Richard Wiig

Here's the charming chap. He went by the name of "No_Limit_Nigga"

A few freemarket businessmen does not equate to freedom, especially when those very same businessmen push for Sharia. Islam is not against business. I see a rocket has been fired from Egypt into Israel http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-17620925 another sign of the new shift. Will these businessmen put an end to that? I don't think so. Despite their willingness to do business with outsiders, Islam is still the name of their game.

I eagerly await Schlussel's next article documenting this fact. That isn't a fact. It's an opinion.

Michael, was there something wrong with my response to Libertarian Muslim?

It get's rid of one cancer cell, but it's hardly a cure for the cancer.

I honestly don't think that the US or Israel will actually attack Iran openly. Because you think America is cowed by a great enemy?

I'm sure it's not because they're libertarians so want to decrease state involvement. That would be a valid reason. I thought the article gave a likely reason. If there's a more likely alternative, then you'll have to enlighten me. As far as what Islamic schools are like in Turkey, I don't know. I know that I hope they're not like the Islamic schools in Pakistan, which I doubt they are, although I bet they are not amicable toward America, Liberty and Capitalism. Regardless of what they are like though, the trend is the point - not what they are today, but what they are likely to become - what Turkey is likely to become. Things such as this... http://www.sundayszaman.com/sunday/newsDetail_getNewsById.action?newsId=274468 ... do not look good.

I was not being snarky.

Turkey is becoming more secular, not less, according to Libertarian muslim. http://www.ansamed.info/ansamed/en/news/sections/politics/2012/02/24/visualizza_new.html_104136312.html

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/02/egyptian-presidential-candidate-egypt-will-go-to-war-with-us-germany-and-israel-within-three-months.html

It doesn't matter that they are splintered. Bottomline is, they are muslim. It's already amply demonstrated that when they both have a common foe they can stop their fighting and work together. Sunni and Shiite have done, and will, collaborate for the sake of Islam.

"Loonwatch nails Jihadwatch when it fucks up and LIES. It nails Geller when she stumbles and LIES and misinforms. That is its job description." Well, I've looked for the lies. I haven't found them. What lies are you actually refering to? And finding some objectivity at loonwatch is like searching for the mystical Unicorn. It's there somewhere, apparently, but as yet I am not a believer.

There is no Shariah in Canada because people like Pamela Geller stood up and opposed it. Many Muslim women in Canada, who have come from places like Iran, stood up and opposed it too. They are in Canada to escape Shariah. What is the context in which she said that? You haven't provided it.

Mess? All I did was post a link, so I don't know what you're refering to.

(NOTE FROM MSK: This following copy/paste came in the form of gibberish and I had to clean it up for it to make any kind of sense. It is basically part of an article on Front Page Magazine. At least this poster provided a link, so I will not repeat it.) The High Price of Telling the Truth about Islam [Editor's note: The article below is written by Eric Allen Bell, a filmmaker who was recently banned from blogging at the “Daily Kos” because he wrote three articles that ran afoul of the mindset there, specifically naming “Loonwatch.com” as a “terrorist spin control network.” Frontpage invited him to tell his story, which he does below.] http://frontpagemag....th-about-islam/

That they're running out of food is a consequence, not a cause.

Couldn't be more off the mark. Does white or black skin make one savage?

‘Islam Is Islam, And That’s It’ The Arab Spring was not hijacked BY ANDREW C. McCARTHY The tumult indelibly dubbed “the Arab Spring” in the West, by the credulous and the calculating alike, is easier to understand once you grasp two basics. First, the most important fact in the Arab world — as well as in Iran, Turkey, Pakistan, Afghanistan, and other neighboring non-Arab territories — is Islam. It is not poverty, illiteracy, or the lack of modern democratic institutions. These, like anti-Semitism, anti-Americanism, and an insular propensity to buy into conspiracy theories featuring infidel villains, are effects of Islam’s regional hegemony and supremacist tendency, not causes of it. One need not be led to that which pervades the air one breathes. The second fact is that Islam constitutes a distinct civilization. It is not merely an exotic splash on the gorgeous global mosaic with a few embarrassing cultural eccentricities; it is an entirely different way of looking at the world. We struggle with this truth, which defies our end-of-history smugness. Enthralled by diversity for its own sake, we have lost the capacity to comprehend a civilization whose idea of diversity is coercing diverse peoples into obedience to its evolution-resistant norms... http://www.nationalreview.com/nrd/article/?q=MTFhZjcyZmQ1Mjc0NGRmODY2ZGMyMWNmZjE2N2IyNjQ

