The motives of Wikileaks' Julian Assange

[George H. Smith]

Personally I take the tough love route. Those who get addicted and die will be a small number, but I would hate to see all of America turn into what is depicted in the TV show “Californication.” I would not want to live in that America and it is why I would not move to California. Many of the people there are degenerates, from drug use.

Having lived in California for nearly 30 years, I think I can speak for most Californians when I say that they would not want to live anywhere near you, either.

But I understand your point. We have the same problem with legalized free speech. It permits intellectual degenerates like you to write crap -- but such is the price we pay for freedom.

Ghs

[Peter]

Wow. I got walloped by George H. Smith, Daisy May! No, on the internet. What? Ham? Sweet potatoes? I can’t invite him to dinner, Babe. He’s still out there on the Left Coast.

George angrily wrote:

But I understand your point. We have the same problem with legalized free speech. It permits intellectual degenerates like you to write crap -- but such is the price we pay for freedom.

end quote

Sorry, George I was not thinking about you when I wrote that, despite any dubious wisps of correlation. I apologize to all decent, law-abiding Californians. Just don’t expect the rest of us to bail you out (the bankrupt state, not you George, . . . well, I could hire the Hell’s Angels to protect you if you are required to do hard time, but damn they are expensive!)

Shayne wrote:

The point is to not only keep it that way, but make it a place worthy of its founding ideals. That will never happen so long as false patriots defend it no matter what it does, or pretend that people like me are arguing for Somalia, anarchy, etc. just because we are arguing for actual rule of law.

end quote

Unworthy of our founding ideals? You cut me, Shayne. I AM thinking about the actual rule of law.

Alan Dershowitz, the Felix Frankfurter Professor of Law at Harvard Law School, on the Fox show Huckabee last night, was positive there was a moral wrong, but he was not sure if there was a legally punishable crime by Wikileaks.

Today, however, Newt Gingrich mentioned two new classifications to accommodate the computer and internet age, *criminal leaking* and if a death occurs because of the leaking, *terrorist leaking.*

There are the more mundane crimes of receiving stolen property, to consider if you are a prosecutor, exposing privileged information which is akin to a copyright violation, fomenting a riot or panic, and invasion of privacy and remarkably even *bullying* can be added to Wikileak’s list of legal crimes.

Terrorism, spying and espionage, can be tacked on to Wikileak’s list of hard - time crimes.

Wikileaks committed an act of war. Because of the military ties, the vulnerability of our military personnel in war zones, and real time tactical information divulged, I would also consider him a plain clothes, enemy spy or combatant.

Since the world is the stage for Wikileaks I would take him out wherever he is found, by black ops.

“Before I see M and Q, Miss Moneypenny, what is my assignment?”

“James, all I know is that it is a terrorist organization called Smersh / Wikileaks. Specifically, your target is the international criminal Julian Goldfinger.”

“Moneypenny, do you still have that Brazilian wax job done?”

Peter Taylor

Independent Objectivist

[sjw]

Wikileaks committed an act of war.

I might be more sympathetic with this view if it were considered an act of treason for any government representative to lie to the American public in order to manipulate them into supporting this or that, and if vast troves of innocuous data were not automatically stamped "secret", as if it should be the default policy to hide from Americans what the government is doing.

Wikileaks would not exist if governments were not authoritarian. It is purely a response to illegitimate government secrecy. And that is the context in which they should be judged.

Shayne

[George H. Smith]

George angrily wrote:

But I understand your point. We have the same problem with legalized free speech. It permits intellectual degenerates like you to write crap -- but such is the price we pay for freedom.

end quote

Sorry, George I was not thinking about you when I wrote that, despite any dubious wisps of correlation. I apologize to all decent, law-abiding Californians. Just don’t expect the rest of us to bail you out (the bankrupt state, not you George, . . . well, I could hire the Hell’s Angels to protect you if you are required to do hard time, but damn they are expensive!)

I wasn't angry when I wrote my comments; on the contrary, I had a smile on my face. You are too ignorant to make me angry.

And I didn't think that you had me in mind. Rather, I was commenting on your use of the smear "degenerate" to refer to people who don't think that you possess the secret of happiness and who would rather live on their terms.

Ghs

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

About Assange, he now has encrypted Dooms Day files in tens of thousands of computers of Internet users the world over. All he has to do is release the password and Pandora's box opens once again, but this time without filtering. See here:

WikiLeaks Ready to Release Giant 'Insurance' File if Shut Down

December 05, 2010

Fox News

From the article:

Julian Assange, the WikiLeaks founder, has circulated across the internet an encrypted "poison pill" cache of uncensored documents suspected to include files on BP and Guantanamo Bay.

