Brant Gaede Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I farted once in a bar and cleared out the entire pool table area how's that for blow torching !?You're lucky no one lit a match.--BrantI think we should only meet on the Internet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDS Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 This thread is a mistake. What's the point of blow-torching someone's ass? Soon we'll be five men and one woman talking to each other with few others reading it.--Brantmight be that way alreadyAgreed. Not sure what the point is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 "Not sure what the point is here."The sense of life of an art critic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 I didn't join the discussion to discuss your understanding of Kant with you, but only to confirm my suspicions that you hadn't been formally educated on Kant -- that you hadn't had the opportunity to receive expert feedback from professors whose views of Kant haven't been tainted by Objectivist misinterpretations. Despite your pompous declaration to the contrary, there is more than one route to understanding Kant. Not all genuine learning occurs in a classroom.I agree (well, not about the pompous part). In fact, I sometimes ask others if their professor was a Marxist, because the formal classroom that they studied in seemed to have tainted their understanding with a lump of Marxist distortion. I'm not "declaring" that any one route to understanding is superior to any other. I'm just being something of a Henry Higgins or a Sturmbannführer Hellstrom and detecting the nuances of philosophical accents and what they reveal.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 "Not sure what the point is here."The sense of life of an art critic?Be careful, Mikee. You're on the verge of committing an Objectivist sin. You had better familiarize yourself with Rand's comments on your inability to know others' senses of life, and her condemnation of the act of attempting to do so as psychologizing.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Gee Jonathan, does the fact that someone has a functioning sense of self esteem somehow offend you? Or is it just something people should aspire to but not actually achieve? Self esteem is a functioning ongoing evaluation of one's self worth and efficacy, a combination of thought and emotion. It's not whether one has any, but how much one has. It's an interesting question if one can have too much self esteem especially as its measurement is subjective. In my experience, however, it's not for display as such. How does one do that?--BrantFor a high functioning person who is highly motivated to do things, to act rather than talk, the "display" if you want to call it that, serves the purpose of finding like minded similarly motivated people to network with for mutual benefit. Others, who might choose to be offended, simply don't matter. There is a benign purpose with good intention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 This thread is a mistake. What's the point of blow-torching someone's ass? Soon we'll be five men and one woman talking to each other with few others reading it.--Brantmight be that way alreadyAgreed. Not sure what the point is here.The point was to share a laugh over the massive overreach and unreality of Objectivish hubris. Remember that humor is "the denial of metaphysical importance to that which you laugh at." It's a "snooty, very well dressed dowager walking down the street, and then she slips on a banana peel." What's funny about it is "the contrast of the woman’s pretensions to reality."See, it's an Objectivist virtue. Why are people upset about it?You all seem to be saying that I should feel sorry for the lady, not laugh at her, show her some kindness despite her snootiness, and help her up. Does that apply to all snooty dowagers, or only to Objectivist snooty dowagers?J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 "Not sure what the point is here."The sense of life of an art critic?Be careful, Mikee. You're on the verge of committing an Objectivist sin. You had better familiarize yourself with Rand's comments on your inability to know others' senses of life, and her condemnation of the act of attempting to do so as psychologizing.JFuck you, you pompous prick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Fuck you, you pompous prick.Wow. Creepy. You seem to be more upset about my laughing at Dean than he is. It's almost as if you have a crush on him.I wonder if you get the humor of your being angry at my "pompousness" while professing your adoration for Dean's pompousness? Do you see the funny contradiction there?J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 What's next? "Gimme your lunch money punk!". Tell me your purpose for your diatribes against Dean. Don't tell me "it's for the children"... You're just looking out for all the rubes on OL, in case they might get taken in by someone not you? Or you simply have the personality of a bully? Be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDS Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I propose a truce:How about we let Dean stand or fall on his own terms, on OL, not because of anything he's done or said on past forums. If he is the dickweed J seems to think, then there will be plenty of chances to dance in real time. Admittedly, I happily was never a part of any Objectivish forum besides this one, so the resurrection of past grievances seems oddly out of context and trivial. Besides, even were that not the case, Dean looks like a young man in the photo from his RofR days. He may well have grown a bit since those Glory Days. Hell, he's gotten married and everything!If MSK can give him the benefit of the doubt, why shouldn't others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 What's next? "Gimme your lunch money punk!". Tell me your purpose for your diatribes against Dean.What's the purpose of your diatribes against me? Why are you so upset about my rational, measured confidence but admiring of Dean's irrational, overblown confidence? Why do you condemn me for having the confidence to be right while you praise Dean for having the overconfidence to be wrong?Don't tell me "it's for the children"... You're just looking out for all the rubes on OL, in case they might get taken in by someone not you? Or you simply have the personality of a bully? Be honest.How can you call me a bully when I'm practicing a mere fraction of the attitude that you claim to adore in Dean?J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 I propose a truce:How about we let Dean stand or fall on his own terms, on OL, not because of anything he's done or said on past forums. Keep in mind that this thread was started prior to Dean's showing up here. It wasn't a reaction to his joining, but a random bit of comedic value that I happened across and wanted to share prior to my having any inkling that he might join.What I like about this thread, and how it's evolved, is that it seems quite clear that there are significant problems with the Objectivist concepts of humor, self-esteem, etc. It appears that theses virtues are seen by Objectivists as virtuous only when on paper, but as very nasty vices in reality. And throw in a heaping helping of double standards on top of that. It's not exactly what would be called "objective" or "rational."J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDS Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I propose a truce:How about we let Dean stand or fall on his own terms, on OL, not because of anything he's done or said on past forums. Keep in mind that this thread was started prior to Dean's showing up here. It wasn't a reaction to his joining, but a random bit of comedic value that I happened across and wanted to share prior to my having