Mistaken Syllogism in Atheism: The Case Against God


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I'm neither Objectivist or Objectivish, because I'm not a person who isn't an Objectivist claiming to be one... and neither do I speak for or on behalf of Ayn Rand.

So I was accurate in my estimation that you are not acquainted with what Rand had to say about morality. By mixing up Secular with Bad/Amoral you showed either bad faith or ignorance.

Rand was secular. Objectivism is secular. You yourself are probably secular in the sense of wanting religion to be separate from the state.

Thank you for disregarding all but two sentences of my comment.

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people knowing how Objectivism works is different than being exposed to it. something pretty near 100% of disagreement with Objectivism is due to not understanding it, not knowing what it really says. and a lot of people who say they agree don't really know what it means either.

. . .

You think Objectivism has made you powerful. In fact it has made you nothing. Instead you have tied your brain into knots.


This is exactly why most fiction written by fundamentalist Objectivists sucks.

Such true-believing soul truly believes that if anyone is properly exposed to The One True Way of Objectivism, they will annul their lives, experiences and values, and joyfully embrace the mind of Rand as a replacement for their own.

(All fundamentalists of all religions and philosophies believe something similar. Even scientismists. This means circular certainty. I.e., when people understand Objectivism, they agree with it. They have to. Why? Because if they disagree, they don't understand it. Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Global Warming Alarmists, fans of Lady Gaga and so on--those who are fundamentalists--all say a variation of the same thing. Round and round and round she goes...)

Fundies have become so sold they don't realize that stating something and convincing someone are different skills.

Storytelling, the idea mothership of convincing, generally eludes their grasp and comprehension. As they are the most easily convinced people on earth, they are not very good at convincing others. They are story consumers, never story creators. Except when they try and suck at it. :smile:

They can preach to their own choir in jargon with a degree of success, but rarely convince anyone else. And, of course, they blame everyone else for this failure rather than their own incompetence at critical thinking and storytelling.

Rand knew how to tell a story. Her professors were folks like Cecil B. DeMille and even some Hollywood hacks of the time, who knew more about basic storytelling than any O-Land fundy ever will. (She was also extremely good at critical thinking when she wanted to be.)

Without Rand's fiction, her ideas would be a cultural footnote. Because of her fiction, her ideas have influenced American politics and culture and business at the highest levels.

But try to get that through the thick head of a fundy on a soapbox...


btw - Our young (or maybe old) aspiring Teacher Of Others About How They Must Live Their Lives showed just how little he understood my comment about propaganda--but was still a great example of what happens when it works.



Is "curi" a sock puppet of Phil Coates?


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If so I'm glad he's back on the rails. He had totally lost it and in a way I could not comprehend. If so--but not so. Too much background now (here) and too much writing little of which is likely to be worth reading. To read Phil gave one a headache. This guy gives you brain freeze. It''s possible he's already gone. I admit I've not wanted someone gone so much since I wanted Phil gone. I think Phil was a tragedy for there was something truly valuable wanting to get out but Phil didn't know how to do it and blew up. That was passion. Everything in this guy's garden is artificial; no need to fertilize or water, just dust.


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