Rand through a Nietzsche filter

[Ellen Stuttle]

Darren knows better than to argue for Intelligent Design, so it could not be darren you are theorizing about.

The hell he "knows better." See this very long SOLO thread on which Darren argued for Intelligent Design lengthily and repeatedly, including some arguments of his own origination along with the standard ones:

Rand and Darwin - Conflict or Not?

Ellen

[Ellen Stuttle]

ALERT to Angela:

You forgot to close the italics code on this SOLO post, with the result that the whole thread below your post is now in italics.

Forgetting to close code is a big peeve of Linz's. Plus, you're ignoring the "user photo" rule. You're inviting getting bonked, especially considering that he seems to be in a bonking and thread-deleting mood.

Ellen

EDIT: The code's been closed, whether by Angela or by someone with administrator powers.

Edited February 24, 2012 by Ellen Stuttle

[Ellen Stuttle]

I see Darren has got the heave from Solo. I tried to look at his profile there to see if he is the same as the exOL poster above mentioned, but you can't click on him, it is just "darren not verified". Has he been nonpersonned? At least over here the grisly corpses remain on display as evidence.

At the moment, "Track" screens aren't showing for any posters on SOLO.

I hope the "track" feature (such as it is, not a good one) is just being revamped and hasn't been disabled permanently.

Ellen

[caroljane]

I see Darren has got the heave from Solo. I tried to look at his profile there to see if he is the same as the exOL poster above mentioned, but you can't click on him, it is just "darren not verified". Has he been nonpersonned? At least over here the grisly corpses remain on display as evidence.

At the moment, "Track" screens aren't showing for any posters on SOLO.

I hope the "track" feature (such as it is, not a good one) is just being revamped and hasn't been disabled permanently.

Ellen

Let us hope that Epistemological Cleansing of the premises is not taking place.

[Selene]

I see Darren has got the heave from Solo. I tried to look at his profile there to see if he is the same as the exOL poster above mentioned, but you can't click on him, it is just "darren not verified". Has he been nonpersonned? At least over here the grisly corpses remain on display as evidence.

At the moment, "Track" screens aren't showing for any posters on SOLO.

I hope the "track" feature (such as it is, not a good one) is just being revamped and hasn't been disabled permanently.

Ellen

Let us hope that Epistemological Cleansing of the premises is not taking place.

Interesting...

A virtual Killing Fields...

maybe a 3D movie?

Starring "Fatty" Arbuckle as Lindsay?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roscoe_Arbuckle

Amazing story about his trials for rape and manslaughter over a wild party in a hotel in 1921.

Maybe we could have that world renowned expert on hotel rooms, women and rape do the screen play! Paging Dr. Rapist...Yo Dr. Peikoff!

Adam

[Xray]

ALERT to Angela:

You forgot to close the italics code on this SOLO post, with the result that the whole thread below your post is now in italics.

Forgetting to close code is a big peeve of Linz's. Plus, you're ignoring the "user photo" rule. You're inviting getting bonked, especially considering that he seems to be in a bonking and thread-deleting mood.

Ellen

EDIT: The code's been closed, whether by Angela or by someone with administrator powers.

Ellen,

I just came over from SOLO and read your post.

I don't know about any 'code' (computer unsavvy that I am), but in case I forgot to close any italics, this is of course possible. I'll check it out.

[Xray]

ALERT to Angela:

You forgot to close the italics code on this SOLO post, with the result that the whole thread below your post is now in italics.

Forgetting to close code is a big peeve of Linz's. Plus, you're ignoring the "user photo" rule. You're inviting getting bonked, especially considering that he seems to be in a bonking and thread-deleting mood.

Ellen

EDIT: The code's been closed, whether by Angela or by someone with administrator powers.

Ellen,

I just came over from SOLO and read your post.

I don't know about any 'code' (computer unsavvy that I am), but in case I forgot to close any italics, this is of course possible. I'll check it out.

Ellen:

I checked out the post you linked to, and it looks like there is no problem. The italics are closed as far as I can see. I suppose I was in the process of editing my SOLO post while you were writing your post here.

[seymourblogger]

Darren knows better than to argue for Intelligent Design, so it could not be darren you are theorizing about.

The hell he "knows better." See this very long SOLO thread on which Darren argued for Intelligent Design lengthily and repeatedly, including some arguments of his own origination along with the standard ones:

Rand and Darwin - Conflict or Not?

Ellen

I still think not darren from your link. Not his writing style at all. Not the way he thinks at all. I could be wrong though. He might have been trying to fit into the Discourse here.

