Roger Bissell Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Subject: J's Little ScamThe problem with J's claim is that of all the people on this list he is not one who has a background of study of science and in fact seems to have little. And it is suspicious that it is exactly the person who most constantly tries to 'take me down a peg' firing off heated insults every time I post, who would most -love- to claim to have done so. And the clincher is the claim that he just got the answers by "remembering junior high stuff". Anyone who took the test knows that there is a lot of stuff that doesn't get covered at that level but is college or at least high school material.And here's the clincher, the proof of that he's misleading us:Several of the 50 questions couldn't have been covered in J's 6th, 7th, or 8th grades [leaving aside the improbability that he'd remember all of them all these years]. Why, you ask? For the very simple reason that they are based on knowledge that was not yet known when Jonathan was in junior high school . . . and certainly had not made it into junior high textbooks.Come on, Phil -- maybe Jonathan got a 49 compared to your 47, because he's simply ~smarter~ than you are.You can't be as depressed as I am. I read the Christian Science Monitor constantly, and I only got a 45. Hell, even Ba'al did that well! :-)I would have tied your score, Phil, except I listened to my brainiac wife, who kibbutzed while I was doing the quiz and urged me to answer that the universe was 14 trillion years old, and the earth was 6015 years old. (Her dad was a plasma theorist, and her mom was a Fundamentalist Christian.) She's always been so reliable before, like on the aesthetics of abstract art and stuff...REB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 [....] I got one question wrong.Which one?"If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object?"I got all of them right.That doesn't surprise me.The only one on which I had to hesitate was 38, which includes two correct answers among the options. So answering was a case of guessing which option the quizzer(s) wanted.In high school, I had a teacher who was notorious for not carefully thinking through the quiz questions that she came up with, and we often had to guess at what we thought she wanted for an answer. She sometimes came up with multiple choice questions and inadvertently gave us only correct answers to choose from. Something like:When did Magellan reach the Philippines?A. After 1430B. After 1460C. After 1490D. After 1520If that had been the question, she would have accepted D as the "correct" answer that she wanted, but I would have gone with A just so I could argue with her when she marked my answer wrong. And it would take quite a lot of arguing to convince her that whatever happened "after 1520" also happened "after 1430."All in all, I think the quizzer(s) just compiled a bunch of trivia stuff from Wikipedia and similar places.Yeah, taking the quiz reminded me a lot of having a good run during a game of Trivial Pursuit.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 [....] I got one question wrong.Which one?"If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object?"The only question which required a calculation. ;-)(Btw, where does one click to find the emoticons with the revamped software? I'm not getting a list of formatting options -- but maybe the problem is the browser. For some reason, my Firefox doesn't work to sign in, so I'm using an old version of Safari.)The only one on which I had to hesitate was 38, which includes two correct answers among the options. So answering was a case of guessing which option the quizzer(s) wanted.In high school, I had a teacher who was notorious for not carefully thinking through the quiz questions that she came up with, and we often had to guess at what we thought she wanted for an answer. She sometimes came up with multiple choice questions and inadvertently gave us only correct answers to choose from.I had a professor -- for introductory psych -- in college who would often *deliberately* give only correct answers and ask for the best answer. I still recall a question where he said "Science is..." and then listed four or five options of which we were to select the best. I remember "systematic" and "empirical" as two of the options he didn't want (since they don't distinguish science from various other pursuits), but though I've racked my memory over the years trying to find the answer he thought best, I don't remember -- only that I mind-read him right in selecting.In this case -- question 38 -- either the quizzer(s) didn't know that two answers are correct or there's a subtle wording fine point since with one of the answers the cycle repeats, thus the phases of the two go-runs include a number as part of the phase name.I'm reminded of something I read about SAT tests and such like being compiled by people who know a little about an area and inadvertently include answers which cause pause for people who know a lot. An example I remember was a question something like, "What composer wrote a work which was kicknamed 'The Emperor'?" Among the options, along with Beethoven, was Haydn (one of whose quartets is kicknamed "The Emperor Quartet").Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 As a public service, here's a list of all the questions from the csmonitor 12/9/11 quiz.I "[sic]"ed the typos I noticed (I noticed another, in "Finnegan's," copying the answers) -- and raised eyebrows over the "established" in question #23.Maybe someone like Jonathan would like to do a pretty job of the formatting?