John and Yoko - Two Virgins (artistic nudity)

[Kat]

[Dragonfly]

I think the drawing needs a small correction: Lennon was very probably uncircumcised, he wasn't an American.

[Victor Pross]

Thanks Kat, for posting this painting. And thanks to those who 'voted yes.'

We see John Lennon and Yoko Ono standing front and center, as they appeared on their album ‘Two Virgins’, naked as Jaybirds. I wanted to give the painting a "scribble look" --almost in a way to suggest Lennon's style of drawing --mixed with my own. That was the challenge. The Two Virgins' album was released, I believe, in 1967, but I have here a '1969 John Lennon' [i simply like that look]. Yoko is holding a rather tempting apple…to suggest the Garden of Eden or perhaps the business venture, Apple Corp. That can be the fun of the painting...you can decide.

Victor

Edited October 19, 2006 by Victor Pross

[Rich Engle]

Too realistic

[Victor Pross]

More information about Two Vigins here, with original photo. Be warned!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Virgins

[reason.on]

More information about Two Vigins here, with original photo. Be warned!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Virgins

I'm just curious, but I'm wondering why you turned Yoko around, but not John?

RCR

[Victor Pross]

Hi Christian,

It might have something to do with my homosexual leanings—which could be bad news for my girlfriend. [Kidding!]

I’m glad you caught that, and I did it for a specific, but simple reason: I wanted to place the emphasis on John--who rightfully deserved the adulation and fortune he achieved. Yoko was not an artist of his stature and one may ask if she were really an artist at all. Yoko struck me has nothing much more than a “married hanger-on” looking to advance her reputation as a “serious” artist--whatever her affections for John.

I believe she had mixed emotions regarding the famous Beatle, loving and resentful of him at the same time. After all, he was a mere “pop artist” while she was a “real artist.” That’s why I painted her with eyes that look more envious than of love and admiration, placing a lock of hair over the rest of her face to emphasize the eyes. The apple is significant if you bite into the idea of Eve’s powers of temptation.

Victor

Edited October 19, 2006 by Victor Pross

[reason.on]

Hi Christian,

It might have something to do with my homosexual leanings—which could be bad news for my girlfriend. [Kidding!]

Well, you are from Canada, right?

I'm glad you caught that, and I did it for a specific, but simple reason: I wanted to place the emphasis on John--who rightfully deserved the adulation and fortune he achieved. Yoko was not an artist of his stature and one may ask if she were really an artist at all. Yoko struck me has nothing much more than a "married hanger-on" looking to advance her reputation as a "serious" artist--whatever her affections for John.

It is funny, when I first started typing my question, I wrote, "I'm wondering why you turned the beast Yoko around, but not John?" (as I wrote, I considered for the briefest of moments that any caricature of Yoko's vagina would necessarily have to be so disturbing and heinous that even the most resilient of viewers would be instantly reduced to spasms of voluminous vomiting), so I completely understand and appreciate the gist of your rationale (although, I don't think Lennon "deserved" the cult-of-personality style attention that he received).

I believe she had mixed emotions regarding the famous Beatle, loving and resentful of him at the same time. After all, he was a mere "pop artist" while she was a "real artist." That's why I painted her with eyes that look more envious than of love and admiration, placing a lock of hair over the rest of her face to emphasize the eyes. The apple is significant if you bite into the idea of Eve's powers of temptation.

Oh, I thought her cock-eyed gaze was supposed to signify her utter kookishness (you know, like that raving lunatic in *Who Framed Roger Rabbit*).

Now I'm wondering if van Eyke's Arnolfini portrait played any part in inspiring the drawing (or perhaps even the original photograph of the two)? There are a couple of interesting parallels.

Btw, why doesn't she have any feet?

RCR

Edited October 19, 2006 by R. Christian Ross

[Victor Pross]

Now I'm wondering if van Eyke's Arnolfini portrait played any part in inspiring the drawing (or perhaps even the original photograph of the two)? There are a couple of interesting parallels.

Btw, why doesn't she have any feet?

Which Van Eyke Arnolfini portrait did you have in mind? Could you provide a link, so I can take a look? I'm really curious and interested. This answers your question--it was only the original photo of the two lovers. What parallels do you see? I'm most interested.

