why is public nudity looked at in such a negative behavior in most Christian Churches?

[weareacouple]

3 minutes ago, Jules Troy said:

Well..at least the US/Canadian border is still closed.

oops?

I think people are more offended that we are not wearing masks than me walking around with ample cleavage exposed LOL

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

1 hour ago, weareacouple said:

I think people are more offended that we are not wearing masks than me walking around with ample cleavage exposed LOL

W,

Since we are starting to issue psychobabble opinions about each other without knowing each other, I think you are lonely.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

W,

btw - I will ask this nicely, and if you do not comply, I will use my superpowers.

Please remove your nude photos.

This has nothing to do with anyone being offended by them and everything to do with losing what little sponsors this site has.

Thanks,

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

11 hours ago, weareacouple said:

We are not sure how anyone can believe in objectivism and...

W,

Do you know anything about Objectivism? I keep asking and nothing comes by way of answer.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

13 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

btw - I will ask this nicely, and if you do not comply, I will use my superpowers.

Please remove your nude photos.

Come to think of it, this isn't going to go anywhere and I just don't have the time to babysit.

So I went ahead and removed the nude picture.

Michael

[Jules Troy]

4 hours ago, weareacouple said:

I think people are more offended that we are not wearing masks than me walking around with ample cleavage exposed LOL

Meh I don’t give a toss what you choose to wear or not wear.  Plus..you said it, I didn’t.  Haha it actually reminds me of that elevator scene in the movie Liar Liar.  “People are so nice to me here”.  “Well that’s because you have nice tits!, I mean..”. “Smack”.

 

ps: do you even know who Ayn Rand is?

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

12 hours ago, Jules Troy said:

Meh I don’t give a toss what you choose to wear or not wear.

Jules,

I don't either.

I don't think they will be back since they got what they came for.

But who knows? For that matter, who cares?

However, this little thingie made me wonder if I should put a dress code in the posting guidelines.

Michael

[Ellen Stuttle]

On May 24, 2020 at 11:57 PM, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Ellen,

Have a name?

I would love to look into it.

Their IP numbers (there are 3 or 4) all go through Minnesota (Minneapolis and Saint Paul area). That tells me they (he, she or it  ) probably live there, but they also might be using a VPN.

So maybe they are returning trolls.

Without more knowledge, to me, they are probably new. Might even be AI.

As to jumping through hoops, I see all this as banter so far.

Michael

Sorry for the delay answering.  I've been busy off-line and just got around to catching up with proceedings here.

I think either a VPN  routing, or the troller moved.

I think it's the same person (male) who did "eva matthews" and co and another fake persona (on OO, I think that was) whose "name" I don't recall.

Could be someone from the Min/St Paul region who's encountered some of the O'ists in that area and is tweaking.

However, there are stylistic and response method similarities to the prior pest-troll. (Recall, that person used a borrowed photo for the eva matthews account.)

Ellen

 

[turkeyfoot]

On 5/25/2020 at 1:21 AM, weareacouple said:

We are not sure how anyone can believe

Jerry, is that we's name? If he is like me he is an I which makes "we" thin gruel. Has individuality been eliminated like mere clothes? 

The better question is Who Is Ayn Rand. If "a book" is the answer I have mine.  Shrug. 

[Peter]

10 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

Sorry for the delay answering.  I've been busy off-line and just got around to catching up with proceedings here.

The Elaine Betes of OL. Busy, busy. Still think that about “effective Intention?” Sounds like the movie, “Ghost ”.Jerry.

Ellen wrote: But he was a very great physicist -- and at the same time a physicist who believed that the psyche has powers which in certain circumstances could produce phenomena at variance with the usual laws of physics. end quote   

From: Ellen Stuttle  To: atlantis Subject: ATL: Wolfgang Pauli Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 16:01:59 -0500. I have no desire to reopen the debate about whether or not the laws of physics as they currently stand leave any "wiggle room" for effective intention.  However, out of deep respect for Wolfgang Pauli, I feel that I should enter an historical note about him.

It's true, as George described in the post by George where I left off reading a couple days ago, that Pauli arrived at the hypothesis of the neutrino's existence (subsequently confirmed) on the basis of the non- qualness of the observed sum of the mass and energy prior to and after beta decay; he hypothesized that there was an as-yet-unidentified particle accounting for the results.  But this doesn't mean that Pauli himself believed that the laws of physics always hold.

