.S. tax policy.

If he gets to the convention with a plurality, it'll be a floor fight with the Republican establishment, with or without Ted Cruz or Ben Carson as his rumored or acknowledged running mate. If Trump is dealt with unfairly at the convention, he should go 3rd party. It's the right thing to do.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

What matters to me is whether we have somebody who is making stuff things up as he goes along. You don't think he does. I beg to differ.

David,

I'm still going to do the Trump persuasion breakdown (and go into the Dilbert dude), but there is one thing Trump runs in parallel that should make a lot of sense to you qua negotiator. What I mean is that he does the persuasion stuff in addition to the following. And it's all about deal-making.

Once again, I will let Rush Limbaugh explain it.

Trump Supporter: Read The Art of the Deal to Understand What He's Doing

December 08, 2015

Rush Limbaugh

(transcripts from his radio show)

From the transcript:

CALLER: Look, Rush, what Donald Trump is doing -- what he talks about -- is what he talks about in The Art of the Deal. These Grahamnesty, establishment GOP and media types should know Donald Trump is about business --

RUSH: You see?

CALLER: -- and it's what he wrote in The Art of the Deal.

RUSH: This is fabulous.

CALLER: What he's leading with is a bombastic offer.

RUSH: This is absolutely great. George, thank you. Thank you very much. I appreciate the service that you just performed. Let me explain to you what it is. George here is a Trump supporter. You know what that means? George supports Trump. George has undertaken to understand as much about Trump as he can. One of the things he's done is he's read Trump's book called The Art of the Deal. What does Trump talk about constantly in this campaign?

He's gonna do great deals. We got stupid leaders doing bad deals, doing dumb deals, but he's gonna do the best deals this country's ever had made. He's the best dealmaker; he's the best negotiator. And everybody just sits around and goes, "What a braggart. What a bunch of bombast." And they either laugh at it or they condemn it or what have you. But old George here probably knows something that most in the establishment, the ruling class, don't know, because they haven't read Trump's book.

They wouldn't stoop to such depths!

They wouldn't be seen reading Trump's book!

Right in The Art of the Deal Trump says, if you're serious in a negotiation about wanting something -- and, by the way, being serious is the only time to enter into it -- and if there's something dead certain you've gotta have, you have got to start out with the most outrageous position. The opener has got to be so outrageous that the compromise is exactly what you want. The opener is the most outrageous demand that you can make. So what old George is doing here is extrapolating Trump's negotiating skills and his technique with his political statements.

And old George here is convinced that Trump isn't really gonna deport every Muslim, and he really isn't gonna keep every Muslim outta here. But he thinks Trump wants to wake everybody up. He thinks Trump does have some pretty serious ideas, and to get there, he's gotta start out with one of these outrageous things. So that when Trump backs off of it is when he appears reasonable, which is when you can finally make the deal with him. It's a strategy.

Trump is bringing his business acumen to politics. That's something that politicians don't have: business acumen, many of them. And so they don't recognize it, and they don't understand it. So what would be the manifestation of this? How would this manifest? Okay. Well, let's go back and remember when Trump said that he's gonna deport every Mexican. Every illegal Mexican that's here is gonna get sent back. "They've gotta go," he keeps saying. "They've gotta go back. They gotta go back."

His own son, Eric Trump, said just yesterday or the day before, "My dad believes in amnesty if it's earned. Once they're sent home, they can come back if they'll do so legally." That's what his own son says the plan is. Trump hasn't said it. Well, maybe he even has, in certain ways. The point is that all of this bombast and all of this outrageousness is owning the media.

It's the "bombastic offer."

Let me quote the relevant sentence from Limbaugh's paraphrase of Trump again: The opener has got to be so outrageous that the compromise is exactly what you want.

Trump owns the media because he constantly makes bombastic offers and the media lives on bombast. (If it bleeds, it ledes.)

In other words, the media can't help itself when something bombastic comes along. It has to report on it. Its default fear dial is set so high the public has become acclimated and anything less (meaning more rational coverage) makes it lose audience.