Yoko's feet? This may sound bad, but the wash of paint across the canvas was a WHIM! I don't care too much for Yoko Ono to grant her the virtue of having feet. ;)

[reason.on]

Yoko's feet? This may sound bad, but the wash of paint across the canvas was a WHIM!

Bad? Victor, you should know by now that all WHIMS are EVIL. :devil:

The painting I had in memory was this one:

Once I took a good look (not from memory), there really are a couple of parallels in your illustration...

They way in which both pairs hold hands

The male figure looks at the observer, while the female looks at the male.

The presence of symbolic Edenesque fruit (with van Eyke it is oranges in the window)

The female glance in both examples is both submissive and yet somewhat controlling

The male in the van Eyke has a hand position that mimics Lennon's uplifted piece sign.

And in general the theme is the same: the complex relationship between and man and a woman.

RCR

PS-Don't worry, I won't tell any of the children of the corn that you've been caught plagiarizing yet again.

[Victor Pross]

I don't think the link worked.

PS-Don't worry, I won't tell any of the children of the corn that you've been caught plagiarizing yet again.

Um, yeah...sure do hope you are kidding. Bad as this sounds, I don't know this aritst's work. Two Virgins is just that--the 1968 album cover, a parody of it. Can you try to provide the link again?

EDIT: Oh, there it is...lovely. But I don't see all the things you speak of there. And where's the apple!?

Edited October 19, 2006 by Victor Pross

[Victor Pross]

I don't think the link worked.

PS-Don't worry, I won't tell any of the children of the corn that you've been caught plagiarizing yet again.

Um, yeah...sure do hope you are kidding. Bad as this sounds, I don't know this aritst's work. Two Virgins is just that--the 1968 album cover, a parody of it. Can you try to provide the link again?

EDIT: Oh, there it is...lovely. But I don't see all the things you speak of there. And where's the apple!? I don't see any oranges. Lennon and Ono had their power struggles...and Apple Corp and Eden itself was its own idea screaming out at me. What a stretch, Christian.

Edited October 19, 2006 by Victor Pross

[reason.on]

I don't think the link worked.

Um, yeah...sure do hope you are kidding. Bad as this sounds, I don't know this aritst's work. Two Virgins is just that--the 1968 album cover, a parody of it. Can you try to provide the link again?

LOL. Yeah, Victor, you'd better watch it, I'm really a solo spy in the house of OL...(sorry, if the topic is still a touchy one, but really, only a complete dolt would suggest such a thing--such as the dolt who found another painting with a pile of skulls...)

I just updated my previous post to include the image.

Btw, I also wanted to say that IMHO I think the satire of the illustration would have been better served without the text blocks...

RCR

[Victor Pross]

Ah, Christian--you devil. :devil: It's hard to tell with just words on a screen. No body language and facial expressions to go with it, and I'm a visual person. Yeah, the SLOP idiot...who cares about facts or justice, just get the rope.

Yeah, the text...there a few paintings I have where I have done this, and it might be up for debate if it adds or takes away from the painting. But with John and Yoko, I do remember seeing a bio of their 'bed-in for peace' and the couple had all these signs hanging around...peace for this and peace for that! It was funny.

By the way, here's a summery of that gorgeous painting I found:

This portrait of Giovanni Arnolfini and his wife is generally thought to be a marriage portrait. The couple stands in a bedroom with joined hands, solemnizing their vows between two witnesses reflected in the mirror on the back wall. One is the artist himself, as the inscription above the mirror attests in Latin: “Johannes de Eyck fuit hic” (“Jan van Eyck was here”). The painting is in the National Gallery in London.

[reason.on]

EDIT: Oh, there it is...lovely. But I don't see all the things you speak of there. And where's the apple!? I don't see any oranges. Lennon and Ono had their power struggles...and Apple Corp and Eden itself was its own idea screaming out at me. What a stretch, Christian.

Oh I admit completely that it was whale of a stretch, and whimsical to boot. What can I say, I'm bored @ work today.

There is one orange in the window sill, and several more can be seen on the desk below the window. It is fascinating painting to study in detail, as its symbology is deep and somewhat mysterious.

RCR

Edited October 19, 2006 by R. Christian Ross

[Peri]

More information about Two Vigins here, with original photo. Be warned!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Virgins

I just got a good gander at the original, and survived to share the tale.

Yep, Dragonfly was correct. Uncircumcised.

