sjw Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 Did it take a one-hour detention of a hypocritical progressive for you to understand that the U.S. is well on the way to tyranny? Apparently so.GhsI continue to fail to understand why a man of your stature stoops insults and evasions of this kind. Or perhaps I just misperceived your stature.Shayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjw Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 Michael, I'm sure the details will be forthcoming. The arrest just happened recently. I see no reason to distrust her account. When someone is victimized by a looming police state, then when we know that the police state is indeed looming, the benefit of the doubt must go with the victim, not the repeat-offender perpetrator.Shayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Shayne,I use a different standard for giving someone the benefit of the doubt. Especially with respect to someone who promotes an oppressive form of police state herself.Same crap. Different flavor.Her face value of her own words to me makes me look for her hidden agenda.I would like some independent accounts before I will take anything she says as corresponding to what actually happened--even if it is promoted by the one and only, great and objective thinker, the intellectual of the decade, Keith Olbermann. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjw Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 Michael, I posted a link to her explaining her position on fascism -- she's opposed. She's opposed to Obama as well. She likes Ron Paul (George's last presidential favorite; now, inexplicably, he seems to like Romney instead). The way I view her is as a good hearted person whose eyes are in the process of being opened. I have as yet seen no evidence to the contrary, and in this thread all I've seen is ad hominem.Shayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George H. Smith Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Shayne,I use a different standard for giving someone the benefit of the doubt. Especially with respect to someone who promotes an oppressive form of police state herself.Same crap. Different flavor.Her face value of her own words to me makes me look for her hidden agenda.I would like some independent accounts before I will take anything she says as corresponding to what actually happened--even if it is promoted by the one and only, great and objective thinker, the intellectual of the decade, Keith Olbermann. MichaelNaomi Wolf is well-schooled in the tactics of nonviolent resistance, and she used a standard tactic at the Cuomo protest, viz., to push a demonstration far enough to provoke a police response. The result was tons of free publicity for her cause -- in this case, the demand of OWS protesters for a "millionaire's tax," a measure that Governor Cuomo opposes.As a voluntaryist -- indeed, one of the first modern libertarians to discuss the potential value of nonviolent resistance to libertarian causes -- I have absolutely no problem with the tactic employed by Wolf, however much I may disagree with her enthusiasm for higher taxes. It is a tried and true method, as I indicated. But let's not blow things out of proportion and make this some kind of watershed in the history of civil rights.Ghs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjw Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 But let's not blow things out of proportion and make this some kind of watershed in the history of civil rights.GhsAs if anyone here did that.I thought you never graduated from college, looks to me like you're a doctor of spin.Shayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George H. Smith Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 But let's not blow things out of proportion and make this some kind of watershed in the history of civil rights. Ghs As if anyone here did that. I thought you never graduated from college, looks to me like you're a doctor of spin. ShayneWolf got the police response that she wanted to get, you dummy. That's what you don't seem to understand. Her action was SOP for nonviolent protesters.Ghs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George H. Smith Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Look at the reaction of Naomi Wolf as she gets cuffed. She remains very cool and even smiles and laughs while talking to her companion. The woman knew exactly what she was doing. She engineered the situation to get the desired result.Again -- and this is very important -- I am not criticizing Wolf for this. In fact, I admire her for having the courage of her convictions. My point is simply that this was not some kind of abusive police response. The point of nonviolent resistance is to push authorities to the point where they feel that they have no alternative but to arrest you. If this tactic had not worked, Wolf would have found a more successful approach, perhaps by using a megaphone (which she thinks should be allowed at protests). Wolf later complained that her jail cell, in which she was held for 30 minutes, was streaked with feces and blood. Welcome, Miss Wolf, to the real world of the selfsame State whose powers you wish to expand.Ghs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 She just got really excited when she felt the cold steel of the cuffs on her wrists! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjw Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 But let's not blow things out of proportion and make this some kind of watershed in the history of civil rights. Ghs As if anyone here did that. I thought you never graduated from college, looks to me like you're a doctor of spin. ShayneWolf got the police response that she wanted to get, you dummy. That's what you don't seem to understand. Her action was SOP for nonviolent protesters.GhsI'm less interested in whether she wanted to get arrested than in why she got arrested.Again, I'm sure the particulars will be forthcoming, and if they are not in her favor, I'm sure there will be plenty of fascists chomping at the bit to point them out.Shayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9thdoctor Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 According to the Wiki article on Wolf, she "was held in custody for an hour." This wasn't the impression I got from the interview with Olbermann.Maybe a year ago Olbermann made a stink about a woman who was wrestled to the ground by Rand Paul supporters. A long interview with the woman, and many replays of her being held down. She denied doing anything wrong. Before long, I think it was on Hannity, they showed the video of the whole incident, and you get a very different impression. If someone tried to pull the shit she tried on Obama, they’d probably be shot.Olbermann’s good for hearing what’s going round the left’s echo chamber, but quite useless for facts and truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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