TOC 2007 Summer Seminar

[Kat]

You will be missed Robert.

Kat

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

You will be missed Robert.

Kat

Ditto.

Michael

[studiodekadent]

After reading Robert's topic, I would like to comment on it.

First, I will not be at the summer seminar. In a few years when Im in the US, I will be though.

Robert's lecture is attempting to argue that no one can be a true Objectivist without endorsing the Objectivist aesthetics. Now, I love Ayn Rand's literature. I do not, however, uncritically adore it. Her characters can frequently be cardboard cut outs (John Galt is the classic example). Her strong point is in plotting, which she does brilliantly, and as well in philosophy (obviously).

Now, apart from Ayn Rand, my interests are not in romantic realism. Yes, I like the art I enjoy to endorse parts of my philosophy but that is not required. I often enjoy art (especially music) that is caustically violent, angry, miserable and full of rage, malevolence and darkness. I also enjoy, of course, triumph in my music, but is not the triumph greatest when over such horriffic misery?

What I hope is that Robert's lecture does not reach a conclusion that states I am not a real Objectivist.

Also, lets look at Sense Of Life as a phenomenon. Is it entirely determined by ones concious convictions? I say not. I think that one of the influences that must be looked at is how someone ARRIVED at those convictions.

I became an Objectivist after years of fighting a tooth-and-nail struggle to retain the independence of my mind, a struggle which nearly drove me to suicide. Obviously my sense of life will be different to those Objectivists that did not have such an emotionally traumatic climate into which Objectivism was introduced. But to say that one of us is 'more Objectivist than the other' is not something I think is possible.

[Judith]

I love Ayn Rand's literature. I do not, however, uncritically adore it. Her characters can frequently be cardboard cut outs (John Galt is the classic example).

I think you'll find many Objectivists who agree that John Galt is not a well-drawn character.

I often enjoy art (especially music) that is caustically violent, angry, miserable and full of rage, malevolence and darkness. I also enjoy, of course, triumph in my music, but is not the triumph greatest when over such horriffic misery?

Sounds like Halley's FOURTH Concerto to me.

What I hope is that Robert's lecture does not reach a conclusion that states I am not a real Objectivist.

. . .

I became an Objectivist after years of fighting a tooth-and-nail struggle to retain the independence of my mind, a struggle which nearly drove me to suicide. Obviously my sense of life will be different to those Objectivists that did not have such an emotionally traumatic climate into which Objectivism was introduced. But to say that one of us is 'more Objectivist than the other' is not something I think is possible.

Why worry? Isn't it up to you to decide if you're an Objectivist or not regardless of what another says?

Judith

[studiodekadent]

Sounds like Halley's FOURTH Concerto to me.

Basically I agree. But my own personal equivalent of that song is two songs: "Joy" and "Darkangel" by VNV Nation. The style of music is a variety of Electro-Industrial, which many Objectivists may take as an indication of a malevolent sense of life. They certainly would have back in the NBI days.

Why worry? Isn't it up to you to decide if you're an Objectivist or not regardless of what another says?

It is up to me. However I do not want the Objectivist community to experience a cultural dark age in which violations of 'proper' artistic taste are used as evidence in a hunt for heretics to burn.

I think Rand's aesthetics assumed that the art an artist created was automatically reflective of those artists values. But what about their DISvalues? That which they consider abominable horrors? Is not disvaluing intensely a corrolary to valuing intensely? Its common knowlege Pope Leonard is a horror film buff, horror being a genre that Rand considered as being infected with a 'malevolent universe premise.' But is it not true that, to an Objectivist, existing in a world totally without reason being subjected to the tortures of the tyrannical collective would be an absolute horror? Maybe people need the concretization of both their values and their disvalues. Couldnt the concretization of disvalues serve a purpose as well? Reinforce the loathing of the evil just as concretizing values reinforces love of the good?

[Chris Grieb]

Student; Did Leonard ever discuss his liking horror films with Ayn Rand. Leonard has said she got very upset with him when she went to a bad Anna Magnia film.

[studiodekadent]

Student; Did Leonard ever discuss his liking horror films with Ayn Rand. Leonard has said she got very upset with him when she went to a bad Anna Magnia film.

