St. Louis riots and looting

[Wolf DeVoon]

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Check this one out from TheBlaze:

See Who’s Been Spotted in Ferguson Trying to ‘Incite’ Riots and Mingling Among Group Armed With Molotov Cocktails

I'll give you a hint.

These good folks work as radicals for economic system antithetical to capitalism.

Michael

[Gary Fisher]

This is going to turn into a PR disaster on the international stage if not dealt with quickly. Hopefully our boys on the ground will be able to suppress any further violence against innocent people from these "peaceful protestors".

[Extropy]

http://youtu.be/5f3MWSvWrdg

[Jules Troy]

And now..some advice for our would be looters.

[Extropy]

there is something deeply wrong as well as disturbing in the fact that the last video is so funny

[Extropy]

The USA strikes me...as a very controlled society... blacks are patiently waiting for an opportunity to demand something more from society...

I'm not a scholar on race, and most of the published work is garbage. Anecdotally, based on personal experience with black Americans in prison, sharing their private homes as a house guest, working together legally and otherwise, using my eyes and ears on the street, I'd say that there is a deep-seated, incurable resentment among U.S. blacks of my generation that prosperity cannot fix. Resentment is tolerated and amplified by political, institutional and corporate policies that give the unearned and steadfastly denies their mental handicaps.

I am very frustrated at the fact that most published work on (the practical implications of) human genetics is garbage. If most people can agree there is a very real biological difference between a Mbutu Pigmy (or Khoi San) and an Ethiopian*, Turk or Korean, then how can we deny that there must be some subtle difference among the latter three very related races?

I have not grown up either around people of West African ancestry, or in a society that even has them in a representative number, so I ask you with extreme candice: what have you perceived as mental handicaps? This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely intrigued as I've heard people from all walks of life (from bleeding hearts to scientists, i'll leave out the outright racists) making or suggesting timidly the same point.

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

*I compare Mbutu Pygmies or Khoi Sans with Ethiopians deliberately as I already know that Africans are more diverse genetically than any other group on Earth, and those groups are extremely distant genetically.

[Jules Troy]

there is something deeply wrong as well as disturbing in the fact that the last video is so funny

[Jules Troy]

Bwua hahaha!

[Peter]

Extropy wrote about racial differences:

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

end quote

Airport and store security must profile based on probabilities and observed actions. A Stewardess may think the jerk in first class has a drinkers nose and refuse to give him free drinks. Alcohol sometimes appears to lower a persons brain power.

A cop must act upon the limited data he sees and the knowledge he has mentally stored. He needs to be aware of the neighborhood. That linked Chris Rock video someone clearly exposes IQ's in a racial fashion.

The truth is moral, but statistical averages do not pertain to the people you may meet. Assigning individuals differences (even if kept to yourself) based on statistics is a bit like name calling. Anonymous social media can be annoying even if truthful. Kids, teenagers, and the uninhibited like to blurt out hurtful comments and that is irresponsible.

Yet there are times that IQ and other attributes need to be known. "Special needs" teachers must know the abilities and natures of their students. The knowledge learned by students in my state is tested several times and culminates in the SATs. California once gave every student an IQ test but I dont know if that state still does except in the instance of obvious special needs. The Deans List is published but I think it would be callous to publish a list of stupid people.

Of course, as individuals we constantly make judgments about others. We usually keep it to ourselves, but it is hard even as an adult to not stare and wonder about a Mongoloid or retarded person. I was behind a woman at Walmart who had three girls with her and one of them was retarded. Every few seconds she would screech out a word and that was very annoying, but I tactfully did not ask the mother any questions.

[Extropy]

Extropy wrote about racial differences:

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

end quote

Airport and store security must profile based on probabilities and observed actions. A Stewardess may think the jerk in first class has a drinkers nose and refuse to give him free drinks. Alcohol sometimes appears to lower a persons brain power.

A cop must act upon the limited data he sees and the knowledge he has mentally stored. He needs to be aware of the neighborhood. That linked Chris Rock video someone clearly exposes IQ's in a racial fashion.

