Michael Stuart Kelly Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 There is simply nothing to be gained from my perspective by continuing any type of dialog with someone so twisted.Bob,Well then what did you gain by doing so just now?The people reading this certainly didn't gain anything.Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Roger said this:"Treating women like shit" and "denying all possibility of love" are not equivalent to violations of rights, unless force or fraud is involved,"The statement itself is self-contradictory for crying out loud!BobTreating women as walking wombs and brood mares for the human race is as old as our species. Mostly women (particularly in primitive societies) are conditioned from childhood to accept this role. Does this mean their rights have been violated? No. If women accept this fate because their parents and guardians trained them to, it may be unfortunate (for the women) but it is not rights violation.Same argument for sexual abuse then - not abuse by your logic. Nice. I'm shocked, shocked I say, that someone like you might think this way!!!Never saw that comin'....NOT!BobFor the record, this is two non-Objectivists arguing with each other. Two Bobs, something else they have in common. --Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmacwilliam Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 There is simply nothing to be gained from my perspective by continuing any type of dialog with someone so twisted.Bob,Well then what did you gain by doing so just now?The people reading this certainly didn't gain anything.MichaelYou sure about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 You sure about that?Bob,Absolutely.When a person thinks an insult is a gain or of value to others, it is time to check a premise or two. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rush242 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 There is simply nothing to be gained from my perspective by continuing any type of dialog with someone so twisted. Big hunks of reality just seem to fly right on by. Good luck with that...That's certainly not true because you happened to state your self-serving conclusion again.That you aren't happy with the choices those women made, or that you find them distasteful does not mean their rights were violated, anymore than a glance at aggregate statistics means that the individuals involved had their rights violated either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmacwilliam Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 There is simply nothing to be gained from my perspective by continuing any type of dialog with someone so twisted. Big hunks of reality just seem to fly right on by. Good luck with that...That's certainly not true because you happened to state your self-serving conclusion again.That you aren't happy with the choices those women made, or that you find them distasteful does not mean their rights were violated, anymore than a glance at aggregate statistics means that the individuals involved had their rights violated either.Yeah, how 'bout that choice of female genital mutilation - just a cultural 'choice' is it? No rights violations there either.Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rush242 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Yeah, how 'bout that choice of female genital mutilation - just a cultural 'choice' is it? No rights violations there either.Yeah Bob, that one qualifies, mostly because they have to hold those girls down and force it on them.But let's be clear: noting an actual rights violation doesn't make your case that any of the rest of them are rights violations either. Certainly not grown woman choosing to live in polygamy, or aggregate statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Same argument for sexual abuse then - not abuse by your logic. Nice. I'm shocked, shocked I say, that someone like you might think this way!!!Never saw that comin'....NOT!BobI think you missed my point.How do you distinguish any form of value indoctrination imposed on youngsters from child abuse? If one teaches young girls that their main function is to bear young, is that child abuse?If one teaches a religious doctrine to youngsters is that child abuse?Ba'al Chatzaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 Bob M,I'm tired of the bad vibes. I don't want them here.Let's take a breather.Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmacwilliam Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Same argument for sexual abuse then - not abuse by your logic. Nice. I'm shocked, shocked I say, that someone like you might think this way!!!Never saw that comin'....NOT!BobHow do you distinguish any form of value indoctrination imposed on youngsters from child abuse? I do not deny the need for clarity on this, but that was not your point. Your point was that there was NO difference between education and indoctrination. The line can be fuzzy sure, but NOT at the extremes. There it's clear.It's pretty clear that basic math education say, is on one side of the line, and fundamentalist muslim female 'education' is on the other.Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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