[Xray]

I think Darren is the same poster who posted here for awhile uder the screen name AristotlesAdvance arguing for Intelligent Design (and soon being limited to 5 posts a day).

Darren knows better than to argue for Intelligent Design, so it could not be darren you are theorizing about.

Janet,

Darren IS arguing for Intelligent Design. Nearly all of his posts convey this 'message'.

[caroljane]

I think Darren is the same poster who posted here for awhile uder the screen name AristotlesAdvance arguing for Intelligent Design (and soon being limited to 5 posts a day).

Darren knows better than to argue for Intelligent Design, so it could not be darren you are theorizing about.

Janet,

Darren IS arguing for Intelligent Design. Nearly all of his posts convey this 'message'.

This would be easy to resolve if we knew the real name of the poster on Solo, as we do the one on OL.

[seymourblogger]

I think Darren is the same poster who posted here for awhile uder the screen name AristotlesAdvance arguing for Intelligent Design (and soon being limited to 5 posts a day).

Darren knows better than to argue for Intelligent Design, so it could not be darren you are theorizing about.

Janet,

Darren IS arguing for Intelligent Design. Nearly all of his posts convey this 'message'.

This would be easy to resolve if we knew the real name of the poster on Solo, as we do the one on OL.

Why would you even care?

[caroljane]

Why wouldn't we? We like to know who we are talking to.

[Ellen Stuttle]

This would be easy to resolve if we knew the real name of the poster on Solo, as we do the one on OL.

Both "Darren" on SOLO and "AristotlesAdvance" on OL indisputably argue for Intelligent Design. I'll document re "Darren" in the next post.

The OL poster with the screen name "AristotlesAdvance" gives as his full name "Aristotle Economides." Have you ever heard of anyone with such a last name? It sounds made up to me. I suspect it's a reference to Darren's profession. If I remember correctly, Darren said on his SOLO user profile that he's a financial analyst. He gave "Darren Wrede" as the full name, a name which rings real. The photo might even be a real photo of the poster, but if Darren indeed was an usher at Peikoff's 1976 course, as he's claimed somewhere in his SOLO posts to have been, then the photo -- which is of a young man -- has to be numerous years out of date.

Ellen

[Ellen Stuttle]

[....] See this very long SOLO thread on which Darren argued for Intelligent Design lengthily and repeatedly, including some arguments of his own origination along with the standard ones:

Rand and Darwin - Conflict or Not?

Ellen

I still think not darren from your link. Not his writing style at all. Not the way he thinks at all. I could be wrong though. He might have been trying to fit into the Discourse here.

Possibly what you're referring to is the opening post of the thread. That's by Doug Bandler, not Darren.

The thread has close to 800 posts and gets into multiple evolution-related issues. If you're viewing in reverse-date order (i.e., most recent post first) and using the default 90 posts/per page, then Darren's appearance in the thread -- and on SOLO -- is on page 8. Page 6 is where he gets started on his ID thesis.

Following are excerpts which trace how Darren developed his reasoning. He then continued with posts presenting the same fallacious mathematical arguments used by "AristotlesAdvance" here on OL, along with lots of posts pertaining to codes.

The linking situation on SOLO is tricky, since links to posts past the first page won't work unless a page number is included, and page numbers change as more posts are added. The links I've given -- all to posts on the current page 6 -- are working now. If the thread is reactivated at some point, searching manually for the post number might become necessary.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96622

Being extremely reasonable and good-natured myself, I am more than amenable to a Grand Theory of Evolution in which the end-goal is pre-existing, or in which Big Natural Selection has been instructed, in advance, as to what sorts of biological traits are to be deemed "desirable" and therefore "fit", in order to reach a pre-existing goal, and which traits are to be discarded. All you need to do is assume a Big Coder in the Sky: someone who is the analogue in physical nature to Richard Dawkins himself when he's in front of his computer.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96715

The Big Coder (necessitated by Dawkins's own assumptions in his computer simulation) Always Was And Always Will Be.

The fact that I posit an intelligent first cause as opposed to an inert one in no way changes the logic of the reply.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96720

[...] if you assume that existence doesn't require creation, then there's no problem positing an Intelligent First Cause whose existence always was. The reason one posits an Intelligent First Cause is to explain the existence of a system of coded-chemistry, which obviously cannot emerge -- spontaneously or incrementally -- from non-intelligent causes. Codes are always tell-tale products of intelligence, goal-directedness, and teleology.

[....]  "Codes" come from "Coders." They never "emerge" -- not spontaneously, not incrementally.

[....]