The truth is moral, but statistical averages do not pertain to the people you may meet. Assigning individuals differences (even if kept to yourself) based on statistics is a bit like name calling. Anonymous social media can be annoying even if truthful. Kids, teenagers, and the uninhibited like to blurt out hurtful comments and that is irresponsible.

Yet there are times that IQ and other attributes need to be known. "Special needs" teachers must know the abilities and natures of their students. The knowledge learned by students in my state is tested several times and culminates in the SATs. California once gave every student an IQ test but I dont know if that state still does except in the instance of obvious special needs. The Deans List is published but I think it would be callous to publish a list of stupid people.

Of course, as individuals we constantly make judgments about others. We usually keep it to ourselves, but it is hard even as an adult to not stare and wonder about a Mongoloid or retarded person. I was behind a woman at Walmart who had three girls with her and one of them was retarded. Every few seconds she would screech out a word and that was very annoying, but I tactfully did not ask the mother any questions.

hehe so basically you absolutely ignored my question

[Selene]

Extropy wrote about racial differences:

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

end quote

Peter, would you mind just putting the post # in at the top..

I have no idea where in the 86 posts this came from.

It would make it easy for us seasoned citizens...

Be kind to the aged...

A...

[Peter]

EX wrote on Post 82

I have not grown up either around people of West African ancestry, or in a society that even has them in a representative number, so I ask you with extreme candice: what have you perceived as mental handicaps? This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely intrigued as I've heard people from all walks of life (from bleeding hearts to scientists, i'll leave out the outright racists) making or suggesting timidly the same point. . . . Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

end quote

[william.scherk]

The USA strikes me...as a very controlled society... blacks are patiently waiting for an opportunity to demand something more from society...

Anecdotally, based on personal experience with black Americans [...] I'd say that there is a deep-seated, incurable resentment among U.S. blacks of my generation that prosperity cannot fix. Resentment is tolerated and amplified by political, institutional and corporate policies that give the unearned and steadfastly denies their mental handicaps.

I have not grown up either around people of West African ancestry, or in a society that even has them in a representative number, so I ask you with extreme candice: what have you perceived as mental handicaps? This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely intrigued as I've heard people from all walks of life (from bleeding hearts to scientists, i'll leave out the outright racists) making or suggesting timidly the same point.

Wolf has already suggested all race scholarship is dubious, and he should know, not being a scholar.

The code words are 'their mental handicaps' ... I must assume this refers to the black people Wolf has acquaintance with, but by the form of his last sentence this refers also to a larger conglomeration of The Blacks.

I think Wolf is saying this: "The Blacks have a mental handicap, and that mental handicap is resentment (of white people or institutions or racism or whatever pisses them off)." Implied is that the resentment is irrational, unfounded, and improper.

He could also mean handicap in a kind of golfing sense, a rating of global deficiency/efficiency at the game of life, I suppose, but that doesn't sound like Wolf. He would never make such sweeping statements about a collective noun.

That said, If you are angling for a long disquisition on the handicaps or inferiorities of The Blacks, I don't think anyone is prepared to utter strong straightforward comments here. We must get by on dark hints, slopping around words like 'thugs,' casting a whole town in a clear morality play, implying that They Get What They Deserve.

I would find it hard to argue that the Resentment Wolf intuits for all The Blacks is completely irrational or unwarranted, if it is indeed universal among Them.

The most curious part of Wolf's dog-whistle is the sin attributed to political, institutional and corporate policies (in a nice large non-speciific sense). The policies 'steadfastly' deny the mental/moral handicap carried by The Blacks. It would be interesting to see some examples of this.

Edited August 20, 2014 by william.scherk

[Peter]

William Scherk wrote:

That said, If you are angling for a long disquisition on the handicaps or inferiorities of The Blacks, I don't think anyone is prepared to utter strong straightforward comments here. We must get by on dark hints, slopping around words like 'thugs,' casting a whole town in a clear morality play, implying that They Get What They Deserve.

end quote

I will utter some straightforward comments. The average "g" of blacks in Africa is 70, and in America it is 80-85. World wide, IQ or "g" of Caucasians is around 100. Asians are slightly higher. People of European Jewish ancestry have a "g" of 117.