any inkling that he might join.What I like about this thread, and how it's evolved, is that it seems quite clear that there are significant problems with the Objectivist concepts of humor, self-esteem, etc. It appears that theses virtues are seen by Objectivists as virtuous only when on paper, but as very nasty vices in reality. And throw in a heaping helping of double standards on top of that. It's not exactly what would be called "objective" or "rational."JI know the thread started before he got here. My guess is that he got here because the thread started, but that is just a hunch.I think you are over-sciencing things. Some--perhaps many--of us don't have a dog in the fight from past flame wars from other websites. I consider it fortunate indeed that there was no internet around when I was the age Dean seems to be, therefore, there is no written/forever record of my particular horses-assery at that stage of my life. But I would like to think I grew up a little bit. I would like to think that Dean, like other healthy human beings, may have too, and we will all have a chance to see if that is the case if you don't run him off. You are pulling the cake out of the oven before you've given it a chance to bake This isn't our kitchen.** This comes across as unfair, and really has nothing to do with Objectivist concepts of humor, self-esteem, etc. **Learning the art of mixed metaphors from Brant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanwins Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Communicating by text cuts out a huge swath of visual and audio information. Unresolved annoyances tend to linger and we assume the worst possible interpretation of other's messages. How frequently do we high five because of our synergy in life compared to how often do we criticize each other's mistakes?And unfortunately here we don't ever see what others are doing in real life... so the high fives for such synergies are empty... unless we actually take the time to get to know each other.Thanks for the defense guys. For now I don't really know what to make out of Jonathan. One thing he does do is give me the desire to put actions behind my words, for example in this case of how I claim that I have figured out the mysteries of the universe.I am sloppy at times, and I put my thoughts out on the net sometimes even when I know its going to look bad on me. I do make mistakes. My ego is high... I am much more successful and capable in argument than most I encounter in real life. Then I come here and I'm used to my conversation partners not being able to compare to me, and our egos clash. We figure it out over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 I consider it fortunate indeed that there was no internet around when I was the age Dean seems to be, therefore, there is no written/forever record of my particular horses-assery at that stage of my life. But I would like to think I grew up a little bit. I would like to think that Dean, like other healthy human beings, may have too, and we will all have a chance to see if that is the case if you don't run him off. What would you consider evidence of having grown up versus not? If some of your youthful horses-assery were posted today, would the grownup thing be to laugh and say, "Yeah, that's horses-assery alright," or would the grownup thing be to double down?J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Thanks for the defense guys. For now I don't really know what to make out of Jonathan. One thing he does do is give me the desire to put actions behind my words, for example in this case of how I claim that I have figured out the mysteries of the universe.Awesome! Please do put actions behind your words. Please practice the Objectivist virtue of proving your claims about solving the mysteries of the universe.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDS Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I consider it fortunate indeed that there was no internet around when I was the age Dean seems to be, therefore, there is no written/forever record of my particular horses-assery at that stage of my life. But I would like to think I grew up a little bit. I would like to think that Dean, like other healthy human beings, may have too, and we will all have a chance to see if that is the case if you don't run him off.What would you consider evidence of having grown up versus not? If some of your youthful horses-assery were posted today, would the grownup thing be to laugh and say, "Yeah, that's horses-assery alright," or would the grownup thing be to double down?JThe "doubling down" is, I think, what myself and others are missing here. You seem to think there has been and will be more horses' assery afoot. I actually find such behavior highly entertaining, which is one reason I still miss a certain fellow named Phil, and why I also hope you don't snuff any out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PDS Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Oops. Just caught the solving the mysteries of the universe comment. I'm looking forward to this too!**Any solutions that have the word "quantum" in them will be rejected out of hand, by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I didn't join the discussion to discuss your understanding of Kant with you, but only to confirm my suspicions that you hadn't been formally educated on Kant -- that you hadn't had the opportunity to receive expert feedback from professors whose views of Kant haven't been tainted by Objectivist misinterpretations. Despite your pompous declaration to the contrary, there is more than one route to understanding Kant. Not all genuine learning occurs in a classroom.How much formal education in Kant does Jonathan have?Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 How much formal education in Kant does Jonathan have?EllenNone.I've had the opportunity to get a lot of expert feedback outside of the classroom (just by happening to know someone personally), but I wouldn't consider that "formal education in Kant."J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I know the thread started before he got here. My guess is that he got here because the thread started, but that is just a hunch.That's my guess, too.[...] if you don't run him off.I think that Dean's made of sturdier stuff than to be driven off by Jonathan's barking at his heels.I actually find [horses' assery] highly entertaining, which is one reason I still miss a certain fellow named Phil, and why I also hope you don't snuff any out!How anyone could miss Phil is beyond me!Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 How much formal education in Kant does Jonathan have?EllenNone.I've had the opportunity to get a lot of expert feedback outside of the classroom (just by happening to know someone personally), but I wouldn't consider that "formal education in Kant."JThen why should Merlin have had formal education in Kant before he's qualified to make assessments of Kant's philosophy? Unless you're disqualifying yourself, because you lack formal education in Kant, as well as Merlin, from being qualified.Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 I think that Dean's made of sturdier stuff than to be driven off by Jonathan's barking at his heels.I would hope so. I think it would be fabulous if online Objectivists would learn to quit being overly sensitive wuss-victims who need to be protected by moderators. Quit crying and grow a pair of balls like what Ayn had!J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 How anyone could miss Phil is beyond me!Ellen,Sometimes at that moment when I have not fully regained consciousness after a nightmare, I find myself missin...Er...Nah...Good God! What the hell am I doing?Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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