We're substituting a known cause -- intelligence -- for unknown causes, in order to explain a known effect: coded-chemistry in biological organisms.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96732

Given the time constraints imposed by the age of the universe (approximately 12-15 billion years), the start of life is a mathematically impossible event.

[....]

An impossible event for chance requires intelligence to explain it. God? As far as my replies to Leonid go, I only mentioned a "Big Coder in the Sky." Could be intelligent martians.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96735

[...] biological coded-chemistry is isomorphic with all other known codes such as ASCII and Morse Code; and since we know that codes cannot arise from chance, necessity, or any combination thereof, that leaves only intelligence as a cause.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96750

[Asked "why one needs to postulate creator"]: To account for things that could not have come into existence through random combinations of pre-existing material entities, or by means of necessary, deterministic forces; i.e., codes.

[Asked "why your first cause has to be intelligent]:  Because of the existence of codes, which are always the product of intelligence. In the case of human life, of course, I'm perfectly willing to consider that biological coded-chemistry was designed by intelligent martians or venusians.

http://www.solopassion.com/node/8268?page=5#comment-96756

The "secret of life" is not "super-complicated chemical interactions." Most of life's chemistry is fairly straightforward. What makes life special (and interesting) is the existence of a system of coded chemistry, with cellular apparatus that encode and decode strings of simple chemicals that function in an organism exactly like binary mathematical symbols in a computer algorithm, or like alphabetic symbols within a system of a written language. [....] The "code" part of the "genetic code" resides in the arbitrary, optional, non-determined order, or sequence of base molecules.

This arbitrary, or optional, aspect of symbol-sequence is one of the typical features of true codes -- like Morse Code, for example. [....]

[Coded] y whom? We don't know. I call him The Big Coder in the Sky, though Leonid took offense that I assumed He lives above ground-level.

[9thdoctor]

That Objectivist Liar and Hater Lindsay Perigo would get all wound up over this dude "plagiarizing" a quip is a hoot.

“[D]o you believe your consciousness will survive the death of your brain (I confess to finding the evidence that this has already occurred quite strong)?”

So Jabba booted this guy for repeating back at him a putdown that Jabba had just used? On the grounds that he didn’t give attribution? If you say to me “Yo mama”, and I reply “nah, yo mama”, that’s plagiarism? Jeez.

Either way, this Darren guy’s clearly a complete asshole. What’s worse, he obviously has a lot of time on his hands, and a taste for sneering at Objectivism from the anonymous safety of the internet. He’ll find a new home soon enough, hopefully not here. Come to think of it, there are a few tedious/obnoxious religious types on OO, I wonder if he’s one of them too.

[caroljane]

This would be easy to resolve if we knew the real name of the poster on Solo, as we do the one on OL.

Both "Darren" on SOLO and "AristotlesAdvance" on OL indisputably argue for Intelligent Design. I'll document re "Darren" in the next post.

The OL poster with the screen name "AristotlesAdvance" gives as his full name "Aristotle Economides." Have you ever heard of anyone with such a last name? It sounds made up to me. I suspect it's a reference to Darren's profession. If I remember correctly, Darren said on his SOLO user profile that he's a financial analyst. He gave "Darren Wrede" as the full name, a name which rings real. The photo might even be a real photo of the poster, but if Darren indeed was an usher at Peikoff's 1976 course, as he's claimed somewhere in his SOLO posts to have been, then the photo -- which is of a young man -- has to be numerous years out of date.

Ellen

This would be easy to resolve if we knew the real name of the poster on Solo, as we do the one on OL.

Both "Darren" on SOLO and "AristotlesAdvance" on OL indisputably argue for Intelligent Design. I'll document re "Darren" in the next post.

The OL poster with the screen name "AristotlesAdvance" gives as his full name "Aristotle Economides." Have you ever heard of anyone with such a last name? It sounds made up to me. I suspect it's a reference to Darren's profession. If I remember correctly, Darren said on his SOLO user profile that he's a financial analyst. He gave "Darren Wrede" as the full name, a name which rings real. The photo might even be a real photo of the poster, but if Darren indeed was an usher at Peikoff's 1976 course, as he's claimed somewhere in his SOLO posts to have been, then the photo -- which is of a young man -- has to be numerous years out of date.

Ellen

Ellen, this is so funny. Where I live Greek names are a norm ("My Big Fat Greek Wedding" was filmed nearby) and I did not give his stated real name here a second thought,

but I did wonder why a Greek guy would call himself "Darren" on Solo!

[Selene]

but I did wonder why a Greek guy would call himself "Darren" on Solo!

He must have backed into it...