He was born during a Nazi air-raid on Liverpool. Perhaps there wasn't time. Actually, I don't think circumcision was a common practice amongst gentiles until the 1950's, right?

Thanks, Kat, for posting this. Victor, your take on Yoko is similar to my own...I think she loved him, but was somewhat resentful that this middle-class, uneducated bloke was taken far more seriously, and was more naturally talented, than she could ever hope to be.

And I have enjoyed immensely the little tutorial in art history while visting this thread as well. When reading some of the posts, I can't help thinking of a quote by Oscar Wilde: "The critic's job is to see a work of art as it really is not."

Edited October 20, 2006 by Peri

[Victor Pross]

Yep, Dragonfly was correct. Uncircumcised. Then again, he was born during a Nazi air-raid. Perhaps there wasn't time.

Damn! Back to the drawing board! This time I’ll use a different paint brush...or a scalpel. :shocked:

[Peri]

Yep, Dragonfly was correct. Uncircumcised. Then again, he was born during a Nazi air-raid. Perhaps there wasn't time.

Damn! Back to the drawing board! This time I’ll use a different paint brush...or a scalpel. :shocked:

Naw...it's wonderful as it is.

[CNA]

Peri wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Virgins

I just got a good gander at the original, and survived to share the tale.

Yep, Dragonfly was correct. Uncircumcised.

Girl, you are too much. Laughing so hard right now my stomach is killing me. You fully inspected the evidence and have come back with an affirmative, yes, resounding yes, he IS uncircumsized. Peri, you are too much and I'm bustin' up right now.

I agree about the history lesson as I am a bit too young to have been around when all this went on with them. I can read of course but I wasn't around when they were out doing their thing. Victor is robbing the cradle over here. LOL Well, obviously I'm not that young.

I like this one but curious as to the "back to the drawing board" deal.

Angie

[Dragonfly]

He was born during a Nazi air-raid on Liverpool. Perhaps there wasn't time. Actually, I don't think circumcision was a common practice amongst gentiles until the 1950's, right?

It wasn't and isn't a common practice amongst Europeans at all.

[Kat]

Thanks, Victor for sharing this with us all.

Am I the only one who has actually heard the album, Two Virgins? I like Yoko, but I realize I am in the minority. You seldom see two people who loved each other as much as John and Yoko did. They were very unconventional and that is something I admire alot. I wish that everyone will find their soulmate, too. I'm glad I finally found mine.

Every Man Has a Woman Who Loves Him

Yoko Ono

Every man has a woman who loves him

In rain or shine or life and death

If he finds her in this lifetime

He will know when he presses his ear to her breast

Why do I roam when I know you're the one

Why do I laugh when I feel like crying

Every woman has a man who loves her

Rise or fall of her life and death

If she finds him in this life time

She will know when she looks into his eyes

Why do I roam when I know you're the one

Why do I run when I feel like holding you

Every man has a woman who loves him

If he finds her in this lifetime

He will know.

[BAMF]

Very cool painting! I happened to have loved the text blocks.

Victor, can I share this with another forum, please? Also, is there somewhere I can see the rest of your work?

[Victor Pross]

Very cool painting! I happened to have loved the text blocks. Victor, can I share this with another forum, please? Also, is there somewhere I can see the rest of your work?

Thank you, Kori. Yes, you can share this with another forum. I would be curious to know which one?

Here are some more art examples: http://gobestimpression.com/Pross/

Victor

[Michael Russell]

Yeah, the text...there a few paintings I have where I have done this, and it might be up for debate if it adds or takes away from the painting. But with John and Yoko, I do remember seeing a bio of their 'bed-in for peace' and the couple had all these signs hanging around...peace for this and peace for that! It was funny.

Victor, I love your painting. As for the text blocks, in my opinion they add to the painting. While reading them, I'm reminded of John Lennon's goofiness, and I say that with affection. In a world gone mad we can use a few more John Lennons in the world.

Mick

[Victor Pross]

Victor, I love your painting. As for the text blocks, in my opinion they add to the painting. While reading them, I'm reminded of John Lennon's goofiness, and I say that with affection. In a world gone mad we can use a few more John Lennons in the world.

Thanks Mick. Art is selectivity, I knew I put those darn text blocks there for a reason.

Yeah, Lennon was one sardonic wit with a goofy side. Anybody who writes a tune called 'I am the Wulrus' must be. ;)