Even though a media personality with the reach of Rush Limbaugh just took the covers off the technique in broad daylight, the media will not stop treating a Trumpian bombastic offer as anything but the Gospel Truth so they can extrapolate how this will wreck the entire planet. It doesn't matter they look like fools later. They have to do it like a drug addict has to get his next fix.

What's worse, I'm beginning to believe some of the media folks who are playing along realize exactly how they are being played by Trump, and they play along anyway to get audience.

Addiction's a bitch, except to the drug dealer.

Michael

[Peter]

I just don’t get it. After Trump’s speech denouncing Muslim immigration, "Harry Potter" author J.K. Rowling said Trump was worse than the notorious villain in her blockbuster books. "How horrible. Voldemort was nowhere near as bad," she tweeted. Yet if you look at the dark, underneath side of her novels, it is just like Islam. Her villains may smile and act sweet but in the end they revert to type and try to kill the infidels who won’t bow down to Voldemort. What a hypocrite she is.

Trump is in line with the guidelines from Homeland Security in my opinion too. Even Republicans who agree with The Donald are calling him names. I think he is right. What will it take before a blowhard like Lindsey Graham comes to his senses? Another terrorist massacre? Or the one after that . . . or the one after that? In the meantime, Americans are stocking up on guns. Like Michael, I think Trump just gained more supporters.

Katie Couric wrote today: In the wake of Donald Trump’s proposal to ban Muslims from entering the U.S., Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., told Yahoo Global News Anchor Katie Couric, “I think stricter scrutiny is a good idea.” Paul said he disagreed with having a religious test. “But I think if we want to say there is no religious aspect to this war, I think that’s a big mistake,” he told Couric. Trump’s plan, which was released Tuesday, calls for a “total and complete shutdown” of all Muslims entering the U.S. “I think there are a lot of people hell-bent on attacking us, and we do have to review who is coming, and how many people come, and where they come from,” said Paul. “I’m no big fan of Donald Trump. … But I also think it’s unfair to say he’s the biggest recruiter for ISIS.”

Paul sponsored the Stop Extremists Coming Under Refugee Entry (SECURE) Act, which called for a pause on immigration from 34 countries he says have a “high risk” of terrorism. Fellow presidential candidate Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, voted for the act. Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla., voted against it, and it failed 10-89 on Dec. 3.
end quote

Well said, Rand. Everyone should listen or read the whole interview.
Peter

[Backlighting]

If he gets to the convention with a plurality, it'll be a floor fight with the Republican establishment, with or without Ted Cruz or Ben Carson as his rumored or acknowledged running mate. If Trump is dealt with unfairly at the convention, he should go 3rd party. It's the right thing to do.

imo if he goes third party ( don't think he will) ... Hillary wins.

That trash Hillary in the big chair? That's not right for America.

-J

[Wolf DeVoon]

If he gets to the convention with a plurality, it'll be a floor fight with the Republican establishment, with or without Ted Cruz or Ben Carson as his rumored or acknowledged running mate. If Trump is dealt with unfairly at the convention, he should go 3rd party. It's the right thing to do.

imo if he goes third party ( don't think he will) ... Hillary wins.

That trash Hillary in the big chair? That's not right for America.

-J

I think Trump wins 3rd party. Obama won in 2008 on "anybody but Hillary." That still holds.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Trump is making the mainstream nuts. They are totally off their game right now.
 
But the funniest I have see so far comes from Charles Krauthammer.
 
This one is priceless.
 

 
For those who don't want to watch the video, after calling Trump a bigot, indefensible, someone who is trashing the "level of American discourse," and so on, Krauthammer derided Trump for saying he would ask people at customs if they were Muslim as one thing he would do. (Actually, if I remember correctly, a reporter asked Trump if he would do this and Trump said yes.)
 
Then Krauthammer came out with this rare choice pearl of inspired wisdom:
 

So I think that Chris Stirewalt had an answer to this dilemma. He suggested that everybody coming [into] LaGuardia, JFK or Dulles be forced to eat a ham sandwich.
 