A few words from Ali Sina, who makes a better defence of Pamela Geller than I ever could: Ali Sina: "Pamela Geller and her organizations don’t become hate groups just because a bunch of moon-bats say so" The indomitable Ali Sina of Faith Freedom has been in a discussion of sorts with Sheila Musaji of The American Muslim, who is an established liar. His latest piece addressed to her brilliantly answers the principal charges that Leftists and Islamic supremacists routinely make against Pamela Geller and me, and our organizations. (I have reproduced it below as it appears in the original; "Namazi" is of course the communist antisemite Maryam Namazie, and "Bari" is Rifqa Bary.) ...Let us continue: It is both surprising and not surprising that Ali Sina has now been named to the Board of Directors of the newly formed Stop the Islamization of Nations SION which is a coalition SIOA, SIOE, and other hate groups, and which will be led by Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer. It is not surprising because of the animosity towards Islam that he shares with Geller and Spencer. It is surprising because of the fact that Geller herself is Jewish, and Ali Sina seems to have as much animosity towards Judaism as he does against Islam. Perhaps this is above your ken but what unites Pamela Geller (a Jew), Robert Spencer (a Catholic), Wafa Sultan (a secular humanist), Babu Suseelan (a Hindu) ,and yours truly, is our humanity. We have different beliefs, but we don’t allow that to divide us. To a Muslim this might be incomprehensible. You see the world divided on religious lines. We don’t see it that way. We see all mankind as members of one gigantic human family. We have different tastes in politics and in religion. But we never let them come between us and divide us. I receive many emails from youths who say they no longer believe in Islam and want to become Christian. I never discourage them. Let me quote what I wrote to one such youth yesterday. This 22 year old Somali woman wrote to Pamela Geller and told her that she wants to be a Christian. She added, “However, i know that if my family [comes to] know about this they will surely end my life since it will bring them shame in our community. Once my father found a bible in my drawer and he told me that if he founds it there again he will do something to me that i will regret forever. I feel unsafe here and am looking for a way out please help me before it is too late.” Pamela asked me to reply and here is a few passages from my email to her: “Faith is a very personal matter. It is a relationship you have with your God. No one can take it away from you and you don’t have to speak about it to anyone. Jesus did not start a new religion. He wants to have a personal relationship with you. As long as you have him in your heart, he is with you even if you don’t attend any church or interact with other Christians. If you live in your parent’s home, you need to live by their rules. Don’t keep a Bible at home and don’t have any cross or anything that may make them think you are a Christian. You don’t need to do any baptism either. Love of God is your baptism. Soon you will be out of your parent’s home and will be more independent. … Meanwhile I suggest you act with caution. Time will pass fast. Study hard and get the best education you can. Education is your key to freedom. If you have a good education you can get a hired sooner and afford getting out of your parental home faster. You may even go and live in another city or another country. If you want to read the Bible you can find it online. If you want to discuss your faith with anyone you can find Christian communities online. Don’t share your thoughts with anyone. Study, study and study! This is the fastest way to your freedom.” Pamela is a Jew and I am a humanist. But neither of us discouraged this girl from following the path that she had chosen for herself. We don’t care about people’s faiths. We care about their lives. We don’t divide mankind along religious lines. There is no such thing as believers/unbelievers, the faithful and the kafir in our lexicon. What matters, is our humanity and what makes us human is not what we believe, but how we live. You are a Muslim. You are genuinely incapable to see that we are humans first, and religion is nothing compared to the strong string of humanity that runs through the core of all of us and binds us together like the beads in a rosary. You see the world from the tainted glasses of Islam. What you don’t know is that those glasses come from the mind of a psychopath narcissist. Islam is insanity. This is not an insult. This is my thesis and I have proven it. Read my book and you too will agree. You then continued: The Southern Poverty Law Center published a report citing Geller for hate speech. The AFDI has been named a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. The American Freedom Defense Initiative is the parent group of the SIOA. Spencer, Geller, and Yerushalmi are featured in the SPLC reports Jihad Against Islam and The Anti-Muslim Inner Circle. Yes I know. These traitorous leftist organizations are your lackeys. What unites them with you Muslims is your common hatred of the Judeo-Christian western values. But they are stupid. They think