===SCIENCE QUIZ1) Composing about 78 percent of the air at sea level, what is the most common gas in the Earth's atmosphere? Carbon dioxideOxygenNitrogenHydrogen2) The Austrian monk Gregor Mendel's observations of what organism formed the basis for the science of genetics? pea plantsfruit fliestulipsmice3) What term, which means the maximum absolute value of a periodically varying quantity, does the "A" in AM radio broadcasting stand for? AmplificationAmplitudeAmpereAmphibian4) In 1989, the US postal service drew criticism from paleontologists for releasing a stamp with what obsolete genus name, which translates from Greek as "Thunder Lizard"? TyrannosaurusBrontosaurusStegosaurusTriceratops5) Organic chemistry is the study of compounds that contain what element? oxygennitrogencarbonpotassium6) How many nanometers are there in a centimeter? 1,0001,000,00010,000,000100,000,0007) In physics, what letter is used to represent the speed of light in a vacuum? abcd8) The only two known planets in our solar system that lack any moons are Venus and what other planet? MarsUranusMercuryPluto9) What is the heaviest noble gas? xenonneonheliumradon10) Approximately how old is the Earth? 6015 years100,000 years4.5 million years4.5 billion years11) Newton's First Law of Motion describes what phenomenon? Inertia: An object not subject to any net external force moves at a constant velocityGravitation: Physical bodies attract each other with a force proportional to their massAcceleration: The rate of change of a body over time is proportional to the net force acting on itKinetic energy: The energy of a body is equal to one half of the product of its mass times and [sic] velocity squared12) Mars is often described as the "Red Planet" because of the pevelance [sic] of what element mixed with oxygen on its surface? copperironzinccadmium13) What combustible compound, the principal component of natural gas, has the chemical formula CH4? propaneethanolmethanebenzene14) What word, which comes from a Greek term meaning "good kernel," describes an organism whose cells contain chromosomes inside a nucleus bounded by a membrane, as distinguished from bacterial forms of life? virusamoebavertebrateeukaryote15) Named for a 19th century English physicist, what unit of measurement is defined as the energy exerted by the force of one newton acting to move an object through a distance of one meter? wattjoulehertzpascal16) The lowercase of what letter of the Greek alphabet is used to denote diverse phenomena such as the photon, the third angle in a triangle, the heat capacity ratio in thermodynamics, a type of high frequency electromagnetic radiation? alphabetagammadelta17) What element, whose atomic number is 8, is the most abundant element in the earth's crust, making up almost half the crust's total weight? aluminumoxygencarbonnitrogen18) DNA contains adenine, cytosine, guanine, and what other nucleotide base, which is not found in RNA? uraciladenosinethyminedeoxyribose19) What is the electrical resistance offered by a current-carrying element that produces a drop of one volt when a current of one ampere is flowing through it? 1 joule1 watt1 ohm1 hertz20) The letter K stands for what element on the periodic table? tungstentinpotassiumsilver21) What term describes the single initial cell of a new organism that has been produced by means of sexual reproduction? zygoteblastocystembryofetus22) If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object? 5 meters per second squared2 meters per second squared0.2 meter per second squared50 meters per second squared23) Noting how light from objects that are moving away from the observer tend to shift to the red end of the spectrum, what scientist first established [??] that the universe is expanding? Albert EinsteinCarl SaganJohannes KeplerEdwin Hubble24) A temperature interval of one degree Fahrenheit is equal to an interval of 5/9ths of a degree Celsius. At about what temperature do the Fahrenheit and Celsius scales converge? 400 degrees4000 degrees-40 degrees-400 degrees25) The genus Australopithecus, one species of which was an ancestor of modern humans, first evolved on what continent? AustraliaAfricaAsiaSouth America26) According to Bernoulli's Principle, an increase in the speed of a fluid occurs simultaneously with a decrease in what? volumemassenergypressure27) What is the name for the chemical compound that dentists use as "laughing gas" and that engineers and mechanics use as an oxidizer in rocketry and in motor racing? nitrogen tetroxidehydrogen peroxidenitrous oxidehydrogen fluoride28) Geologists categorize rocks into three types: Igneous, sedimentary, and what? volcanicmetamorphiccrystallineoceanic29) Two planets in our solar system are tied for having the lowest surface gravity – on each one you would weigh only about 38 percent of what you weigh on Earth. One of these planets is Mercury. What is the other one? NeptuneSaturnMarsVenus30) What moon, the largest moon orbiting Saturn, is the only known object in the solar system other than Earth that is known to have liquid on its surface? TethysTitanRheaEnceladus31) The 2006 demotion of Pluto to the status of dwarf planet was precipitated by the discovery of what object orbiting beyond Pluto, believed to be 27 percent more massive than Pluto and named for the Greek goddess of strife and discord? CeresErisNyxCharon32) In classical mechanics, what is defined as the product of an object's mass and velocity? forceaccelerationmomentumkinetic energy33) What