Daniel Seligman wrote in "A Question of Intelligence," p.74:

"Among serious scholars . . . the range of estimates [for the heritability of IQ] is from .50 to .80.

end quote

Herrnstein and Murray wrote in "The Bell Curve," p. 107:

"The most modern study of identical twins reared in separate homes suggests a heritability for general intelligence between .75 and .80, a value near the top of the range in contemporary technical literature."

end quote

According to forensic anthropologist George W. Gill, blanket "race denial" not only contradicts biological evidence, but may stem from "politically motivated censorship" in the belief that "race promotes racism".

end quote

Peter Reidy on Atlantis, Subject: ATL: Re: Meditations on Mensa

Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 wrote:

In California, for example, the legislature has outlawed, on political grounds, IQ testing of minority students in public schools; the academics, teachers' unions and elected officials who might have come the defense of the tests didn't.

end quote

If we are to be objective, William, we cannot be emotionally knee-jerk, Politically Correct, Wimps. We need to hear the facts and if the facts do not conform to our image of ourselves, we need to reexamine ourselves or disprove the facts.

[Peter]

Extropy (Matt Volco) wrote:

. . . so basically you absolutely ignored my question

end quote

I will answer off list.

[Wolf DeVoon]

The code words are 'their mental handicaps' ...

I don't write in code. If it makes you feel better, I freely admit to a mental handicap of my own, no gift for math or foreign languages.

[Selene]

I have not grown up either around people of West African ancestry, or in a society that even has them in a representative number, so I ask you with extreme candice: what have you perceived as mental handicaps? This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely intrigued as I've heard people from all walks of life (from bleeding hearts to scientists, i'll leave out the outright racists) making or suggesting timidly the same point.

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

Absolutely.

Please give me three (3) examples of what you have heard are "mental handicaps."

Thanks.

A...

Post script:

Thanks Peter.

[moralist]

In my view, you're barking up the wrong tree when you try to equate intelligence with moral civility. The existence of highly intelligent fully educated, yet thoroughly disgusting evil people lay waste to that faulty premise.

It's not race... it's not intelligence...

...it's values.

Greg

[Mikee]

A mental handicap need not refer to intelligence. It can be a strong emotional attachment to something that one knows and believes in that doesn't happen to be true. I'm guessing this is close to Wolf's meaning.

[Extropy]

Is Wolf free to say what he actually meant? It would seem that you're all fighting for the opportunity to give him a chance to expiate himself... or maybe it's just that I am over sensitive of taboos of any kind

[Extropy]

Peter Taylor seems to value intellectual curiosity more than diplomacy. And he did not ignore my question. I thank him for both things.

I have not grown up either around people of West African ancestry, or in a society that even has them in a representative number, so I ask you with extreme candice: what have you perceived as mental handicaps? This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely intrigued as I've heard people from all walks of life (from bleeding hearts to scientists, i'll leave out the outright racists) making or suggesting timidly the same point.

Is it legal/moral to ask this question out of actual curiosity?

Absolutely.

Please give me three (3) examples of what you have heard are "mental handicaps."

Thanks.

A...

Post script:

Thanks Peter.

Well, since you said please and thank you, how can I not comply?!

I have never heard the term mental handicap before this thread, not even if I translate it to my mother tongue.

I can think now of three mental handicaps, off the bat:

- Congenital excessive production of Dopamine resulting in the possibility of Schizophrenia.

- Extreme high intelligence, perspective and sensibility resulting in astonishment and desperation in face of the Human condition.

- "weird" Integration of the brain resulting in Autistic spectrum people or even Idiot Savants, who can calculate complex vectors or draw an aerial view of a city by memory but can't say please and thank you or shop for groceries.

I'm sure you can think of many more menta handicaps none of which relates to the subject at hand.

[anthony]

A mental handicap need not refer to intelligence. It can be a strong emotional attachment to something that one knows and believes in that doesn't happen to be true. I'm guessing this is close to Wolf's meaning.

Adding to the conjecture, I agree; both with Mike's appraisal and the feasibility of it being Wolf's meaning. Outside of physical conditions, there exists a major, prevailing "mental handicap": an unwillingness -not an inability- to apprehend what's real and to think for oneself.