by supporting fellow haters of the western values they will be stronger and you will help them to come to power. All they have to do to see their folly is to talk to fellow commies from Iran. Let them talk with Maryam Namazi from UK. Namazi and her comrades were instrumental in the revolution of 1979 in Iran. They threw their lot with Islamists. But they were the first who were eliminated when Khomeni took power. If Islam ever comes to power in Europe or in America, all those left leaning organization that today defend Islam will be the first to be eliminated. Those who don’t read the history, tend to repeat the same errors. Pamela Geller and her organizations don’t become hate groups just because a bunch of moon-bats says so. Pamela has demonstrated her compassion and care for countless hapless and helpless young Muslims whose own families have turned against them. Young Muslims write to her from all over the world asking for help. This woman should be awarded the Nobel Prize for her humanitarianism and for her compassion. Alas the Nobel Prize committee is so politicized that they think charlatans like Arafat, Obama and Al Gore are more deserving for that prize than good humans who truly serve mankind. One of the saddest stories is when Gore was granted the Nobel Prize for lying about global warming there was a 92 years woman named Irene Sendler, who was also a nominee. She had saved some 2,500 Jewish children from the Nazi Holocaust by smuggling them out of Warsaw Ghetto, in her basket and tool box. I felt a lump in my throat when I read her story and that instead of her the committee chose this filty liar. I don’t give a damn about those organizations calling Pamela Geller a hate monger. I can see how much she cares about people. I saw how she took to heart the case of Rifqa Bari and protected that beautiful soul when her parents wanted to kill her. Where were you to protect Rifqa? Why young Muslims don’t write to YOU to protect them from their families and write to Pamela? Because they know you are a hypocrite Islamist and all you care is your damn religion, but Pamela is a humanitarian who cares about them and is not concerned about what religion they believe. I have seen people write to her and say they want to stay Muslim but just want to be free from the tyranny of their parents and Pamela still advised them compassionately and tried to help them without ever telling them they should leave Islam first. Pay Pal at least temporarily suspended Geller’s site Atlas Shrugs for being a hate site. Sure! They did it because a bunch of Muslims like you wrote to Pay Pal lied about Pamela and libled her of spreading hate. When Pay Pal realized they had been duped they reversed their decision. Actually, Musaji is here lying yet again. PayPal never actually suspended Geller at all. You then said Spencer and Geller attempted to patent the SIOA trademark, but were refused by the U.S. patent office The government response, posted on the site, states, “The applied-for mark refers to Muslims in a disparaging manner because by definition it implies that conversion or conformity to Islam is something that needs to be stopped or caused to cease.” That is because our Governments are misled. They consider Islam a religion and as such it is protected. That is why we formed SION (Stop Islamization Of Nations) to educate and to unmask Islam. Islam is not just a religion. It is more a political ideology of domination. It must be classified as such. It is more akin to communism and Nazism than it is to other faiths. Muhammad said al Islamo deenun wa dawla (Islam is both religion and government.) One cannot be separated from another. This is what people don’t know. It will take some time to make the world aware of it. But we are patient and determined. More prominent people are joining SION from all over the world. We are poised to become a powerful international force. And we will go after traitors who sell their country for vote. We will expose them. We know that anytime a politician supports Islam we have to follow the money trail to find a skeleton in their closet. That is what we intend to do. The Center for American Progress released a groundbreaking report Fear Inc.: The Roots of the Islamophobia Network in America. The key researchers for this report were Wajahat Ali, Eli Clifton, Matthew Duss, Lee Fang, Scott Keyes, and Faiz Shakir. The report itself is the result of a six month investigative project, and is 132 pages in length. Geller is cited as part of this network. Oh really!? So a bunch of Muslims and their minions got together and cited Geller as Islamophobe? And what else is new? I repeated many times that Islamophobia is a fallacy. Geller is a defender of the Western civilization. Musaji quotes several other organizations that are either run by Muslims or are sympathetic to Islam that denounce the critics of Islam as “Islamophobe”. In her opinion this is “evidence.” In Persian we have a saying: They asked the fox who will testify on your behalf, he said my tail. Or better than that is when Allah backs up Muhammad. Who gives a damn if Muslims and their minions call us hate monger? This is circular reasoning. I talk about facts and I have shown that we are not hate mongers, but Muslims are.