Now that way, I would admit, that some people will be caught in the net who shouldn't -- Orthodox Jews and vegetarians -- but as Trump said this is war and there will be collateral damage so we have to get serious about this.

 
Krauthammer's war or terror is to make a universal border attack on all immigrants with a ham sandwich.
 
Eat it or be denied, sucka!
 
Mmmmpm... mmmmph... mmmph...
 
(I can't stand it... mmmmmph...)
 
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL...
 

 
Dayaamm!
 
Michael

[Marc]

The deal is getting closer and I can very confidently state that very shortly a " black swan " will appear and regardless what it is , who created it , or the circumstances - his poll numbers will plummet ( remember folks , this aint a baseball game and Trump is up 27 -2 in the 8th , politics don't work like that ) . At that point and probably well as Trump has his ears to the pulse of the nation - Trump will make a deal and then he will make his announcement , make his deal and go back to his work that he loves . Best thing is that he will have a POTUS in his pocket .

Marc,

Heh.

You mean a "black crow" will appear?

Well, the magic crow Hail Mary pass theory is about the only thing left because Trump's support keeps getting stronger and stronger.

On a more serious note, the shooting in San Bernardino practically elected him. Just watch...

Michael

Awww man , I missed a few comments here but man o man, I see the complete opposite !!!!!!!!!

[Marc]

The deal is getting closer and I can very confidently state that very shortly a " black swan " will appear and regardless what it is , who created it , or the circumstances - his poll numbers will plummet ( remember folks , this aint a baseball game and Trump is up 27 -2 in the 8th , politics don't work like that ) . At that point and probably well as Trump has his ears to the pulse of the nation - Trump will make a deal and then he will make his announcement , make his deal and go back to his work that he loves . Best thing is that he will have a POTUS in his pocket .

Marc,

Heh.

You mean a "black crow" will appear?

Well, the magic crow Hail Mary pass theory is about the only thing left because Trump's support keeps getting stronger and stronger.

On a more serious note, the shooting in San Bernardino practically elected him. Just watch...

Michael

Intriguing hints from Marc. Marc--do you have confidence based on a hunch, or based on facts? Your comment has the whiff of a hunch.*

*If the Black Swan event involves any combination of two words that have "Mitt" and "Romney" in them, I am giving up all hope for the Republic and officially moving to Costa Rica to set up an elaborate Nozickean voluntary community with me as the Benevolent Dictator, George Smith as the Spriitual Director, and Wolf as the Chief Justice of the voluntary court system. Hopefully Adam can provide some "muscle" where needed.

Yeah , the hints are reality !!! DT is a deal maker . not a politician . No one here knows his deal , not me either . My point is is that deal makers deal and politicians politic . DT is having some fun . My hunch though is based on my knowledge of human nature , politicians and how DT has lived his whole life

[Marc]

For the Trump supporters a quick question: would he still be as successful without the boorishness?* Or is that part of the package, more or less?

*"I know more about ISIS than the Generals do, I have one of the world's great memories, etc." [sorry if these aren't exact quotes].

Not a Trump supporter here ( I like the capitalist , not the politician ) .

I see that the package he is showing is obviously to play the game ( like all good politicians do ) . The only issue is that the game really aint about polls in December , its about reality in a few months .

Getting folks all jazzed up about hype will most certainly work as it has done . DT knows his shit !!!!!!

Winning the primaries , when voters have to actually go and vote - will prove this thread incorrect

Just for the record, The Donald does not have to win Iowa outright, he needs to be in the top three.

He will win New Hampshire and dominate in South Carolina and then it will get very interesting...

A...

a

DT has really went large here and live by the sword , die by the sword . I respectfully do not see it like you do - you are no doubt correct about your post but the candidate that he has become ( reality TV ish run for POTUS ) has kept his numbers up , name in the forefront and MSKs and others perfect analysis of his playing the media - all correct . When its up for DT , it will turn on a dime and he will fall like Nasdaq fell in the internet bubble 4 elections ago .