Instead, *Pauli* was the originator of the idea of synchronicity. Then he and Jung developed the idea and dual-authored a book about it -- they each wrote an essay, and the two essays were published in the same volume (1951).  Pauli and Jung described synchronicity as "an acausal connecting principle."  Now, it's hard to capture the exact nuances of what they meant by "acausal."  Both of them thought of causation as pertaining to mechanism, as pertaining to the laws of motion.  So a one-word synonym for what they meant might be "non-mechanistic."  But that doesn't convey the full flavor.  I think that the best synonym is "meaning-full."  They thought that there was a principle of *psyche* operative in the universe whereby events might occur in such a way as to have *meaning* for the person experiencing the event.  This of course is quite a different idea from the idea that everything which happens is the result of mechanical forces.

A further detail:  Pauli was the person whose incredibly rich and symbolic dreams are analyzed by Jung in the chapter "Individual Dream Symbolism in Relation to Alchemy" in Jung's *Psychology and Alchemy*.  And a comical note:  There's the legendary, in physicist jokes, principle known as "The Pauli Effect," according to which any experiment being conducted in near-proximity to Pauli's physical location was sure to go wrong.  There were even experimenters who took to asking, when they couldn't get lab equipment to work, "Where's Pauli?" And then there's the tale of an experimenter who, upon having a terrible time conducting what should have been a simple lab demonstration, said, "But Pauli's in Vienna," only to be told that although Pauli was en route to Vienna, he'd stayed overnight in the town where the experimenter lived.

Other types of stories, too, are told of Pauli, non-entertaining ones.  He could be a holy terror in the cuttingness of his critiques of fellow physicists' work.  Many felt intimidated by him, and he doesn't sound as if he was at all an easy person to get along with.  But he was a very great physicist -- and at the same time a physicist who believed that the psyche has powers which in certain circumstances could produce phenomena at variance with the usual laws of physics.  In short, there are respects in which Pauli would be classified by some as having been "a mystic." Ellen S.

From: Ellen Stuttle To: atlantis Subject: ATL: Wolfgang Pauli – Addendum Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 17:15:35 -0500. Thinking about Pauli led me to dig out a section of a book-in-progress about Pauli being written by a friend of mine.  Here's an amusing bit concerning the Pauli Effect:

"To [Pauli and Jung] the numinosum and the interactive relationship between psyche and matter were empirical realities that could not be dismissed simply because they could not be understood scientifically.

 "The so-called Pauli Effect epitomizes Pauli's mystical encounter with his surroundings.  For him, as well as many of his associates, this was more than a fiction.  The physicist George Gamow wrote: It is well known that theoretical physicists cannot handle experimental equipment; it breaks whenever they touch it.  Pauli was such a good theoretical physicist that something usually broke in the lab whenever he merely stepped across the threshold."

Larry -- never one to let an overgeneralization go uncorrected -- added a marginal note to the above comment:  "On the other hand Fermi was both a superb theorist *and* experimentalist! A. H. Compton [was] also very good at both." Ellen S.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

12 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

I think it's the same person (male) who did "eva matthews" and co and another fake persona (on OO, I think that was) whose "name" I don't recall.

Could be someone from the Min/St Paul region who's encountered some of the O'ists in that area and is tweaking.

Ellen,

I had to look up Eva to remember. Yeah, she ended up being a dude from Georgia who used a bunch of different accounts to troll here (and probably elsewhere). This was back in 2014 and before.

The current couple (person, AI or whatever) from Minneapolis were not intent on tweaking, though. They (or he she it) were intent on twerking until I took down the nude picture.

btw - One of the reasons I think this was AI (with maybe a comment or two by the person deploying it), or a spammer looking to sell sex stuff, was by looking into them on the Internet (not very deeply, granted). Their email for OL is housetrader10@gmail.com and their forum name is weareacouple. There also exists housetrader8@gmail.com and their forum name is wearetwo. I saw both on a site called Stop Forum Spam (see here). I'm giving a screenshot below in case it disappears.

This is only for November 2019, but I believe it was only registered by people who complained about them on the Stop Forum Spam site. So I have little doubt there has to be a whole lot more out there. As I said, I didn't do a deep dive. This example was enough for me.