One of the files identified this weekend by The Sunday Times — called the "insurance" file — has been downloaded from the WikiLeaks website by tens of thousands of supporters, from America to Australia.

Assange warns that any government that tries to curtail his activities risks triggering a new deluge of state and commercial secrets.

. . .

One of the key files available for download — named insurance.aes256 — appears to be encrypted with a 256-digit key. Experts said last week it was virtually unbreakable.

I have to admit, even though I do not think what he is doing will result in anything in the long run except make the world a more dangerous place to live in and ultimately make governments more repressive than they already are, I sure like it when people who abuse power get exposed.

All hell is breaking loose and, frankly, there is a part of me that is enjoying this immensely.

Michael

[RidleyReport]

Ron Paul: Wikileaks isn't the problem

America's "leader of the genuine opposition" decries calls for Julian Assange's assassination.

This is an illustrated version of Congressman Paul's December 6, 2010 audio broadcast.

[Selene]

About Assange, he now has encrypted Dooms Day files in tens of thousands of computers of Internet users the world over. All he has to do is release the password and Pandora's box opens once again, but this time without filtering. See here:

WikiLeaks Ready to Release Giant 'Insurance' File if Shut Down

December 05, 2010

Fox News

From the article:

Julian Assange, the WikiLeaks founder, has circulated across the internet an encrypted "poison pill" cache of uncensored documents suspected to include files on BP and Guantanamo Bay.

One of the files identified this weekend by The Sunday Times — called the "insurance" file — has been downloaded from the WikiLeaks website by tens of thousands of supporters, from America to Australia.

Assange warns that any government that tries to curtail his activities risks triggering a new deluge of state and commercial secrets.

. . .

One of the key files available for download — named insurance.aes256 — appears to be encrypted with a 256-digit key. Experts said last week it was virtually unbreakable.

I have to admit, even though I do not think what he is doing will result in anything in the long run except make the world a more dangerous place to live in and ultimately make governments more repressive than they already are, I sure like it when people who abuse power get exposed.

All hell is breaking loose and, frankly, there is a part of me that is enjoying this immensely.

Michael

Michael:

I completely agree that the potential to make the world much more dangerous is clearly a potentiality, but this "insurance file" is just a logical progression using the technology, as Brant has noted to protect his ass and his organization. I am developing a lot of respect for the spooky wiki dude!

Hell, it is just like the classic "letter" that is mailed to the newspaper or the secret person for "protection" against being vanished:

1) Meet John Doe...he mails the letter before he is going to jump;

2) Shawshank Redemption..."Would you be so kind to put this in your afternoon mail..." and of course it includes all the records on the warden's network of corruption;

3) all throughout fiction this method is used and, essentially, fiction is a reflection of reality.

Well world, welcome to reality.

Adam

[sjw]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/dec/05/julian-assange-lawyers-being-watched

[Selene]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

[sjw]

Very interesting exchange between Judge Napolitano and Newt Gingrich:

http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/freedom-watch/index.html#/v/4447651/gingrich-assange-is-an-active-enemy-combatant

Shayne

[sjw]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

[Selene]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

And only Italian criminals engage in that behavior according to your initial statement.

[Peter]

Michael wrote:

All hell is breaking loose and, frankly, there is a part of me that is enjoying this immensely.

end quote

It is fun, isn’t it, to see those grand poobahs squirm? I think the release about Hillary nixed her possibility for a “grass roots” challenge to J’Obama in 2012, and lessened her ability to function as Secretary of State. In the long term, this information could also lessen Obama’s chances of winning in 2012. The truth will out. Hoo-Rah!

A regret for me, would be that some people, including American soldiers are put at greater risk, and some people who were investigated as in Belgium, but who were later cleared, are being smeared once again with the same false allegations.

Peter

[Peter]

Shayne wrote:

I might be more sympathetic with this view if it were considered an act of treason for any government representative to lie to the American public . . . Wikileaks would not exist if governments were not authoritarian. It is purely a response to illegitimate government secrecy. And that is the context in which they should be judged.

end quote

Well said, but some lies are legitimate and necessary to protect lies. Uh, I mean to protect lives. I am glad to see anti-authoritarian Tea Party people shouting to their government representatives, “You work for me!”

I just received my copy of the coveted “Limbaugh Letter,” and in it he interviews Stanley Kurtz, author of the new book, “Radical – in – Chief: Barack Obama and the Untold Story of American Socialism.”

