Health Care

[CNA]

Not surprised one bit. I'm trying to find a more lengthier vid of it as it is only 8 seconds long. Adam is pretty savvy with links so he may be aware of a vid link that is longer than 8 seconds.

Supposedly this is what was said before the above statement was made but still would like to see a lengthier vid on it: "I wish that I had been there when Thomas Edison made the remark that I think applies here: 'There ain't no rules around here, we're trying to accomplish something.' And therefore, when the deal goes down, all this talk about rules, we make them up as we go along."

Edited March 20, 2010 by CNA

[galtgulch]

Not surprised one bit. I'm trying to find a more lengthier vid of it as it is only 8 seconds long. Adam is pretty savvy with links so he may be aware of a vid link that is longer than 8 seconds.

Supposedly this is what was said before the above statement was made but still would like to see a lengthier vid on it: "I wish that I had been there when Thomas Edison made the remark that I think applies here: 'There ain't no rules around here, we're trying to accomplish something.' And therefore, when the deal goes down, all this talk about rules, we make them up as we go along."

CNA,

I believe this kind of arrogant disregard for the basic decency and respect for the rights of the individual which is ingrained in those politicians who are intent on passage of the health care reform bill is a major factor in the anger of so many inside and outside of the Tea Party movement.

Despite whatever disagreements one may have with Congressman Ron Paul, a most appealing quality of his which inspired those who came across him, is the fact that he stood alone over 300 times to vote against a congressional bill which sought a power not enumerated in Article 1 Section 8 of the Constitution. Would that all those who take the oath to preserve the Constitution took their oath as seriously. Rather they believe that if they can get the votes they can assume any powers they want. They may use sophistry to justify their power grabs such as the notion of "implied powers" under the necessary and proper clause.

CNA, I wonder if you have ever perused the Campaign For Liberty website? Most of these folks are educating themselves, reading the books recommended by Ron Paul which includes Atlas Shrugged, and the works of Ludwig von Mises. They attend the Tea Party events and try to encourage attendees to join the C4L and to support likeminded candidates for office.

Three new feature articles appear on the site daily which include those of Jacob Hornberger, founder of the Future of Freedom Foundation (www.fff.org and publisher of Freedom Daily), Sheldon Richmond, Peter Schiff etc.

www.campaignforliberty.com 229384 members and growing and www.yaliberty.org on over 170 campuses both college and high school.

I do think this is the kind of movement which can be influential and are open to the ideas of individualism and limited government.

gulch

Edited March 21, 2010 by galtgulch

[Robert Campbell]

Well, Bart Stupak and his dwindling band have cut a deal.

So now the monstrosity will pass the House without "deeming."

It could get really ugly in the Senate next month, but Obama will have signed the original Senate bill, so he won't care.

It's gonna be a wild year.

Robert Cambpell

[Backlighting]

Morons want gov. run health care. They value their lives so little they are willing to give it to the despots to decide what, when, where and how they are medically treated. Of course there are also the parasites, the seekers of the unearned, who are also on board. For them, it's another pot, with a chicken in it.

[Alfonso Jones]

Well, Bart Stupak and his dwindling band have cut a deal.

So now the monstrosity will pass the House without "deeming."

It could get really ugly in the Senate next month, but Obama will have signed the original Senate bill, so he won't care.

It's gonna be a wild year.

Robert Cambpell

It's a sad time. I'm awake at 5 a.m. (in Shanghai) and have been watching the live feed on the house floor (while tracking the vote counts) for several hours. It doesn't look good for freedom, or for the budget (either of the Federal government, or of individual citizens).

Bill P

[galtgulch]

Well, Bart Stupak and his dwindling band have cut a deal.

So now the monstrosity will pass the House without "deeming."

It could get really ugly in the Senate next month, but Obama will have signed the original Senate bill, so he won't care.

It's gonna be a wild year.

Robert Cambpell

Robert C.,

Not to mention that some physicians have indicated that if this monstrosity does pass that they will stop practicing medicine. The poll was reported in the New England Journal of Medicine and is supposed to be authentic. I haven't received my copy of it yet but look forward to it with interest. Most of the 46% are in general practice and internists or family practice docs.

