Ron Paul on the Insane Budget

[galtgulch]

There is someone in the Congress who for thirty years has been voicing the opinion that adherence to the limits imposed by the Founders in Article 1 Section 8 of the Constitution would have prevented our current crisis and still is the solution.

If you want to know just what the 134200 members of the Campaign For Liberty are being told when they read the articles and watch the videos on the C4L website here is an example:

You will find the link on the side

http://www.campaignforliberty.com

membership 3Apr 6AM 134200

My contention is that Ron Paul has done more than anyone to help the ideas of the Austrian school of economics and the principles of the Constitution be spread in our society. He also has given more hope based on understanding of our crisis which has energized the younger generation. He did recommend Atlas Shrugged too so like it or not Objectivist ideas are flowing through Ron Paul supporters.

gulch

Edited April 3, 2009 by galtgulch

[SherryTX]

There is someone in the Congress who for thirty years has been voicing the opinion that adherence to the limits imposed by the Founders in Article 1 Section 8 of the Constitution would have prevented our current crisis and still is the solution.

If you want to know just what the 134200 members of the Campaign For Liberty are being told when they read the articles and watch the videos on the C4L website here is an example:

You will find the link on the side

http://www.campaignforliberty.com

membership 3Apr 6AM 134200

My contention is that Ron Paul has done more than anyone to help the ideas of the Austrian school of economics and the principles of the Constitution be spread in our society. He also has given more hope based on understanding of our crisis which has energized the younger generation. He did recommend Atlas Shrugged too so like it or not Objectivist ideas are flowing through Ron Paul supporters.

gulch

Why wouldn't we like that?

[galtgulch]

There is someone in the Congress who for thirty years has been voicing the opinion that adherence to the limits imposed by the Founders in Article 1 Section 8 of the Constitution would have prevented our current crisis and still is the solution.

If you want to know just what the 134200 members of the Campaign For Liberty are being told when they read the articles and watch the videos on the C4L website here is an example:

You will find the link on the side

http://www.campaignforliberty.com

membership 3Apr 6AM 134200; 4Apr 7AM 137344

My contention is that Ron Paul has done more than anyone to help the ideas of the Austrian school of economics and the principles of the Constitution be spread in our society. He also has given more hope based on understanding of our crisis which has energized the younger generation. He did recommend Atlas Shrugged too so like it or not Objectivist ideas are flowing through Ron Paul supporters.

gulch

Why wouldn't we like that?

Hi Sherry,

Folks here are disenchanted with Ron Paul despite his support for limited govt, sound money, individual rights, non interventionist foreign policy, personal integrity and his adherence to the Constitution, for a couple of reasons.

I am aware that he is pro life and has a bill in congress to declare a fertilized ovum to be a person(!) not to mention an embryo, a fetus up to and beyond viability outside the womb. I understand he witnessed an abortion early in his career as an obstetrician and was horrified by it. I don't expect he is open to listening to reason on the issue. He is religious.

But he reads the Constitution, often, and is aware that the only powers explicitly granted to the congress are to be found only in Article 1 Section 8. He serves in his eleventh term in the congress. He reads bills and decides whether the powers sought are mentioned in the A1S8 and if not he has voted no even if he is the sole no vote over 300 times in his career as congressman from the Texas 14th CD.

In addition he advocates bringing home the troops stationed in the 826 some odd military bases in 130 countries. He believes we should not have gone into Iraq. Some here conclude he would not defend this country or go after Al Qaeda. He advocates no entangling alliances with foreign govts and that only the Congress has the power to declare war and cannot delegate that power to the Executive branch.

Ron Paul ran for the republican nomination and the media ignored him deliberately probably because he advocated abolishing the Federal Reserve System which is a central bank not authorized in you know what. I think they panicked, the Fed bankers and called the media moguls and told them to not write about Ron Paul.

Ron Paul was discovered by many who found him so appealing that they raised money for him and passed the torch. Ron Paul ended up staying in long after the media said he dropped out. He got a total of 1.24 Million votes in the primaries and when he suspended his run he started the Campaign For Liberty at http://www.campaignforliberty.com

I joined it because I think it will continue to grow and enlighten more and more fellow toilers like myself, ordinary folk who go to work, pay their taxes, raise their kids, watch tv, go to ball games and movies, bowl, fish and hunt, make a living, go to church or don't go to church but are decent people who are concerned about the direction this country is heading in. Many voted for a major party candidate with their hopes up for change but are in for a surprise.

So I think more will wake up as time goes by and they learn the hard way that Obam was a mistake.