Having read it, it doesn't strike me as being anything of significance. The only significant thing I can glean is that William is on a par with Neville in gullibility. http://frontpagemag.com/2012/01/24/muslim-brotherhood-and-obama-partners-in-taqiyya/

I haven't read it, but free-market businessmen have nothing, and can never have anything, in common with Hassan Al Banana.

I just love that I am a hater. I guess that makes me a lover too.

<i>I think Richard is attempting to indirectly validate his point of view by linkage to Spencer and the validation of Spencer by Bell.</i> No. I'm merely posting it for the benefit those here who use loonwatch as a source of knowledge, it to show that not everyone is sucked in by it, that even those who believe can come to their senses. As for my point of view being validated, it's validated everyday by what's going on within Islam. Things are getting worse, not better.

You spoil all my fun. It was only a slur against some OL members. Doctor doesn't get it. I posted it for those who are enamoured with Loonwatch, who seem to think it is a good source of information - when it suits them. There's no point in me discussing it though, because I don't have a voice here.

(Note from MSK: I changed the title before approving this thread. The original title was a childish slur against OL members.) Independent thought on jihad and Islam at the Daily Kos Recently two extraordinary articles have appeared at the Daily Kos -- extraordinary because, to the rage and dismay of many of that site's commenters and regular readers -- they depart from the standard Leftist line that Islamic jihad violence has nothing whatsoever to do with Islam, even if jihadists invoke Islamic texts and teachings to justify that violence, and that only greasy Islamophobes think otherwise. The articles are "Loonwatch.com and Radical Islam" and "How and Why Loonwatch.com is a Terrorist Spin Control Network," both by Eric Allen Bell, who is so far from being a "right-wing Islamophobe" that he made a documentary about the "Islamophobia" supposedly being suffered by the proponents of a huge new mosque in Murfreesboro, Tennessee -- and is far enough to the Left to get space to write at the Daily Kos. Yet Bell had the intellectual honesty to make this entirely true observation about the hate and defamation site that is the subject of his pieces: "But for LoonWatch.com any criticism of the Koran or of violent Jihad - even those criticisms that might have some legitimacy to them - even of radical Islam, are branded as Islamophobia and anyone who dares to raise questions about the nearly constant acts of Jihad going on increasingly around the world today is labeled a 'Loon' - thus the title of their blog, LoonWatch.com." Since I am the subject of obsessive attention at Loonwatch, I am mentioned in the original article as well as in the followup, which Bell wrote after Islamic supremacists and their Leftist tools rounded upon him with predictable and ludicrous charges that he is a right-wing anti-Muslim bigot. I have a few disagreements with his view of me and of the jihad threat in general. He says I have some kind of religious agenda here, which anyone who reads this site will know is false. While I am a religious believer, Jihad Watch is not a religious apologetics site, but a non-sectarian site seeking to provide the context for a broad coalition of people of all perspectives -- atheists, Jews, Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims of conscience -- who are threatened by Islamic jihad. He dismissively distances himself from my colleague Pamela Geller, ignoring her courageous and pioneering work in, among many other things, raising awareness about the human rights abuses in Islamic law, such as honor killing and the death penalty for apostasy. And he seems to be a bit credulous in accepting the smooth deceptions of Muslim Brotherhood-linked forces behind the building of many mega-mosques around the country, and about the stealth jihad in general. Nonetheless, I was intrigued by Bell's capacity for independent thought, which is such a rare commodity these days, and willingness to acknowledge that there is a problem within Islam, which is even rarer, so I sent him a note, telling him: "I predict that you will not find anyone on the Left who will be willing to consider the 'correlation between some of the