I dont know specifically. All I do know is what I said in my post. But I do know that Leonard CLAIMS Rand openly knew about his movie collection.

[Ed Hudgins]

[Just a reminder!]

More Speakers Not to Miss at Our Summer Seminar!

If you haven't signed up yet for The Atlas Society's 2007 Summer Seminar on the theory and practice of Objectivism, held starting Sunday, July 8 and ending Saturday, July 15 in Towson Maryland, we want to remind you of more exciting and insightful speakers who you'll be able to hear at that event:

*Walter Donway will follow up his much-acclaimed talk of last year on "Neuroscience and the Measure of Man" with the topic "Brain Science Discovers the Self." Walter, a founding and current trustee of The Atlas Society, started and edited the journal Cerebrum. His diverse talents will also be on display with his other Seminar talk, on "Poetry: The Supreme Romantic Art Form."

*Jay Friedenberg, who last year gave us a two-part "Introduction to Cognitive Science" series, this year will discuss of "Emergent Order and the Free Society." The concept of emergent order is becoming an important tool to explain such diverse phenomena as the operation of the physical universe, human consciousness and economic systems. Jay chairs the Psychology Department at Manhattan College.

*Douglas Rasmussen will discuss "Liberalism and Human Capacities." He will dispute those who appeal to the goal of promoting human capacities to justify a welfare and forced egalitarian state. Such an approach ignores the importance of the self-directed individual and the role of freedom in human flourishing. Doug is a philosophy professor at St. John's University and was co-editor of the book The Philosophic Thought of Ayn Rand.

*David Mayer will speak about "Judicial Activism, Real and Imagined." He'll argue that complaints from both Left and Right about judges who overstep their bounds fail to appreciate the more basic principles about the separation of powers and rule of law. David is a professor of law and history at Capital University, an expert on Thomas Jefferson and popular Summer Seminar speaker.

*William Klein will give a three-part series on "Business Ethics and Objectivism." Bill is president of The Center for Liberty Studies and a former assistant professor at Molloy College and at Central Michigan University.

We'll also have talks on the application of Objectivist principles to one's own life; a three part series by TAS founder David Kelley looking "Inside Objectivism;" and a six-part series by William Thomas, our director of programs, treating various topics in Objectivism.

You can see the full program details at on our website at The Atlas Society.

This year marks the 50th anniversary of the publication of Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand's classic that was the fount of a new philosophy and an inspiration for millions of readers. The Summer Seminar offers the perfect opportunity to reflect upon the achievements of that philosophy and advance your knowledge of it in theory and practice.

Towson is located just outside Baltimore and its Inner Harbor, where there are numerous restaurants, shops, and attractions to visit. Towson University is also just an hour's drive from Washington DC where you can visit the National Mall, the Smithsonian, and all the sites of interest in the Capital of the Republic.

To see the full program and register online, either for the full week or for a few days, please visit us at http://www.atlasevents.org/ .

To mail in your registration, please download and print the form found here.

Students may attend at a special, highly discounted rate.

At the Seminar you will meet many fascinating people, and the lectures and events are beyond compare. Please come join us for a week in "Atlantis," where the vision of Atlas Shrugged and The Fountainhead is brought to life by people who know it and breathe it!

Hope to see you there!

[Chris Grieb]

Since Towson is very near sea level one does have to worry about high altitude sickness. You also don't have spend 6 day listening to Leonard Peikoff be dim or is that talk about his dim hypothesis. Both of the above are things one could look forward to the ARI conference.

[James Heaps-Nelson]

Since Towson is very near sea level one does have to worry about high altitude sickness. You also don't have spend 6 day listening to Leonard Peikoff be dim or is that talk about his dim hypothesis. Both of the above are things one could look forward to the ARI conference.

But, Chris, then you'd miss being able to have a mind-reading by LP with Tarot cards labeled M1, M2, I, D1 and D2. Are your sure you don't want a diagnosis on how corrupted your mind has become .

Jim

[Chris Grieb]

Jim;

You have decided to beat this idea that Objectivists have no sense of humor into the ground.