Rush: What also amazes me was that you found the paper trail. For my readers, what did you find? And how did you find it?

Kurtz: Well, for one thing he glancingly mentions in his own memoir that he had attended some socialist conferences when he was in New York. By looking at the records of socialist organizations in New York, I was able to figure it out. I combined his own acknowledgements with my discovery of his name on a sign-up sheet of the Archives of the Democratic Socialists of America, and it became clear, which conferences he had attended. Then I set about to laboriously reconstruct what actually happened at those conferences. When I did, I recognized that, wow, the program of Obama’s entire political career was laid out at these early socialist conferences he went to. Then I was able to find the records of some very poorly known and understood community organizing groups that Obama was actually very, very closely tied to. It took me a while to figure out that he was very closely tied to this group, but I recognized that when I unearthed their records. I wouldn’t have believed it if I hadn’t read it there in black and white, but it really is a kind of conspiracy theory come to life. These community organizers who were Barack Obama’s mentors and colleagues, were socialists and they were self-consciously secretive about their socialism, and you can read their writings back and forth to each other: “Here’s what we need to do about socialism” ; “Here’s why we need to keep it quiet.” It was really quite amazing . . . .

. . . . Most of the people in these community organizations were veterans of the SDS, the radical student organization from the 1960’s. Most people don’t know this, but after the 1960’s, the remaining strong socialist radicals of the SDS formed their own socialist group. It was called The New American Movement, and for a while they still believed that American capitalism was about to collapse, that there would be a revolution . . . .

. . . . Obama went to a series of Socialist Scholars’ Conferences in New York when he lived there between about 1983 and 1985, and at those conferences a focus of a great deal of the talk was on how community organizing was a key socialist strategy . . . .

. . . . I’m actually reluctant to use the word “lie.” Most of the time I say “misrepresent,” or “didn’t tell the truth.” But in the chapter on ACORN I come right out and say that he lied. We have very clear statements from Obama during the 2008 campaign that his only involvement with ACORN was representing them in one legal case, but I have unearthed many, many documents that show a long and intimate relationship between Obama and ACORN. Okay, he lied. He shows his credibility in general about his past is not good. But really, what we’re seeing is something that goes beyond lying because there is literally a stealth strategy.

By the way, one of the most important theorists of stealth socialist community organizing was an advisor to Obama’s 2008 presidential campaign, Harry Boyte. He wrote a major memo that Obama personally signed off on, about how to coordinate Obama’s campaign and probably his later White House activity with grassroots organizations . . . So that wasn’t just a lie, it was a conscious pattern of manipulation in which you don’t tell people what you really believe.

End quote

There are small lies Shayne, and then there are whoppers.

Peter

[Peter]

George wrote:

You are too ignorant to make me angry.

end quote

Objectivist Living, I am a fan of Ghs with misgivings, but only about his ultimate intentions/recipe for this country I love.

I do not completely believe I am too ignorant George, whether I am being grandiose or not, because you read what I write.

Just as I think Wikileaks founder Julius Assange, is an enemy of the United States, so I believe with reason that you think of Me, if not all ARI Objectivists in general, as your “puny enemies.” Perhaps I am also a “useful idiot.”

Oh, and you would need to include Ayn Rand in the ARI group 8-)

As always, it is good to hear from you. You have been more caustic lately. Are you feeling OK? Is there a paucity of content here lately, making it harder to suffer the fools?

Don’t worry. We are in for interesting times. Put your money in short term CD’s. Get out of the cities. Create a Mormon Closet. Get an electrical generator. Own a gun.

Peter Taylor

Independent Objectivist

[Selene]

Peter:

He was exposed as a marxist as early as 2002-2003 by a number of us in my political circles. Unfortunately, we could never break through the smothering media blanket that covered him.

His campaign had an entire internet division which was dedicated to disinformation and controlling that medium with operatives. A cursory reading of some of my posts during the 2008 campaign clearly explained this.

And yet, here we are, stunned, discussing this menace on this excellent forum and wondering what the hell happened, and is happening, to our country, our freedoms and probably our physical persons.

I am sure these conversations took place in a number of countries that fell to marxism, fascism and centralized statism.

But, don't worry, it can't happen here.

Adam

[Peter]

Adam wrote:

His campaign had an entire internet division which was dedicated to disinformation and controlling that medium with operatives. A cursory reading of some of my posts during the 2008 campaign clearly explained this.

end quote

What is different now, Adam, is that his socialist policies have been put into the visual range. Yet the government owned press and visual media will not expose anything derogatory about a President who has clumsily lied, many, many times. He is always given a pass.

