BaalChatzaf Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 On 12/28/2016 at 2:09 PM, anthony said: Ahh. Come on! (You asking me?) Ask a Palestinian then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 On 2016/12/30 at 1:54 PM, anthony said: https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/9676/kerry-israel-speech Dershowitz is another class of observer and commentator, I found over time. It is good to hear from the intelligent and informed - and objective - centre-left, on Israel/Palestine. "...if the Palestinians really want their own state more than they want there not to be a Jewish state". (A Dershowitz) Aye, there's the rub... Accomodating the accursed Jews, even if it means our people can live properly and flourish - never! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 6 hours ago, anthony said: Accomodating the accursed Jews, even if it means our people can live properly and flourish - never! What is war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted December 31, 2016 Share Posted December 31, 2016 On 2016/12/31 at 0:48 AM, wolfdevoon said: What is war? That's enigmatic, but "war" there isn't. Keeping Israel on its toes militarily and ratcheting up social tensions among Israelis might be perceived as a sort of psychological war and maybe some victories, for Hamas and the PA, and that's all. For sustained war, we first must presuppose some level of military parity between two foes - a parity there is nothing close to - and Israel will not use a fraction of its might against civilians - second, the cause of war, in that each will have values (of a sort) to fight for and defend - but, proven many times is that Palestinians are 'fighting' much less ~for~ anything and much more ~against~ something: it's the values and achievements of Israel that they boast they want to eradicate (and take over), in the process they've been losing their own, I argue - third, that the cessation of war will be marked by one side surrendering and submitting to conditions laid down by the winner - not gonna happen - indeed, quite the reverse. Without any chance of succeeding in war, self sacrifice remains as central to the PA/Hamas strategy as it has for decades, attracting as it once did, like-minded Euro-terrorists such as Baader Meinhoff. It's been apparent that any form of self-sacrifice is perceived ambivalently and almost respectfully by some in the West and its media, with their altruistic mindsets. Indeed, there is seen to be something glamorously heroic (if a little ... "extreme") about Palestinians literally throwing away their lives and also condemning their own children to futures of misery and hatred, and possible death too. In the less-extremely-sacrificial and sentimental western view, such nihilist behavior ~must~ be indicative of a most righteous Cause, since they couldn't imagine going so far themselves for their impossible 'ideal', altruism. Where there is a "Cause" which some sacrifice themselves to, there must be a monstrous foe, in their contorted thinking, and Israel must be it. Fundamentally, the Progressive Left and Islamicists share the same ideology in differing degrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 On 12/9/2016 at 0:45 PM, RobinReborn said: I'm not a holocaust denier but saying 6 million jews were rounded up and exterminated strikes me as an exaggeration of history. Why? It's estimated 70 million died in WWII. Does that too strike you as an exaggeration? --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 40 minutes ago, Brant Gaede said: Why? It's estimated 70 million died in WWII. Does that too strike you as an exaggeration? --Brant The Turks butchered 1.5 million Armenians in 1915. Genocide, in modern times, is a major but feasible undertaking (sic). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 I've seen comments around the conservative circuit about a recent poll concerning beliefs of millennials. I'd have to dig to find it, but a lot of people have commented on it, so I'll mention it for the sake of conversation. Apparently, in this poll, about one-third of the millennials polled believe that more Americans were killed in war under George Bush (the son) than Soviets were killed by Josef Stalin. All I can do is stand in awe. That is quite a feat of brainwashing. The difference between several thousand (under Bush) and Stalin's 30 million or so (probably on the low side) is simply erased in their education by storytelling. It's time to change the storytellers in American education, or at least the stories. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jts Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 3 hours ago, BaalChatzaf said: The Turks butchered 1.5 million Armenians in 1915. Genocide, in modern times, is a major but feasible undertaking (sic). Politicians are the lowest form of life walking on 2 feet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 1, 2017 Share Posted January 1, 2017 8 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: I've seen comments around the conservative circuit about a recent poll concerning beliefs of millennials. I'd have to dig to find it, but a lot of people have commented on it, so I'll mention it for the sake of conversation. Apparently, in this poll, about one-third of the millennials polled believe that more Americans were killed in war under George Bush (the son) than Soviets were killed by Josef Stalin. All I can do is stand in awe. That is quite a feat of brainwashing. The difference between several thousand (under Bush) and Stalin's 30 million or so (probably on the low side) is simply erased in their education by storytelling. It's time to change the storytellers in American education, or at least the stories. Michael What about 60,000 under JFK and LBJ. The Vietnam war was an ugly thing. It lasted ten years which is a record for wars in which America participates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 1 hour ago, BaalChatzaf said: What about 60,000 under JFK and LBJ. The Vietnam war was an ugly thing. It lasted ten years which is a record for wars in which America participates. 2 million dead and 6.5 million refugees, I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 2, 2017 Share Posted January 2, 2017 Could be closer to 4 million plus the Cambodian genocide of 3 million. 1.1 million NVA soldiers to start with. Maybe 2 million civilians. Then allied forces, mostly Vietnamese. --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 On 1/1/2017 at 8:15 AM, Brant Gaede said: Why? It's estimated 70 million died in WWII. Does that too strike you as an exaggeration? --Brant No... they're not Jews. You count different for Jews. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 On 12/2/2016 at 9:49 AM, mpp said: However, what if I am literally starving? How can you argue then that stealing is wrong according to the moral standard of self interest? If I'm starving, stealing is in my self-interest and wouldn't it then have to be morally right? Thank you. "I have been young and now I am old, Yet I have not seen those in right standing with God abandoned Or his descendants pleading for bread." Psalms 37:25 I've also been young and am now old... and I've never seen a decent person beg for food in America. However, I've seen plenty of indecent people begging. They're the ones who f**ked up their own lives with dope and alcohol and poisoned their relationships with everyone who was close to them. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 hours ago, moralist said: No... they're not Jews. You count different for Jews. Greg Includes 6 million Jews. --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 hours ago, moralist said: "I have been young and now I am old, Yet I have not seen those in right standing with God abandoned Or his descendants pleading for bread." Psalms 37:25 I've also been young and am now old... and I've never seen a decent person beg for food in America. However, I've seen plenty of indecent people begging. They're the ones who f**ked up their own lives with dope and alcohol and poisoned their relationships with everyone who was close to them. Greg How did you know they weren't decent? --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 hours ago, moralist said: No... they're not Jews. You count different for Jews. Greg Greg, one can imagine some Jews responding to this: "Thanks, but no thanks!" Being singled out with special attention for their (general) culture of exceptionalism comes in two forms, one very bad as you know. On balance between a collective prejudice or praise, I think many Jews would rather do without either. Of course that explains more about the grey, egalitarian 'morality' of the time, than it does about the individuals themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 hours ago, anthony said: Greg, one can imagine some Jews responding to this: "Thanks, but no thanks!" Being singled out with special attention for their (general) culture of exceptionalism comes in two forms, one very bad as you know. On balance between a collective prejudice or praise, I think many Jews would rather do without either. Of course that explains more about the grey, egalitarian 'morality' of the time, than it does about the individuals themselves. Hey Tony, it was just a joke. Antisemites count different when it's Jews. I'm a Judeophile. I built my businesses on honoring God's chosen people by serving them. Whoever blesses the Jews will be blessed... and whoever curses the Jews will be cursed. I am blessed. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 3 hours ago, Brant Gaede said: How did you know they weren't decent? --Brant Because they're begging in America even while being surrounded by unlimited opportunity. American Capitalism only works for decent ethical people. The indecent are failures at it because they lack the necessary moral character. It takes deliberate consistant stubborn obstinate self destruction of a life to end up with nothing in America today. You have to willfully betray your own Conscience as well as betray the trust of everyone around you to pull off that ultimate act of narcissistic stupidity. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 6 hours ago, moralist said: Because they're begging in America even while being surrounded by unlimited opportunity. American Capitalism only works for decent ethical people. The indecent are failures at it because they lack the necessary moral character. Greg Circular. You stated you never saw a beggar who . . . . This implies a vast amount of data. You are all chief with no Indians. It's an example of pure ideological reasoning with everything being confirmation bias. There's a beggar therefore the beggar is X. Your statement needs several years of social work or the like. All you do is drive-bys. --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 2 hours ago, Brant Gaede said: Circular. You stated you never saw a beggar who . . . . This implies a vast amount of data. You are all chief with no Indians. It's an example of pure ideological reasoning with everything being confirmation bias. There's a beggar therefore the beggar is X. Your statement needs several years of social work or the like. All you do is drive-bys. --Brant Brant, It's ok for each of us to have two different views. And I'm totally fine with our differences, because I live with the results of my own just as you do with yours. You have your liberal government's collectivist view that a lack of good character or virtue has nothing to do with failure in America, and that people are not personally responsible for their own lives... ...while I have the sovereign individual American view that people are totally responsible for sabotaging their own lives with their own lack of character, and that decency and morality have everything to do with a successful productive meaningful and happy life. The wisdom concerning numan nature found in the Bible is far older than either of us and of a far larger sampling than a mere lifetime. My own personal experience just happens to confirm its truth. (...and by the way I do volunteer social work) Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 On 2017/01/03 at 8:37 AM, moralist said: Antisemites count different when it's Jews. I'm a Judeophile. Greg As in, it is very hard for some to say the words " um [choke] er, six [choke] million" -- but "two point eight million" (for example) is presentably okay? As if there is a conceptual and moral difference between two sets of numbers. Yeah, I see what you mean, this is their subjectivity. Does insistently citing a lesser number, lower their guilt, or something? Or does it confirm the prejudice that Jews are deceitful conspiracists? But who has demanded of anyone - not personally involved in the mass murders - to feel "guilty"?! There can't be more than a handful of individuals alive who were directly involved, and to everyone else this would be superfluous, unearned guilt. I think in the minds of antisemites the real, unmentioned guilt lies a bit deeper, and that they deserve. The primary object of not forgetting "Six million" is in every generation pronouncing "never again!" should systematic slaughter happen, to any people of any race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 On 1/1/2017 at 7:32 PM, wolfdevoon said: 2 million dead and 6.5 million refugees, I believe. Collateral Damage. During modern wars many non-combatants are killed. That includes women and children. The Vietnam war was unnecessary, but even in necessary wars innocent people are killed in large numbers. U.S. bombing raids against Japan killed something like a half million non-combatants. The U.S. had no alternative but to fight against Japan which started the war. If the U.S. had invaded Japan 5 to 10 million Japanese would have been killed. There is a moral or a lesson here. Do not engage in unnecessary wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 On 1/3/2017 at 0:46 AM, moralist said: American Capitalism only works for decent ethical people. The indecent are failures at it because they lack the necessary moral character. It takes deliberate consistant stubborn obstinate self destruction of a life to end up with nothing in America today. You have to willfully betray your own Conscience as well as betray the trust of everyone around you to pull off that ultimate act of narcissistic stupidity. Huh. That explains everything. I've been deliberately consistent, stubbornly obstinate, self destructive in an ultimate act of narcissistic stupidity. https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/4079058.Wolf_DeVoon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 1 hour ago, wolfdevoon said: Huh. That explains everything. I've been deliberately consistent, stubbornly obstinate, self destructive in an ultimate act of narcissistic stupidity. https://www.goodreads.com/author/show/4079058.Wolf_DeVoon Come on, Wolf... you're not begging for bread. Just an off topic thought... secondary income can be obtained from selling novels as screenplays for movies. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now