Greg, you are right. Not intelligence, not race, but (moral) values.

[Wolf DeVoon]

Is Wolf free to say what he actually meant? It would seem that you're all fighting for the opportunity to give him a chance to expiate himself.

I believe in plain speaking, and I don't recall an occasion when I have ever retracted a statement. That's not to say I'm infallible. Folks often quarrel with my recitation of facts or conclusions. There are honest people of all kinds. Doesn't alter the corrosion of giving the unearned.

http://www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/detail/the-sad-irony-of-affirmative-action

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/affirmative_action_it_s_time_for_liberals_to_admit_it_isn_t_working.html

http://www.hinckleyallen.com/publications/navigating-the-16-mandatory-steps-of-federal-affirmative-action-compliance/

The snowball of "reparations" knows no limit at The Washington Post:

"We cannot calculate specific debts owed to African Americans (in almost all cases, now impossible to identify) whose government denied them the opportunity, in violation of constitutional rights, to purchase suburban homes and then benefit from equity appreciation." http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/wp/2014/07/03/why-we-still-need-affirmative-action-for-african-americans-in-college-admissions/

The consequences are appalling:

Ninety-seven percent of the bus and train operators at the Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority are black, with only six white women out of more than 3,000 drivers, according to Metro documents — a lack of diversity at one of the region’s largest employers that has led to an acknowledgment of failure in affirmative-action documents and spawned a series of lawsuits.

The homogeneity, interviews with dozens of current and former Metro workers indicated, is a proxy to a clubby culture of favoritism in which merit has little to do with promotions, and accountability, such as noting safety violations, is a career death knell. In typical examples, court and Metro records show, a black man who spent eight years in prison for dealing PCP was promoted to a high-level management position soon after his release, and whites in the same positions as blacks with far less seniority are inexplicably paid less...

It is a culture in which a white male engineer near completion of a Ph.D. was passed over for a management position in favor of a black man who was barely literate, multiple staffers said... “There are so many easy things we could do to make the system better,” a station manager said. “But they’d never put me in charge because they know I’d make sure others actually did their jobs. They don’t want change. It’s go along to get along.”

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/mar/26/metro-derailed-by-culture-of-complacence-incompete

Our relations with nation after nation – from Afghanistan and Iraq to Russia and China, from Turkey, Jordan and Pakistan to Egypt, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates, from Japan, Taiwan and South Korea to India and Australia, from Honduras to Brazil, from Poland and the Czech Republic to Germany, Great Britain, Canada and more – are worse now than they were when Mr. Obama was sworn in as president in 2009...

Having been president for more than five years, we can now render some reasonable and informed judgments about Mr. Obama, including this one: he is an amateur... And to see the crude and brutish Putin run circles around Obama—on negotiations over nuclear weapons, on granting asylum to Edward Snowden, on convincing Obama to undercut our allies in Poland and the Czech Republic, on establishing ties with Egypt, on strengthening the murderous Syrian regime, and now invading Crimea and threatening the rest of Ukraine—is painful for any American to witness. As House Intelligence Committee Chairman Mike Rogers put it, “Putin is playing chess and I think we are playing marbles, and I don’t think it’s even close.”

http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2014/03/04/obamas-journey-from-arrogance-to-incompetence/

[Peter]

Wolf wrote:

I believe in plain speaking, and I don't recall an occasion when I have ever retracted a statement.

end quote

Are you calling a spade a spade, Wolf? Oh wait, that type of speech is unacceptable. Joke. I am trying to device an acceptable concept (and not a euphemism) to what is frequently called *racism* by the race baiters like Al Sharpton. How about Statistical Analysis and Response to a Situation?

A group of young people are walking towards you on an inner city sidewalk wearing gang clothing and oddly positioned base ball hats on their heads, and gesturing gang symbols with their hands. You hear one of them saying, "Punch game time."

A group of Stewardesses are walking towards you at JFK Airport. One of them says, "Wow, hes cute."

Wolf is right. My point is that discussions of reality should not be restricted but those discussions need not be deliberately hurtful. The truth is out there, as the X-Files dramatized.