[Ellen Stuttle]

That Objectivist Liar and Hater Lindsay Perigo would get all wound up over this dude "plagiarizing" a quip is a hoot.

“[D]o you believe your consciousness will survive the death of your brain (I confess to finding the evidence that this has already occurred quite strong)?”

So Jabba booted this guy for repeating back at him a putdown that Jabba had just used? On the grounds that he didn’t give attribution? If you say to me “Yo mama”, and I reply “nah, yo mama”, that’s plagiarism? Jeez.

That's just the precipitating straw culminating a long history. Plus, I suspect that Linz is in a generally worked-up mood because of anger at what persons he once considered friends are saying on the multiple active threads about the coming US presidential election.

Either way, this Darren guy's clearly a complete asshole.

I don't agree that he's an "asshole." A provocateur. Very smart, prodigiously well-read, and with an eye for genuine problem areas. A shame, imo, he doesn't write up his critiques in essay form instead of employing his talents irritating posters on web lists. I guess he does his schtick just for amusement.

Ellen

[caroljane]

That's just the precipitating straw culminating a long history. Plus, I suspect that Linz is in a generally worked-up mood because of anger at what persons he once considered friends are saying on the multiple active threads about the coming US presidential election.

Ellen

Ellen,

Could you clarify this for me? I do not read the political threads there, though I know LP writes "international Op-Eds" but I assumed his focus was NZ politics, why would he get worked up over the US election?

[seymourblogger]

That Objectivist Liar and Hater Lindsay Perigo would get all wound up over this dude "plagiarizing" a quip is a hoot.

"[D]o you believe your consciousness will survive the death of your brain (I confess to finding the evidence that this has already occurred quite strong)?"

So Jabba booted this guy for repeating back at him a putdown that Jabba had just used? On the grounds that he didn't give attribution? If you say to me "Yo mama", and I reply "nah, yo mama", that's plagiarism? Jeez.

That's just the precipitating straw culminating a long history. Plus, I suspect that Linz is in a generally worked-up mood because of anger at what persons he once considered friends are saying on the multiple active threads about the coming US presidential election.

Either way, this Darren guy's clearly a complete asshole.

I don't agree that he's an "asshole." A provocateur. Very smart, prodigiously well-read, and with an eye for genuine problem areas. A shame, imo, he doesn't write up his critiques in essay form instead of employing his talents irritating posters on web lists. I guess he does his schtick just for amusement.

Ellen

darren doesn't irritate me. Definitely NOT an asshole. Maybe it's just that most of the rest are wondering how many angels can daunce on the head of a pin.

[Ellen Stuttle]

Could you clarify this for me? I do not read the political threads there, though I know LP writes "international Op-Eds" but I assumed his focus was NZ politics, why would he get worked up over the US election?

Oh......something like the fate of the world depending on it?

Honestly, the question leaves me feeling, Where to begin? I guess you don't know much about the long, long history of Linz having extremely strong views on world politics and on what the US ought to do and on the importance of the US doing what he thinks the US ought to do (if only we'd all listen to him, what a wonderful world it would be, that sort of self-assessed significance placed on his own views). Plus he has this thing about "loyalty." Being disagreed with about politics by persons he considers -- or formerly considered -- friends gets him, if anything, even more worked up into a rage than being challenged on aesthetics.

Ellen

[caroljane]

Could you clarify this for me? I do not read the political threads there, though I know LP writes "international Op-Eds" but I assumed his focus was NZ politics, why would he get worked up over the US election?

Oh......something like the fate of the world depending on it?

Honestly, the question leaves me feeling, Where to begin? I guess you don't know much about the long, long history of Linz having extremely strong views on world politics and on what the US ought to do and on the importance of the US doing what he thinks the US ought to do (if only we'd all listen to him, what a wonderful world it would be, that sort of self-assessed significance placed on his own views). Plus he has this thing about "loyalty." Being disagreed with about politics by persons he considers -- or formerly considered -- friends gets him, if anything, even more worked up into a rage than being challenged on aesthetics.

Ellen

Good grief. I have read some of his aesthetics stuff and it was so overwrought, at first I thought it was parody. If the politics are worse i will just keep avoiding.

[Selene]

They actually sound really perceptive if you drink a fifth quart of Jack Daniels...[upward correction based on Canadian alcohol consumption study]

[caroljane]

They actually sound really perceptive if you drink a fifth of Jack Daniels...

I tried it and they do not seem any more perceptive A fifth of a a 500 ml bottle induces a pleasant buzz when you have disguised the taste, though.

[Selene]

* see corrected post # 523 above...