This brings to mind the article which appeared in The Objectivist Newsletter when Saskatchewan was the first province in Canada to establish socialized medicine. The government threatened any doctors who closed their offices would be stopped at the border and drafted into the military! Rand made the point that this confirmed that socialized medicine essentially meant the enslavement of physicians in case anyone had any doubt.

An article appeared on the op ed page of the Boston Globe which spelled out all the chicanery in the bill. The CBO was not presented with the proper data and therefore concluded that over ten years there would be a reduction in the deficit. Untrue as there were items not reported to them to take into consideration.

Our illustrious leader is confident that Bernanke will print up all the currency he will need to pay when this countries enormous debts come due. The dollar is clearly doomed, other currencies are being inflated as well, the new head of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission is about to curtail manipulation of short positions in gold and silver which are more than likely to reach new highs.

Is there any sign of the existence of a knight in shining armor or of the cavalry coming around the mountain or mighty mouse to save the day?

It is some comfort that there are among the populace men and women armed intellectually with the correct philosophical ideas and a contingent of Americans who have awakened from their complacency. It remains to be seen whether the ideas we all know would solve the problems we face if only enough people accepted them will become the dominant ideology in the near future.

gulch

[DavidMcK]

It is important not to despair more than you have to. Remember that other people have had to fight through worse for their freedom, Valley Forge comes to mind immediately. Also remember that it has to get worse before people are motivated to make things better. The motto of the Ludwig von Mises institute comes from Virgil (I'll use the English rather than Latin)"do not give in to evil but proceed ever more boldly against it."

After I wrote this I opened my e-mail to receive a link to N. Branden's wonderful article "In a time of rage, "passion and soulfulness": http://www.nathanielbranden.com/catalog/pdf/passion_and_soulfulness.pdf

Edited March 22, 2010 by DavidMcK

[BaalChatzaf]

It is important not to despair more than you have to. Remember that other people have had to fight through worse for their freedom, Valley Forge comes to mind immediately. Also remember that it has to get worse before people are motivated to make things better. The motto of the Ludwig von Mises institute comes from Virgil (I'll use the English rather than Latin)"do not give in to evil but proceed ever more boldly against it."

Indeed. The Knives of November are being sharpened, even as we type. The Independent voters will have their revenge in November of this year and in 2012.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Backlighting]

gulch "It is some comfort that there are among the populace men and women armed intellectually with the correct philosophical ideas and a contingent of Americans who have awakened from their complacency. It remains to be seen whether the ideas we all know would solve the problems we face if only enough people accepted them will become the dominant ideology in the near future"

Unfortunately, the schools are mass producing collectivists far quicker than any movement towards individual rights and free market capitalism. Sadly, these students are the architects of the future. Pessimism, yes, based on objective reality.

[Robert Campbell]

Nope, it's not like Valley Forge.

Nor even like it was in 1943.

Shills want to equate Obamacare with Social Security and Medicare, but each of those got overwhelming majorities in Congress.

It would have been better had ObamaReidPelosicare been stopped in its tracks, but a movement to repeal the entire hunk of junk is a realistic prospect.

May the whole sorry episode mark the high tide of statism in America.

Robert Campbell

[Alfonso Jones]

Let's do what we can to ensure that as many as possible of those who voted "yes" today are voted out of office at the very next opportunity.

I am sickened by what has just happened. But it's not "over" by any means. Not even time to cry. Just time to redouble our efforts, speak out, make certain to vote, . . . .

Bill P

Edited March 22, 2010 by Bill P

[Christopher]

There are a lot of issues happening, and I am sure both the Senate and the courts are going to be involved in everything happening. Man, it's too bad the founders required simple majority.. Wouldn't it have been great if all Federal actions required 80% majority to pass? Then none of this 51% of citizens wouldn't be controlling the other 49%. Hell, aren't there more women than men in the U.S. with roughly the same 51-49% ratio? That would technically mean that all the women could pass legislature such as everyone receives free pads each month.

[tjohnson]

This brings to mind the article which appeared in The Objectivist Newsletter when Saskatchewan was the first province in Canada to establish socialized medicine. The government threatened any doctors who closed their offices would be stopped at the border and drafted into the military! Rand made the point that this confirmed that socialized medicine essentially meant the enslavement of physicians in case anyone had any doubt.