word, which comes from Ancient Greek words meaning "entire" and "Earth," describes a supercontinent thought to have existed during the Paleozoic and Mesozoic eras, about 250 million years ago? GaiaEurasiaPangaeaAmerica34) What term for an elementary particle and a fundamental constituent of matter gets its name from a line in James Joyce's 1939 novel "Finnegans [sic] Wake"? atomquarkprotonelectron35) The mathematical constant e is defined as the base of the natural system of logarithms, having a numerical value of approximately what? 3.1420.5671.6182.71836) Protium, which consists of a single proton and no neutrons, is the most common isotope of what element? heliumhydrogennitrogencarbon37) The lowercase version of what Greek letter is used to symbolize the coefficient of friction in classical physics? deltamuepsilonzeta38) What type of cell division in eukaryotic cells is divided into prophase, metaphase, anaphase, and telophase? meiosismitosisfissionsenescence39) What word, which comes from a Greek term meaning "old stone" describes the era of human history, from about 2.5 million years ago to 12,000 years ago, which was distinguished by the development of the first stone tools? HoloceneJurrasicPaleolithicPleistocene40) With an atomic number of 9, what chemical element is the lightest element of the halogen series? It gets its name from a Latin word meaning "stream" or "move freely." bromineastatinefluorineiodine41) After the Moon, what is the brightest natural object in the night sky, reaching an apparent magnitude of -4.6, bright enough to cast shadows? PolarisMercuryVenusBetelgeuse42) According to the standard model of Big Bang cosmology, approximately how old is the Universe? 6015 years old14 million years old14 billion years old14 trillion years old43) What word, which derives from a Greek term meaning "unequal" or "bent," describes a triangle whose three sides are of unequal length? equilateralisoscelesoblongscalene44) Over half of the world's supply of what element, which gets its name from the epithet of the Greek goddess Athena, is used in catalytic converters? americiumpalladiummolybdenumcadmium45) In quantum mechanics, the physical constant used to describe the sizes of quanta – denoted as h – is named after what German physicist? Erwin SchrödingerMax PlanckAlbert EinsteinWerner Heisenberg46) Approximately how long does it take light from the sun to reach Earth? It's pretty much instantaneousEight secondsEight minutesEight hours47) In meteorology, what does the suffix -nimbus added to the name of a cloud indicate? It is at a low altitudeIt is at a high altitudeIt is vertically developedIt is precipitating48) What element, which has the atomic number 16 and is a bright yellow crystalline solid at room temperature, is referred to in the Bible as "brimstone"? magnesiumsulfurphosphoruschlorine49) The moons Io, Europa, Ganymede, and Callisto all orbit what planet? SaturnJupiterNeptuneUranus50) What unit of measurement, which is equal to 33,000 foot-pounds per minute, did 18th-century steam engine entrepreneur James Watt come up with? British Thermal Unitwatterghorsepower___ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Thank goodness I stopped at #10. I must be OL's scientific factual idiot.--Brantretreats to more defensible ignorance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 As a public service, here's a list of all the questions...Thanks for posting the entire list of questions and multiple choice answers.In looking through them, I see that there's another question that qualifies as among the "several" which Phil thinks that I couldn't have answered correctly because they contain information that was not yet known when I was in junior high:"What moon, the largest moon orbiting Saturn, is the only known object in the solar system other than Earth that is known to have liquid on its surface?"That's right, in Phil's mind, I couldn't possibly have known the answer based on knowledge acquired in junior high because, back then, Titan wasn't yet known to have liquid on its surface. Hah! Incontrovertible proof that I'm a liar!Maybe someone like Jonathan would like to do a pretty job of the formatting?Sure, I'll see if there's anything I can do when I have some time later.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 [....] I got one question wrong.Which one?"If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object?"The only question which required a calculation. ;-)Yes, and I'm not bashful about admitting that when it comes to math I qualify as a fucktard.(Btw, where does one click to find the emoticons with the revamped software? I'm not getting a list of formatting options -- but maybe the problem is the browser. For some reason, my Firefox doesn't work to sign in, so I'm using an old version of Safari.)Click on the smiley in the menu bar, and some emoticon options will (or should) appear below the message box.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Coates Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 Thanks to Ellen for posting the entire quiz, including (importantly) what were the choices offered: I was finding it hard to peel that easily off the newspaper's website.It's instructive to see which questions were good 'general knowledge' ones and which were not. Composing good tests in general is something that interests me. As a teacher, I've taken a lot of time designing them to cover the waterfront or be comprehensive as well as being fair. (I should probably post a few of them - from history, literature, language, etc. - for the simple enjoyment of having Brant, ND, Ellen, and Jonathan crap all over them? Nah. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I thought the questions pertaining to lizard names were more linguistic than scientific.Ba'al Chatzaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Thank goodness I stopped at #10. I must be OL's scientific factual idiot.--Brantretreats to more defensible ignoranceNo Brant, you would still have beaten me. So far I am the lowest of the low at 29 correct - 48%. 58%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 [....] I got one question wrong.Which one?"If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object?"The only question which required a calculation. ;-)Yes, and I'm not bashful about admitting that when it comes to math I qualify as a fucktard.I'm curious to know which answer you gave and why, since Larry often gets students doing it backward with questions like that. I'm wondering if you simply made a math mistake or if it was an issue of imagining the physics.Here's the question and options:22) If you were to apply a net force of one Newton on a 200 gram object, what would be the acceleration of the object? 5 meters per second squared2 meters per second squared0.2 meter per second squared50 meters per second squared(Btw, where does one click to find the emoticons with the revamped software? I'm not getting a list of formatting options -- but maybe the problem is the browser. For some reason, my Firefox doesn't work to sign in, so I'm using an old version of Safari.)Click on the smiley in the menu bar, and some emoticon options will (or should) appear below the message box.Thing is, I'm not getting a menu bar showing. I expect the problem is the browser.Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Hey wait! I just looked at the quiz againI (thanks Ellen) and I am 100% sure that I got the mitosis one right though it was marked wrong! I demand a recount, at least then I would be tied with Shane and not dead last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 In looking through [the questions and options], I see that there's another question that qualifies as among the "several" which Phil thinks that I couldn't have answered correctly because they contain information that was not yet known when I was in junior high:"What moon, the largest moon orbiting Saturn, is the only known object in the solar system other than Earth that is known to have liquid on its surface?"That's right, in Phil's mind, I couldn't possibly have known the answer based on knowledge acquired in junior high because, back then, Titan wasn't yet known to have liquid on its surface. Hah! Incontrovertible proof that I'm a liar!That question (30) is one of several which give away the answer in the wording. The "Thunderlizard" (4) was another. The object beyond Pluto another (31). Also 16, if one knows the Greek alphabet, 44 if one knows the story of Athena, and 14, 33, and 39 if one knows a bit of Greek.The wording of those and other questions is what leads me to think that the quizzer(s) just picked up some facts on a browse through Wikipedia and maybe a few other places and changed a word or two to make a question.Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9thdoctor Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Composing good tests in general is something that interests me. As a teacher, I've taken a lot of time designing them to cover the waterfront or be comprehensive as well as being fair. (I should probably post a few of them - from history, literature, language, etc. - for the simple enjoyment of having Brant, ND, Ellen, and Jonathan crap all over them? Nah. )Lest we forget how good Phil is at writing unambiguous word problems:http://www.objectivi...ndpost&p=105389Note, carefully, the edit stamps. The original question did not specify “open-topped”. Merlin and I immediately answered the original question correctly, only to be harangued by Phil that the problem was just too difficult for us, or for anyone on OL. That is except, of course, for Phil.Now that edit stamps are optional I suggest quoting Phil’s posts before answering him, since now he can cover his tracks much better. Owning up to mistakes isn’t characteristic behavior for him. Compare to here, when I was recently unhorsed by MSK. No big deal, I was wrong, he proved it, I acknowledged it. How would Phil have handled that? Unless you’re a newbie, you already know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Thanks to Ellen for posting the entire quiz, including (importantly) what were the choices offered: I was finding it hard to peel that easily off the newspaper's website.It's instructive to see which questions were good 'general knowledge' ones and which were not. Composing good tests in general is something that interests me. As a teacher, I've taken a lot of time designing them to cover the waterfront or be comprehensive as well as being fair. (I should probably post a few of them - from history, literature, language, etc. - for the simple enjoyment of having Brant, ND, Ellen, and Jonathan crap all over them? Nah. )Oh come on, Phil . I'd enjoy that kind of self-test and probably so would others, I have to think I would do better than on the science one!As to J, at first I did agree that he could not have learned so much in junior high, but thinking about it I tend to believe that he could. It all depends on what your teachers know and how far they go to encourage the students' interest in the subject . It just brought to mind my Grade 9 math