violent passages in the Koran and the Hadiths and many of the acts of brutality being carried out by radical Muslims in the world' [that's a quote from one of his Kos pieces]. However, I do not now and never have considered my work 'right-wing': if defending civilized values against institutionalized violence and religiously justified savagery is 'right-wing,' the Left has a great deal to answer for." I got this email back from Eric Allen Bell, and he has kindly allowed me to publish it here: Mr. Spencer - Very good to hear from you. I made a short documentary called "Not Welcome" (http://www.NotWelcomeDocumentary.com) regarding the backlash against construction of a mosque in Murfreesboro, TN. What inspired me to make that film was the same feeling I have now about what is going on in the greater Islamic world. It was my conscience - a sense of justice. That said, in the process I absorbed a whole lot of information from traditionally liberal sources. I have only recently come around to a hopefully more expansive point of view. When I finally read one of your books for the first time, I kept waiting for the part where you would prove yourself to be a "Loon" so that I could stop reading, but that never happened I watched the documentary, "Islam: What the West Needs to Know" and wanted so badly to prove wrong what I had seen and heard - but I could not. This was not only humbling but it has caused me to really rethink and rethink the possibility that perhaps the truth is not politically correct. And more is still being revealed. When I made "Not Welcome" most of the arguments against Islam I heard among the people of Murfreesboro, TN were religiously motivated. People would actually say to me that "America is a Christian nation" and they believed it said this in the Bible. The leaders of the movement were Christian Zionists. It was ugly, and yet their concerns were not entirely unfounded. So I decided to keep the focus of the film on America and look for ways to convey a message about what I perceive to be a real enemy at home. At that time I did not perceive a real threat to America in the way of "creeping Sharia" and so I left that alone. But as I watch with great disappointment the developments that have followed the so-called "Arab Spring" I am very, very concerned. Islamism is clearly on the rise, they have weapons, they are not rational and I am concerned. It means a lot to me to hear from you directly like this. I apologize if in fact I have mis-characterized where you are coming from. In my own defense, the anti-mosque crowd in Murfreesboro, TN were a very nasty bunch - and they love JihadWatch ;) So, perhaps I wrongly judged you by some of them, and if that is the case I am very sorry. I will continue to read your blog and continue to research. I admire your courage and conviction in being one of the only truth tellers out there about the dangers of Islam, your willingness to use your name and put your picture on your blog, your fearlessness in posting the Mohammed cartoon. Please feel free to contact me anytime. My sense is that this war of words with Loonwatch (who now have several Islamic websites backing them up and putting my name out on the street) has only just begun. Peace, Eric Allen Bell On a related note, Loonwatch's chief figure, "Danios," has just passed up no fewer than four separate opportunities to debate me -- three hosted at universities and one on ABN -- despite his years of bravado and false claims that I was ducking him. He claimed he wanted to debate the laughable thesis that Judaism and Christianity are just as violent as Islam -- as if armed terror groups worldwide were justifying killing people by quoting the words of Moses and Jesus, killing apostates from Judaism and Christianity, boasting about the imminent conquest and subjugation of non-Jewish and non-Christian lands, etc. But although I was agreeable and he was full of false bluster about how I was avoiding debating him, ultimately he was too afraid to step up and actually agree to a debate. And I don't really mind, for while it would have been satisfying to defeat him, I doubt anyone would have been enlightened by a couple of hours of him calling me fat, ugly, stupid, and evil, which Reza Aslan-like spittle is essentially all that he and his site can muster in response to the truths I present. They can't actually refute them.