Interesting, because in a cross Canada survey recently Canadians voted Tommy Douglas as the greatest Canadian hero . So despite the strongarm tactics used at the outset, implementing medicare is considered a huge success in Canada now. Maybe when things settle down over there it won't be so bad.

[Brant Gaede]

Now's the time to fight, not run. I thought all this shit wouldn't come down in my lifetime! It's the acceleration of history!

--Brant

[Brant Gaede]

This brings to mind the article which appeared in The Objectivist Newsletter when Saskatchewan was the first province in Canada to establish socialized medicine. The government threatened any doctors who closed their offices would be stopped at the border and drafted into the military! Rand made the point that this confirmed that socialized medicine essentially meant the enslavement of physicians in case anyone had any doubt.

Interesting, because in a cross Canada survey recently Canadians voted Tommy Douglas as the greatest Canadian hero . So despite the strongarm tactics used at the outset, implementing medicare is considered a huge success in Canada now. Maybe when things settle down over there it won't be so bad.

They came for us one by one.

--Brant

[Alfonso Jones]

Now's the time to fight, not run. I thought all this shit wouldn't come down in my lifetime! It's the acceleration of history!

--Brant

You have that right! Here's hoping that the proportion of those who just voted "yes" on the Health Care bill who are DEFEATED in their next try for reelection is strikingly high, so much that the lesson is clear to all.

Don't tread on us!

Bill P

[anthony]

Now's the time to fight, not run. I thought all this shit wouldn't come down in my lifetime! It's the acceleration of history!

--Brant

You have that right! Here's hoping that the proportion of those who just voted "yes" on the Health Care bill who are DEFEATED in their next try for reelection is strikingly high, so much that the lesson is clear to all.

Don't tread on us!

Bill P

Bill,

This saddens me, too. I take some comfort from Robert's remark that this could be "the high point of statism in America." Hopefully very prescient.

In my inexpert opinion, with such a near-run result, such a tiny majority, firstly, how can any Executive of the USA take delight in polarizing the Nation so dramatically? Second, I have a sneaking thought that American citizens will be taking a hard look at themselves, after the fanfare has died down, and take a step back from the edge.

Tony

[BaalChatzaf]

Last night the National Legislature passed the Equalization of Opportunity Bill. How much longer until directive 10-289?

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Robert Campbell]

Does anyone know who's running against Bart Stupak?

Judging from the final vote totals—is it possible that La Pelosi was bluffing Bart and his crew, and he fell for it?

Robert Campbell

[Chris Grieb]

As Churchill said at a another very dark time. "Never give in, Never, Never give in."

If you live in Virginia, Florida or Idaho; support your state attorney general and ask your state attorney general to join their suit against the bill.

If you live in a district of a Congressman make their Easter-Passover recess a living hell.

[Alfonso Jones]

As Churchill said at a another very dark time. "Never give in, Never, Never give in."

If you live in Virginia, Florida or Idaho; support your state attorney general and ask your state attorney general to join their suit against the bill.

If you live in a district of a Congressman make their Easter-Passover recess a living hell.

That's the spirit! Never surrender.

Bill P

[psychoanaleesis]

Is it time for Civil disobedience? There should be a test case right after if it's ratified and another, and another and another... You still have the potential beloved America. Fight it, fight for your freedom and all those who love it shall rise up in answer to your noble and resolute call.

Here and elsewhere, it's a lost cause and the only thing I can do for myself in the name of the spirit which you are founded, is not to give in. I take away my consent from the muck whenever I can. To uphold myself by rejecting their premise of man living for another. Godspeed to my beloved land and true home.

[Robert Campbell]

Chris G,

South Carolina will be suing, according to Henry McMaster, the state Attorney General.

Robert C

[Brant Gaede]

Does anyone know who's running against Bart Stupak?

Judging from the final vote totals—is it possible that La Pelosi was bluffing Bart and his crew, and he fell for it?

Robert Campbell

I don't doubt some who voted NO would have voted YES if their votes had been needed. The Crats would have simply upped the pressure more to get what they wanted.

--Brant

Soviet medicine advances

[Brant Gaede]

Chris G,

South Carolina will be suing, according to Henry McMaster, the state Attorney General.

Robert C

The primary value of these suits is to keep the matter fresh and inhibit people from adapting to a radically new situation.

--Brant

wait until the doctors head for the exits; that's the real shit-city