rationalRN

Funny video Adam! Go veg.com huh? My favorite part was the comment about how people wearing fur get harassed more than people wearing leather because nobody wants to mess with a biker. Too funny and so true!

Don't you love what you eat? I'm really fond of cows and pigs, they taste great!

Dragonfly,

Of course we love eating animals just as much as they love eating each other.

Michael

Oh my god, just so you know, when I read your statement "of course we love eating animals just as much as they love eating each other", I almost spit the sip of water I took out of my mouth!!

Those who argue that eating meat is "objectively immoral" because you have to kill an animal for it (and there do exist fanatic vegetarians who hold that position), I would tell them: "So per you criteria, people who live in the desert and have nothing else to eat are "objectively immoral" because they have to kill animals?"

They will try to backpedal of course by modifying, but any backpedaling will just show that their premise is wrong.

Also, the premise of valuing animal life at any price can be checked when you ask them and "And what do yo if you have lice in your hair?"

Thanks for sharing Xray! I always find interest in other people's reasoning for their diet preferences.

And way to go on the lice argument. I might use that one but don't worry, I'll give you credit

What have your relatives said to you that clash with your beliefs? Holidays made me think of this because this is when most families come together for the festivities or a reunion of sorts.

Since there's always a motley crew assembled in those family reunions, I try to have a good time without going into any discussion about our subjective values.

Since I never expected others to share my values, I'll take any comments coming from them clashing with my beliefs just as what they are: the expression of their values.

Well said Xray! I like how you mentioned that they are "expressing their values" too. Sometimes I fail to acknowledge that. Discussion and debate amongst the family crowd is one thing, but when they try to force you to go to church or something berserk I don't care for that.

[quote name='Dragonfly' date='22 November 2009 - 06:31 AM' timestamp='1258893063'

I'm a vegetarian.

Oops, then you won't like my previous post. Do you mind if I ask your reasons for being a vegetarian?

Naturally, I try to make conversation, so I start talking about how lobster would be nice in place of ham on my eggs benedict and about how fun I think it would be to catch them.

How is lobster prepared? Is it thrown into boiling water alive?

Lobster can be prepared in a multitude of ways. Several I am familiar with are 1) Throwing the critter directly into boiling water, 2) Putting the lobster on the kitchen floor while my cats play with it and then throwing it into boiling water, 3) Putting it in the freezer for 30 min or so until it almost goes into a state of hibernation and then putting it in boiling water (this is probably the kindest method), or 4) Put directly onto grill

Delicious!

But how would the argument "God loves all His creatures" mesh with Tiffany's suggestion to her uncle that it would be fun catching and eating the lobster?

Don't you love what you eat? I'm really fond of cows and pigs, they taste great!

Ah yes, I love pigs and cows too, and they certainly are delicious!

Anyone else have funny family stories to share?

I say "Do you like lobster Uncle Tony?" He responds with: "Lobsters are bottom feeders and God put them on earth to eat the scraps on the ocean floor. They are therefore unclean in God's eyes and unfit to eat."

Tiffany,

Here is a smart-ass reply. If your uncle insists that you have to believe in God as he does, use his own standard. Simply say (about the lobster), "That's not what He told me. He told me He loves all His creatures."

After the shock hits, simply say that God speaks to you in your heart when it's quiet. And God told you that He loves your uncle, too.

Then smile.

I doubt there will be much of an answer to that.

I don't suggest doing this if anybody is persuadable near, though, since it will not be your true belief. But for those to whom rational ideas fall on deaf ears, it's a good solid tactic of using their own arguments to stifle intimidation.

Michael

Ha! Thanks Michael! I may have to use that tactic this year. And you're right, he is not persuadable at all. That is a pretty funny response because he can't argue with any of it- Whatever I say goes because God is non-specific and supposedly infinite.

Great topic Tiffany:

Our family dinners were a cross between the British Parliament and a back alley polling place on the wrong side of the tracks that every city and town has one or more of.

They were fantastic. Argument was heated, very elevated intellectually and passionate. Sometimes they would be in three or four languages depending on who was there.

Topics ranged from golf to crime to opera to politics, etc.

Being a Randian, I always drew fire.

Additionally, we would have folks from other countries like the Philippines, Japan, Germany, Italy, Cuba and even the Soviet Union.

I can remember being told, very seriously, that I would be executed in his country for saying that I would refuse to do x or y.

Adam

My god Adam! Sounds quite interesting. I wonder if you were the only one who thought those arguments were fantastic though . I see you like to debate. Some of my relatives get genuinely upset when someone doesn't agree with them. My father has left the reunion without telling anyone on several occasions.

I went to visit my mother recently and before I walked in the door I was reminded of the clash of our beliefs (not just with her but with her family in general). On the door hung the sayings "God bless everyone" and "Make a positive difference in someone else's life today". My siblings and I are all going to be gathering at our Mother's house with a few other relatives for Xmas and I am wondering what's going to happen this year..

Two years ago, my uncle, a radical Christian was sitting quietly at the table for breakfast. Naturally, I try to make conversation, so I start talking about how lobster would be nice in place of ham on my eggs benedict and about how fun I think it would be to catch them. I say "Do you like lobster Uncle Tony?" He responds with: "Lobsters are bottom feeders and God put them on earth to eat the scraps on the ocean floor. They are therefore unclean in God's eyes and unfit to eat." Ugh.

