Objectivism Online run by hypocritical babies?

[Harrison Danneskold]

J:

I'm sorry to hear about your experiences. There's a very perverse sort of irony in those who defend Rand regardless of reason.

I hesitate to generalize there, though, because I've only dealt with a handful of outright evaders on O.O and numerous sincere and rational people.

On Christians: I wonder how belief in the afterlife influenced the children's crusade?

[Harrison Danneskold]

Hell; I wonder how that belief impacts suicide bombers!

[caroljane]

HD, don'tknow if it was the same discussion, but I just saw an OO member proclaim that he had never heard of a woman described as "a rock" in the sense that Frank was Ayn's rock, etc., and this connotated masculinity in character.

I found this funny because recently my 28 year old son told me that I was his rock. |n fact, his father a true rock) once said the same to me. And my character has the consistency of a sponge wrapped in one ply paper towel, but two good men found rockiness in me.

Rand was proud to be called an honorary man. I wonder if she would be so proud now of her admirers who define masculinity in her name.

[Jonathan]

With the rechristened Minnesota Mild and Minnesota Adopted Quads, I foresee the Lynx grinding their teeth in envy.

The Lynx should change to the Minnesota Subhuman Females.

J

[Jonathan]

A vegetable is not alive; a curious and rational person is.
Is a concrete-bound stoner more like the former or the latter?
Nothing against stoners, in general, but some of them (who eat, sleep and breathe apathy) are perfect examples of this.
---

The survival argument for being rational doesn't strictly apply to every single individual and this is where some Oists, unfortunately, are prone to twist the facts to fit theory.

Claiming that plants are not alive, and that "to survive permanently 'zoned out', on autopilot, is not living," are examples of twisting facts to fit theory.

The idea of doing philosophy is not to play word games by using several different meanings of "live" and alternate between them arbitrarily to try to make one's faulty theory appear to work.

J

[Harrison Danneskold]

I think not, Daunce.

As someone who sneered at traditional stereotypes, I think she'd be shocked and appalled by what some of her admirers are saying.

[Jonathan]

I'm sorry to hear about your experiences. There's a very perverse sort of irony in those who defend Rand regardless of reason.

The bigger irony is those who oppose Rand's ideas while believing that they're defending them, and who shoot the messenger who is trying to disabuse them of their ignorance.

On Christians: I wonder how belief in the afterlife influenced the children's crusade?

I think you're grasping for a way to blame Christianity. I and many others were raised Christian, yet we don't defend Rand or Objectivism regardless of reason. Some of the OObrats were not raised as Christians and never had a belief in the afterlife. Also, Rand herself displayed the same traits and tactics as the OObrats.

J

[Jonathan]

HD, don'tknow if it was the same discussion, but I just saw an OO member proclaim that he had never heard of a woman described as "a rock" in the sense that Frank was Ayn's rock, etc., and this connotated masculinity in character.

I found this funny because recently my 28 year old son told me that I was his rock. |n fact, his father a true rock) once said the same to me. And my character has the consistency of a sponge wrapped in one ply paper towel, but two good men found rockiness in me.

Rand was proud to be called an honorary man. I wonder if she would be so proud now of her admirers who define masculinity in her name.

The argument appears to be that since Rand called Frank her "rock," then he must have been a big, strong, manly man. All evidence to the contrary is therefore nullified. People who knew him and described him as quiet, gentle, unassertive and sweet are just wrong and didn't know him like Rand did.

Also, it's a lie that he was a florist. It must be. Rand said he was a frickin' rock, and hairy he-man rocks don't arrange flowers, so Rand's rock didn't do that.

J

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I'm thinking that since "Patriot" is currently evolving in the mainstream press to mean a bigoted right-wing yahoo, maybe the New England Patriots should change their name.

Also, what's this crap about Angels? Isn't there supposed to be separation of church and sports?

Anyway, the Indians shouldn't be too worried about "Redskins" or "Braves." If I were them, I would be more concerned about the Buffalo Bills.

Michael

[Harrison Danneskold]

J: I'm deliberately using "survival" to refer to continued metabolic function and "life" to refer to doing so as "man qua man" because I'm not entirely comfortable assigning a purpose to a whole species.

And by vegetable I meant a braindead person; please excuse the ambiguity.

[Harrison Danneskold]

The Minnesota Vikings should keep their name, btw; it suits the new stadium.

All I want is for a cigarette to go onto the logo.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Man, did I screw up. My last post belongs in a different thread.

I'm going to quote the post over at the right thread.

Dayaamm!

MIchael

EDIT: Or did I post in the wrong thread? Double dayaamm!

[Brant Gaede]

Man, did I screw up.

MIchael

No need to say anything more.

--Brant

we've known this for a long time; it's understandable you'd be the last to see it

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Brant,

LOL...

Always good to have a friend nearby in a pinch...

Michael

[caroljane]

Brant, you miss the more serious issue here. It is in the guidelines: It is the exclusive right of Members to screw up, post on wrong threads, and forget who they are talking to about what. It is the duty of Management to be perfect and correct the mistakes of Members. Creeping dictatorship is infringing on our rights!

[Brant Gaede]

"Friend?" I don't need no stinkin' friends!

--I was never here and this never happened (I ain't me)

[caroljane]

Apt comment about the cigarette, HD. The Toronto Marlies used to be the Marlboroughs but shortened the name to avoid being associated with cigarette, though there never was any connection anyway, as far as I know.

[Jonathan]

J: I'm deliberately using "survival" to refer to continued metabolic function and "life" to refer to doing so as "man qua man" because I'm not entirely comfortable assigning a purpose to a whole species.

Wouldn't it be easier to just use words as they're commonly used instead of inventing your own meanings? You're talking about people being "constructive." Why not avoid needless confusion and call it that?

J

[Jonathan]

The Minnesota Vikings should keep their name, btw; it suits the new stadium.

How about the Minnesota Taxpayer Rapers?

J

[Selene]

I am in favor of the Buffalo Blunts - smokin hot stoners...

[Brant Gaede]

The Minnesota Dykes?

--Brant

[Selene]

The Minnesota Dykes?

--Brant

Denver Dykes?

[Ellen Stuttle]

This thread has gone South, or maybe North.

I haven't yet had time to look up NB's discussion of "focus."

Meanwhile, a thought occurred to me, maybe as a by-product of Adam's statement - #47 - that "Becoming a fully rational human [whatever that means] is a choice":

Possibly Rand's pronouncements concerning the volitional nature of MAN would make some sense on the supposition that she confused consciousness with cognition.

For example, "Man is a being of volitional cognition" isn't so off the wall as the idea that any being is a being of "volitional consciousness."

Ellen

[Ellen Stuttle]

And:

Bob (Ba'al, Mr. Cheeky Guy):

Why haven't you answered post #49?

Are you afraid you'll reveal that your description of Rand's "Den" as "rather strange people" was made in ignorance even of who most of that original group were?

Ellen

[caroljane]

Baal is a little distraught today. I have looked at your list Ellen, and all I see is an ordinary family group except Greenspan and Rukavina, who nevertheless have the same cultural backgrounds as the others.

Of course, all families are strange.