teacher, Alma Douglas, a brilliant woman who explained binary theory and the birth of computers to us in (I think) 1966).She had a passion for her subject and didn't much care if anybody got it, as long as she got to talk about it. As far as I know nobody got it, I don't think anybody ever became a physicist, but you better believe we all passed math.Also, Jonathan is from Minnesota. I believe Laura Ingalls Wilders' husband was related to Rose.Think Little Symposium on the Prairie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George H. Smith Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 As Rand might have said, I have not taken this test, nor do I intend to. If I were to take the test. I know with contextual certainty that I would score higher than Phil did, for I am more intelligent than he is. My Roark-like confidence, however, precludes the need to prove my superiority. Ghs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I'm curious to know which answer you gave and why, since Larry often gets students doing it backward with questions like that. I'm wondering if you simply made a math mistake or if it was an issue of imagining the physics.I don't think that you're quite grasping my level of suckage at math. I didn't do any math. I came up with 2 meters per second squared because I guessed. It's really not an issue of not being able to imagine the physics. I can visually imagine the spatial/mechanical reasoning just fine. What I can't do is attach math to it.Thing is, I'm not getting a menu bar showing. I expect the problem is the browser.When you start typing a message, is there a little arrow pointing to the left in a tiny box at the top right in the message field's frame? If so, click it and a toolbar should appear at the top of the frame. If not, then you're probably right that it's the age of the browser, and time to download an upgrade if you can.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Thanks to Ellen for posting the entire quiz, including (importantly) what were the choices offered: I was finding it hard to peel that easily off the newspaper's website.It's instructive to see which questions were good 'general knowledge' ones and which were not. Composing good tests in general is something that interests me. As a teacher, I've taken a lot of time designing them to cover the waterfront or be comprehensive as well as being fair. (I should probably post a few of them - from history, literature, language, etc. - for the simple enjoyment of having Brant, ND, Ellen, and Jonathan crap all over them? Nah. )I'd be very interested in seeing test questions that you've designed, or anything else that's within your area of actual professional experience or expertise. Post them, and I for one will promise not to "crap all over them."J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I believe Laura Ingalls Wilders' husband was related to Rose.He was her dad.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 As Rand might have said, I have not taken this test, nor do I intend to. If I were to take the test. I know with contextual certainty that I would score higher than Phil did, for I am more intelligent than he is. My Roark-like confidence, however, precludes the need to prove my superiority. GhsBut not your need to mention it.George, George! Take the test, please. Don't tell anybody at all the score, escept me (I know what it would be anyway) and keep pretending you never took it, and I'll never tell anybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I believe Laura Ingalls Wilders' husband was related to Rose.He was her dad.JWoo-hoo! Which side of the blanket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 http://www.mozilla.o...US/firefox/new/This is the 8.0 version Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I believe Laura Ingalls Wilders' husband was related to Rose.He was her dad.JWoo-hoo! Which side of the blanket?The right side. Or at least I've always assumed. Why, do you know something about "Beth" and "Manly" that we don't?J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caroljane Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I believe Laura Ingalls Wilders' husband was related to Rose.He was her dad.JWoo-hoo! Which side of the blanket?The right side. Or at least I've always assumed. Why, do you know something about "Beth" and "Manly" that we don't?JI am sorry, excuse my levity. Probably I should engrave that on top of all my posts. I know who Rose Wilder Lane is, and I know Laura Ingalls Wilder only from "Little House" reruns on TV. That is the sum total of my knowledge, I made the connection of names for purely comic effect. I take it that you are serious and they are related. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Posted December 14, 2011 Share Posted December 14, 2011 I am sorry, excuse my levity. Probably I should engrave that on top of all my posts. I know who Rose Wilder Lane is, and I know Laura Ingalls Wilder only from "Little House" reruns on TV. That is the sum total of my knowledge, I made the connection of names for purely comic effect. I take it that you are serious and they are related.Ah. Yeah, Rose was the daughter of Laura Ingalls Wilder and Almanzo Wilder. I thought that you knew that, and that you were suggesting that maybe Rose was the love child of Almanzo and Nellie Oleson, or of Laura and Reverend Alden or something. Or maybe some kind of wicked three-way with Mr. Edwards.J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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