I am an Objectivist, hard core, and as prochoice as they come. I think it makes sense to get involved in the C4L movement early and influence them as the prochoice wing of this movement.

I have been watching the growth and post the numbers. It is taking less time to add an additional 1000 members.

It was 134,800 this morning and now is 137110 !!! Two thousand more in one day !!!

So I keep encouraging Objectivists here to discover their local campaign for liberty activists and get to know them and let them get to know you. Work with them on efforts to get our neighbors to contact their congressmen to co sponsor HR 1207 the Federal Reserve Transparency Act put forward by, wait for it, Ron Paul.

There will be dozens if not hundreds of candidates for every level of govt all over the country who are C4L folks in upcoming elections from now until eternity if necessary to take our country back to the limited Constitutional Republic the Founders gave us. These folks are determined, passionate, mostly reasonable and it makes sense to me for us to join and get involved.

It is the only real pro freedom movement and it is here now and growing worldwide!

But not everyone is as excited about it as I am, but I am used to that.

Does that begin to answer your question, Sherry?

www.campaignforliberty.com 137142 Do you see what I mean? 4Apr 7AM 137344 thus another 200 while we slept!

gulch

Edited April 4, 2009 by galtgulch

[Dennis Edwall]

Gulch - well said.

But it leaves me wondering how Paul and C4L will succeed whereas the Libertarian Party has not. Yes, forming a splinter group from the Republican Party is easier than a new party, but most within the Republican Party are not Paul-types.

[SherryTX]

Yes, Gulch, thanks!

I admit I was leery of Ron Paul because mostly of the abortion issue, but most the other things (the fact he supports the constitution so strongly for instance) I was very encourage to see. I like how he has promoted other things that are very Objectivist friendly. So, my thinking was - yeah his wrong on some things - but being right about so many other fundamental issues is better than the rhetoric we get from the conservative establishment, or from the secular left. So, I guess it seems silly to me that people wouldn't want him at least promoting the good things.

[Selene]

Precisely Sherry. I have seen the objectivist "movement" continually eschew networking opportunities for four decades. Abortion is an issue that both "sides" possess good solid sophisticated arguments which support their position on the issue.

I do not think the issue is clear at all. Working backwards, late term infanticide is murder, pure and simple and it is premeditated murder in my opinion, life or health of the mother is the only exception.

Arguing backward from that position, which is primarily based on the "viability/survivability outside the womb" as a bright line legal argument we will arrive

at a point where that line moves ever closer and closer to conception with each leap in technology.

Therefore, since all human "life", under our Constitution has the right to life, this will directly conflict with the individual woman's right to control her own body.

Would it be valid for the state to remove the "life" at 11 weeks if the technology existed that could bring that "life at that stage" to full maturity?

Under the in loco parentis doctrine the answer is yes. To refuse to involve itself, would be condoning child abuse or potential child abuse.

This is not an argument that will be resolvable short term for objectivists. However, it is no hindrance to backing a man who is correct on most secular and Constitutional issues.

The other Ron Paul problem, for some of us, is that he is either globally naive concerning the use of American power abroad, which I doubt, or I am not understanding his position, or I am just to biased to be able to see the advantages of his position.

Even with those two big issues, one of which I agree with him on and one that I disagree with him on, I will work my tail off for him and the C4Liberty because they are on the same less chosen path that I am on and we should all be on as objectivists.

Maybe we will part company down the road apiece, but we need to stand together NOW.

Adam

P.S. Remember the best benefit of being a test tube baby is ....[get your groans ready] he has a womb with a view.

[galtgulch]

Gulch - well said.

But it leaves me wondering how Paul and C4L will succeed whereas the Libertarian Party has not. Yes, forming a splinter group from the Republican Party is easier than a new party, but most within the Republican Party are not Paul-types.

Dennis,

Thanks for your response. While we wonder how C4L will succeed whereas the LP has not, the C4L is growing and growing and growing. 4Apr 1PM 137744 !!!

The fact that Ron Paul has fought the good fight within the belly of the beast and is now in his eleventh term may be one thing the LP lacked. I do think the LP has accomplished a great deal as has the libertarian movement itself with the establishment of so many think tanks and publications. CATO and Reason, the Advocates for Self Government and The Future of Freedom Foundation and so many others, the Ludwig von Mises Institute and the Institute for Humane Studies come to mind, but there are more, Liberty magazine, I fear I will always leave out orgs that should be listed. All have helped enlighten so many.