What have your relatives said to you that clash with your beliefs? Holidays made me think of this because this is when most families come together for the festivities or a reunion of sorts.

<<<

THE QUESTION:

Here's the question, and please give an honest answer....

Would you select high contrast color film, or would you go with the

classic simplicity of black and white?">>>

Black and white (although I am no photographer). I'd like to consider the "saving" option for a moment: Panicked people in the water are very detrimental to the lives of those trying to save them. They climb on you, unintentionally drown you or turn over small rafts or boats. I'd probably shoot the picture, wait until they passed out from exhaustion or a semi-drowned state, and then drag them onto my raft/boat and take them to shore where additional life-saving measures could be performed if need be. Imagine if you saved the president and everybody knew it. Maybe he would listen to your opinion on the health care bill!

I think he is just hilarious! I will probably buy his book later today. Thanks for the recommendations!

Since we are in the Medical debate - humor is a great prescription ...even when you spell it right:

Subject: AMA's vote on Healthcare reform Healthcare Reform Package

Apparently the American Medical Association has weighed in on the new healthcare reform package.

The Allergists voted to scratch it, but the Dermatologists advised not to make any rash moves.

The Gastroenterologists had sort of a gut feeling about it, but the Neurologists thought the Administration had a lot of nerve.

The Obstetricians felt they were all laboring under a misconception.

The Ophthalmologists considered the entire idea shortsighted.

The Pathologists yelled, "Over my dead body!" while the Pediatricians said, 'Oh, Grow up!'

The Psychiatrists thought the whole idea was madness, while the Radiologists could see right through it.

The Surgeons decided to wash their hands of the whole thing.

The Internists thought it was a bitter pill to swallow, and the Plastic Surgeons said, "This puts a whole new face on the matter."

The Podiatrists thought it was a step forward, but the Urologists were pissed off at the whole idea.

The Anesthesiologists thought the whole idea was a gas, and the Cardiologists didn't have the heart to say no.

In the end, the Proctologists won out, leaving the entire decision up to the assholes in Washington.

And the nurses were hired to clean up all the sh*t.

My link

Anybody watch House? I found this hilarious!

Whaaaaat?!! Very impressive!

As Jim Gaffigan says: "My greasy lover BACON!" Oh, it's sooooo good. And good call on the thick slices ninth doctor. Much tastier I think!

As far as the calories go, bring 'em on, I'm not afraid! I find that they leave me feeling satisfied longer anyway. I usually add a lot of butter to the hollindaise and drop in a couple of extra egg yolks to help get thicken it. Delicious!

Adam,

I actually haven't been following the games much (*ducks, shuts eyes tightly and covers head*), but I did see a bunch of Phillies tents with gear and a giant "SALE" sign, so that can't be good!

I also think the 30th street station is beautiful. I used to count the squares on the ceiling as a kid and remember thinking that was fun!

The whole septa thing is getting pretty interesting. I work in the city and live in the valley forge area, so I take the train in every day. Yesterday I went there several hours early to ensure I would not be late for work only to find out that one of the trains was on fire and that traffic on that like and one other was suspended. I spent the next 3 hours trying to drive the 17 miles in to work. I had today off so I guess we will see what happens tomorrow! A couple of weeks ago the signals were all out and they stationed men with signs to manually signal the trains. All I could think of was that this also happened in Atlas Shrugged. Interesting times for sure!

Tiffany

Oh yummy! Eggs Benedict is probably one of my top favorite foods and definitely my favorite breakfast dish. Thanks for your recipe- I'll try your version this week!

Welcome to OL Tiffany:

I just spent the weekend in Drexel Heights. Beautiful city. I came back through Phil Penn Station tonight and was awed by its grandeur.

Go Yanks!

Where did you get your nursing degree?

Adam

Adam,

I got my nursing degree at Drexel. I really do love Philadelphia! I used to live in an apartment that had a view of center city and I miss that.

It's a good thing you didn't try to take the train out today because Septa went on strike at 3am. All subways and buses were stopped so those people tried to pile on the trains, so they had to count heads and only allow so many people on per train. Anyway, I would advise that you avoid taking to train to Philly for the next couple of weeks or until the strike ends. By Philadelphia Penn Station do you mean 30th st? That's the one with all the large columns outside.

Boooo Yanks!

Tiffany

What a lovely idea! I can't say I have read many books this year due to job searching and several moves, but I am almost finished reading:

The psychology of romance by Nathaniel Branden

With your one book per week challenge in mind, I should finish it in a few days at most and get cracking on some more! I tend to severely damage books as I read them, so I prefer to own my own copies, so I guess I better start ordering. I might read something lighthearted or trashy next though to switch it up a little...

What a way to welcome a new member! You all are very nice. And for what it's worth, I usually get a big grin on my face when I give injections, especially when someone tells me they are afraid of needles because I know I give a damn good shot and that they won't feel a thing!

I look forward to spending more time browsing the forum. See you all around

Hello all,

I am new to this particular forum but have been on another O'ist forum since 2005. I'm a nurse in the Philadelphia area and am always looking to make some Objectivist friends, so if you live nearby shoot me an email! Happy Halloween!

Tiffany