Their posting IP on OL is very similar to the one above, although it is not exact. They probably use a dynamic IP range of some sort.

Also, I was intrigued at how the user pictures here on OL evolved for this account.

To start with, OL has the background tone of light blue and gray. Their first user picture (as a couple with the lady's silicon enhancements in prominence) was in a glaring reddish orange that really called attention to itself. Nice contrast.  This was done by someone who understands how to use color to capture eye movement.

Then their second picture was a repeat of the first with one difference. There was a small comic-book speech callout overlapping the picture at the bottom. Something like this:

I am pretty sure this was a signal for the bot that they had a bite, meaning people were commenting on the thread. I imagine OL was one forum among a crapload they were working. So, with this callout addition to their user pic, their experiment advanced to the next stage of more engaged comments. 

Then the lady took over as couple spokesperson and forced the discussion into talking about herself nude. At that point, they changed the user picture to present herself nude (but still in glaring reddish orange tone). I saw a pattern emerging and I am pretty sure what would eventually come, so I stopped it.

I didn't want to get schlonged.

Michael

[tmj]

I thought maybe in was Peter Robinson , from Uncommon Knowledge or his brother.

[Jules Troy]

Why use someone so buttfuck ugly though?  I mean I wouldn’t screw that with a stolen dick!

[Ellen Stuttle]

Peter quotes a couple Atlantis posts of mine in which I talked about Wolfgang Pauli.

I wrote about "the Pauli Effect":

===== Start Quote =====

There's the legendary, in physicist jokes, principle known as "The Pauli Effect," according to which any experiment being conducted in near-proximity to Pauli's physical location was sure to go wrong.  There were even experimenters who took to asking, when they couldn't get lab equipment to work, "Where's Pauli?" And then there's the tale of an experimenter who, upon having a terrible time conducting what should have been a simple lab demonstration, said, "But Pauli's in Vienna," only to be told that although Pauli was en route to Vienna, he'd stayed overnight in the town where the experimenter lived.

===== End Quote =====

Another story is the one about some students whose physics lab Pauli was scheduled to visit setting up a test of the Pauli Effect.  They rigged a bucket with water in it above the door to the lab and attached by a lever so the bucket would dump the water on someone entering through the door.

Pauli entered.  The lever mechanism didn't work.  Pauli Effect confirmed

----

I usually fast forward past Atlantis stuff Peter posts, but I was curious to see what I'd said about Pauli.  I like the posts, these multiple years later.  Maybe I'll find someplace besides this troll thread to copy them to when I get some time.

Ellen

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

5 hours ago, tmj said:

I thought maybe in was Peter Robinson , from Uncommon Knowledge or his brother.

T,

I never watch this so I had to look Peter Robinson up to see a picture of him.

Here is his picture from his Wikipedia entry:

LOL...

That does look like our culprit, except our Nude Dude wannabe looked awfully stewed. As in higher than a mofo.

Michael

[Strictlylogical]

On 5/23/2020 at 8:58 AM, weareacouple said:

We admit that much of the pushback comes from our own Christian community however there is no question that society as a whole still has a huge issue with it. We do also admit that public nudity can (and often does) lead to other less acceptable behavior and speaking as a couple that has gone down that road several times, we don't feel that nudity should get the blame. 

This is a very complex and interesting subject.  I’m only qualified to speculate as I have not done the research but I suspect that the various civilizations that evolved independently all over the world slowly arrived at certain cultural norms of enrobement for a number of reasons.  This slow formation of culture of course follows an evolution similar to that which generates the customs and teachings of religions over time as well.  Culture and religion both tend to suppress behaviour which traditionally for whatever perceived reason have had some negative impact on the “tribe” or its members.  Consequences of eating pork (primitively raised), premarital sex, and marriage of siblings come to mind. The Christian teachings are likely not unique or special in regards to nudity, but it is informed by the same causes.

As you have hinted at, nudity has power and can have consequences.  Especially if either or both the object or subject is a hormone drenched adolescent in his/her prime.  It’s natural that in the primitive dawn of civilization those aspects embued with power when they could not be harnessed by those in charge we’re largely kept in check and under wraps.