What evil creatures of the night, are the press. If a republican lied he would be ambushed over and over again, ridiculed, and be put up in front of a censure board.

I remember Sean Hannity hammering away at Obama’s lies and associates before the election, to no avail. But the author Rush interviewed can footnote his sources.

When this nightmare is over, heads should roll. What official vetted Obama to be a Senator? Who vetted him to be President? How could a guy who could not get a secret clearance if he had enlisted in the Army, get Presidential clearance and have his finger on the button?

Peter

[DavidMcK]

I agree Michael, and it is hard to see how anyone could die from finding out that Karzai (the head of Afghanistan) is getting rich from drug smuggling...except maybe Karzai.

[Selene]

I agree Michael, and it is hard to see how anyone could die from finding out that Karzai (the head of Afghanistan) is getting rich from drug smuggling...except maybe Karzai.

Correct. In fact, this is the leverage that we have over that slug. We are his protection and if we split, he is a dead man walking.

[Selene]

Adam wrote:

His campaign had an entire internet division which was dedicated to disinformation and controlling that medium with operatives. A cursory reading of some of my posts during the 2008 campaign clearly explained this.

end quote

What is different now, Adam, is that his socialist policies have been put into the visual range. Yet the government owned press and visual media will not expose anything derogatory about a President who has clumsily lied, many, many times. He is always given a pass.

What evil creatures of the night, are the press. If a republican lied he would be ambushed over and over again, ridiculed, and be put up in front of a censure board.

I remember Sean Hannity hammering away at Obama's lies and associates before the election, to no avail. But the author Rush interviewed can footnote his sources.

When this nightmare is over, heads should roll. What official vetted Obama to be a Senator? Who vetted him to be President? How could a guy who could not get a secret clearance if he had enlisted in the Army, get Presidential clearance and have his finger on the button?

Peter

Peter:

You still do not comprehend how far this has gone. That is not a criticism, but we are one crisis away from serious overt national emergency type repression. As we, in the past, have war gamed or strategically gamed in politics, government or in insurgency campaigns, the capacity exists.

The capacity to slam the door shut on communications exists. How would you communicate if the state closes that door? Carrier pigeons? Hell, during the run up to the American Revolution, we established Committees of Correspondence. Today, what do we have? Internet blogs and forums which can be shut down in a heartbeat.

This marxist and his minions do not care what you or I think. They know where you live dude.

Adam

[sjw]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

And only Italian criminals engage in that behavior according to your initial statement.

I think the word "mafia" has a more general meaning than you seem to think...

Shayne

[Selene]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

And only Italian criminals engage in that behavior according to your initial statement.

I think the word "mafia" has a more general meaning than you seem to think...

Shayne

Like other prejudicial words that describe a group have? So when you hear or read the word mafia, you think of:

1) Russian Jewish folks from Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY? Or

2) Jamaican Rasti gangs? Or,

3) Sicilian Italian mobsters? Or,

4) None of the above?

[sjw]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

And only Italian criminals engage in that behavior according to your initial statement.

I think the word "mafia" has a more general meaning than you seem to think...

Shayne

Like other prejudicial words that describe a group have? So when you hear or read the word mafia, you think of:

1) Russian Jewish folks from Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY? Or

2) Jamaican Rasti gangs? Or,

3) Sicilian Italian mobsters? Or,

4) None of the above?

4. I just think of lawless parasitical thugs. Genghis Kahn of the modern age.

Shayne

[sjw]

Followup on the Greenwald/Aftergood debate:

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/12/03/wikileaks

[Selene]

US State department using mafia tactics on Assange's lawyer: http://www.guardian....s-being-watched

So, Italian criminals sit outside his lawyer's house reading newspapers, this is what you get from that article?

I think they are intimating threatening action toward his lawyer.

Shayne

And only Italian criminals engage in that behavior according to your initial statement.

I think the word "mafia" has a more general meaning than you seem to think...

Shayne

Like other prejudicial words that describe a group have? So when you hear or read the word mafia, you think of:

1) Russian Jewish folks from Brighton Beach in Brooklyn NY? Or

2) Jamaican Rasti gangs? Or,

3) Sicilian Italian mobsters? Or,

4) None of the above?

4. I just think of lawless parasitical thugs. Genghis Kahn of the modern age.

Shayne

"US State department using lawless thug like tactics on Assange's lawyer" would be a more rational, factual and less prejudiced statement...correct?