Good comeback!

[James Heaps-Nelson]

My brother , Tom, is going. That'll be every year starting with 1994 that at least one of us has been to the Summer Seminar. I wish everyone the best !!

Jim

Edited June 21, 2007 by James Heaps-Nelson

[Chris Grieb]

Tom; You will be missed. I guess this means the Heaps-Nelson's are in the top ten of attendees.

[Chris Grieb]

A look at TOC's web site reports that they have extended the registration period to the 14th of July. It's a great program and you don't have to worry about high altitude sickness. You also don't have to listen to Lenny be DIM.

[James Heaps-Nelson]

A look at TOC's web site reports that they have extended the registration period to the 14th of July. It's a great program and you don't have to worry about high altitude sickness. You also don't have to listen to Lenny be DIM.

Chris,

Hopefully TOC will get some late registrants. TOC continues to have good offerings in cognitive science. Jay Friedenberg's presentation on emergence should be good too. Neuroscience is exploding with new insights. Three really good books in this area are: Eric Kandel's In Search of Memory, Antonio Damasio's Descartes' Error and Jeff Hawkins' on Intelligence are great new books that are accessible to the layman.

Jim

[Judith]

Hopefully TOC will get some late registrants.

Yes, the current list is rather sparse. From here, the only names I saw were Fran, Chris, and (of course) Ed.

Where are all you people?!? Get moving and register!

Judith

[Kat]

Unfortunately, Michael and I will not be attending the conference this summer. As much as we'd love to go, we have to sit this one out. With trips to LA and the UK already planned for this summer, the resources, babysitter and vacation time are limited. We do plan to attend the 2008 summer seminar. Hopefully, they will choose to hold it in Chicago.

Have fun at TOC-Con 2007. It sounds like a great program and definitely worth attending so get your registrations in ASAP. We'll miss you. :cry:

Kat

[Chris Grieb]

Kat; You and Michael will be missed. Enjoy your time off.

I want to hear what happened with Chicago this year.

I wish Jeff, Kori, Mitchell and Elizabeth could get to one.

[Kat]

Chris, I was just suggesting Chicago as a location option for next year's summer seminar. I don't know where they are planning to hold the event next year. I have no idea how they go about having schools host the event, but I am near Northwestern and Loyola and it would be convenient for quite a few of us to have it in Chicago. It was just a thought.

For the younger people, there is a deeply discounted rate of $150 for the week. It is definitely worth checking into for students and recent grads.

Kat

[Chris Grieb]

I want to apologize to everyone for my misinformation about an extension on the Summer Seminar. I have been informed that June 24th was the last date.

On the problem of location the biggest problem is cost. There are many fine venues that are very expansive.

It worth emphasizing that the altitude is good at Towson and it is easy to get to. I think I have mentioned that you are spared six days of LP being dim.

Edited June 29, 2007 by Chris Grieb

[Judith]

Unfortunately, Michael and I will not be attending the conference this summer. As much as we'd love to go, we have to sit this one out. With trips to LA and the UK already planned for this summer, the resources, babysitter and vacation time are limited.

Oh, MAN....

Judith

PS: Aren't your kids old enough to BE babysitters, not need them? Make 'em earn some money babysitting so that they can give it to you to make up for time off without pay to come to the conference.

[Philip Coates]

Kat,

I think one reason for TOC holding conferences on alternating coasts and not in the middle of the country is that it costs almost as much to fly halfway across the country as from one coast to another. Thus airfare is low for more people (a major consideration for potential attendees trying to budget for a conference) if a conference is held on one coast or the other.

[Chris Grieb]

No more postings for a while. I will be in Towson for TOC Summer Seminar. I will report on my new blog.

[Chris Grieb]

I wanted to give a quick report. A new star will be Omar Altalib. Another new will be William Kline. More when I get back to DC.

[James Heaps-Nelson]

I wanted to give a quick report. A new star will be Omar Altalib. Another new will be William Kline. More when I get back to DC.

I'm glad the seminar is going well. I look forward to your comments.

Jim

Edited July 13, 2007 by James Heaps-Nelson