I hear you. As responsible persons rules against nudity and its power seem silly.  In modern times with community safety (gun control ) and “safe spaces” being more popular than self defence, self responsibility, and individual freedoms ... it’s not such a mystery.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

1 hour ago, Strictlylogical said:

I hear you.

S,

Go on and listen all you want. But if that poster(s) ever get your email, I suggest you hold tight to your wallet.

Michael

[Strictlylogical]

21 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

S,

Go on and listen all you want. But if that poster(s) ever get your email, I suggest you hold tight to your wallet.

Michael

I’ll try not to be drawn into anything “personal” as my purpose is to explore ideas, as such.  Whenever I stray into evaluating an idea by “who” said it (with the exception of having to do so to truly understand their meaning) rather what was said I, have failed myself.

And certainly, indulgences of a “personal” nature can be financially detrimental if it’s the wrong kind of person.

 

I’ve reread this thread and although there is a discernible level or “circus” here, it did not amount to a level that negates the interesting subject raised.  

Insofar as I can discuss interesting ideas amidst the noise, I will contribute to the discussion.

 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

5 hours ago, Strictlylogical said:

Insofar as I can discuss interesting ideas amidst the noise, I will contribute to the discussion.

S,

I don't mind at all.

If you like, I can let through all kinds of people for you to discuss interesting ideas with: people selling penis enlargers, student loans, multi-level marketing time-share opportunities, Asian and Russian brides, Nigerian princes who have difficulty getting money out of their country, and so on.

We aim to serve our users.

Michael

[Strictlylogical]

3 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

S,

I don't mind at all.

If you like, I can let through all kinds of people for you to discuss interesting ideas with: people selling penis enlargers, student loans, multi-level marketing time-share opportunities, Asian and Russian brides, Nigerian princes who have difficulty getting money out of their country, and so on.

We aim to serve our users.

Michael

I’m glad you don’t mind.

In summary

penis enlargers - moral if shown to be effective, immoral if claims fraudulent

student loans - moral if no taxation was used to obtain wealth leant

multilevel ... - although many fraudulent schemes have similar structure and description it is within the realm of possibility that time - real estate - responsibility - ownership might be woven into a complex structure and traded for value among voluntary individuals

Asian and Russian brides - although slavery is wrong, agents who bring parties with potentially mutual interest together provide value... when they aren’t fraudsters

Nigerian Princes - The one who contacted me, I ignored ...  the next time one contacts me I’ll tell him I’ve already sent him the initial fee and he already sent me the riches ... then thank him profusely in my goodbyes and good riddances.

 

Honestly though, it would be nice to have a forum to discuss things without hucksters or lefties harassing you all the time, but sometimes they leave crumbs for discussion.

[Peter]

5 hours ago, Strictlylogical said:

Honestly though, it would be nice to have a forum to discuss things without hucksters or lefties harassing you all the time, but sometimes they leave crumbs for discussion

In a Downton Abbey episode the patriarch is trying to convince the others to allow him to invest in the most promising investment EVER. It is with a man named Ponze.

 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

6 hours ago, Strictlylogical said:

Nigerian Princes - The one who contacted me, I ignored ...  the next time one contacts me I’ll tell him I’ve already sent him the initial fee and he already sent me the riches ... then thank him profusely in my goodbyes and good riddances.

S,

Oh, we can do much better than that.

How about a little scam baiting?

Here's an old OL thread from 2008.

Having Fun With 419 Scammers

My favorite Bible quote from the scam baiters to a Nigerian scammer is:

Quote

"And he ate with glee, the nuts of The Maker."
--Dextrose 14:89

Those dorks are so greedy for easy ill-gotten loot, they don't think anything is wrong.

 

Imagine what people have been doing to them since 2008.

Michael

[Jules Troy]

Snl celebrity jeapardy

Trebek “the pen is mightier”

Sean Connery “I’ll take the Penis mightier for 200!”

Trebek No it’s the pen is mightier !”

Sean Connery”I don’t care what you call it if the penis mightier really works I’ll take a dozen!”

[weareacouple]

wow my wife told me she deleted us from this forum but I can see that we are still members here. she went to her sisters this weekend so needless to say I have been watching porn and jacking off. well I am pretty sure you would rather communicate with my wife and her huge tits but sorry it is just me tonight. 

[weareacouple]

 that is a lie because my neighbor is hanging out with me as well.