The very existence of the internet enabled so many to discover Ron Paul for themselves despite the media blackout.

So many became aware of some of the horrendous things that are going on in our government which are blatantly unconstitutional. I think this has stirred many to join. The mere fact that the C4L exists and is using the power of their numbers and minds already. For example the support for Ron Paul's HR1207 called the Federal Reserve System Transparency Act is leading to a growing number of co sponsors IN BOTH MAJOR PARTIES!

The excitement is palpable that this movement will continue and will be effective. There is always the possibility that the powers that be will attempt to squelch the movement. I just read that the police in Phoenix AZ raided the home of a software engineer who had a badphoenixcops blog and confiscated all his computers etc. http://www.dailypaul.com/node/88743

Chilling but I expect resources will help such as the Institute for Justice.

The fact that the Young Americans for Liberty http://www.YALiberty.com is so active in the movement suggests that this time will be different or more like the first American Revolution. It is an eddy current given the torrent which is hurling our ship of state towards a maelstrom. This time the pilot is the very ideas we hold and I am certain the human spirit will guide us well.

gulch

[galtgulch]

Yes, Gulch, thanks!

I admit I was leery of Ron Paul because mostly of the abortion issue, but most the other things (the fact he supports the constitution so strongly for instance) I was very encourage to see. I like how he has promoted other things that are very Objectivist friendly. So, my thinking was - yeah his wrong on some things - but being right about so many other fundamental issues is better than the rhetoric we get from the conservative establishment, or from the secular left. So, I guess it seems silly to me that people wouldn't want him at least promoting the good things.

Sherry,

I appreciate your reply. My understanding is that Ron Paul always said that this movement was not about him. I agree with him that he served as an inspiration and that he ignited the movement. You can say the movement already has existed and that is fine with me. There has always been a pro freedom contingent.

Some call themselves conservatives but even those have been mistaken in many of their positions such as advocacy of the antitrust laws and interventionist foreign policy as well as being anti choice and even for the drug war.

Some call themselves liberals and we do agree with them on many of the social issues although we are more consistent, but they err in favor of taxation, the welfare state, regulation of business beyond protection of property rights and contract.

So we do agree with both liberals and conservatives on many issues but we are more consistently pro individual freedom.

My point though is that the movement is not one in which Ron Paul is our leader. He has recently spoken to C4L groups and told them that he will not tell them exactly what to do. That it is up to each of us to decide how to proceed. That he will continue to do what he has been doing all these years in his battle against the omnipotent state.

So the movement is one of the leading profreedom movements and total agreement with Ron Paul is no pre requisite to participate and there are no dues to pay.

www.campaignforliberty.com 4Apr 2PM 137774

gulch

[galtgulch]

Precisely Sherry. I have seen the objectivist "movement" continually eschew networking opportunities for four decades. I will work my tail off for him and the C4Liberty because they are on the same less chosen path that I am on and we should all be on as objectivists....

Maybe we will part company down the road apiece, but we need to stand together NOW.

Adam

Adam,

Am I making myself clear that the movement may have been one in which Ron Paul served as a catalyst but it is rather a movement of pro freedom individuals who are banding together in the cause which transcends any one of them.

Anyone in the movement may do whatever he or she thinks best to further the movement.

Surely simply letting others know of the movements existence is the very least one can do.

Yesterday a man I work with told me that he will join once they succeed in getting a single piece of legislation passed. I told him about HR 1207 and how the C4L movement is urging their respective congressmen to co sponsor it and the number of co sponsors is growing, which did impress him!

There is an entity online called http://www.downsizeDC.org

It is one of my favorite sites because it enables you to quite easily send an email to your congressman and your senators on virtually any of the subjects which they list as campaigns. I believe that the C4L members use this site to facilitate influencing their legislators and know that I do often.

Any one of us can collect the signatures necessary to run for office wherever we live. As a member of the C4L one can anticipate support, perhaps funding, volunteers and materials to use in one's campaign. One need not even mention Ron Paul just your own positions which I assume would be enlightened by your study of the issues, history, the constitution, Austrian economics, Objectivism and filtered through your own understanding of it all in the context of today's world. Who knows! I might even sally forth if I could only find my suit of armor and a trusty steed.

"It is the movement, stupid!" should be our watchword. I am sure Ron Paul would be content if his name were never mentioned but if you succeed and altogether we restore our Republic and our Constitution.

4Apr 3PM 137800 !!! Notice: Somebody is passing the torch every minute of the day and night! 5Apr 6AM 138344

gulch

Edited April 5, 2009 by galtgulch