Your TAS Dollars at Work

[Roger Bissell]

"Senor d'Anconia, what do you think is going to happen to TAS?"

"Just exactly what it deserves."

[Ellen Stuttle]

It's horribly sad, I feel, for TAS to self-destruct like this. I'm more distressed about it than I could have expected I'd be, and I'm not even seeing a way a plausible recovery could be made.

Does anyone know whether David knew about this invitation to Linz?

Ellen

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[Chris Grieb]

Ellen;

I can't see Will Thomas doing this on his own.

What I find most disturbing about this whole episode is there has been no comment from Ed Hudgins. He reads this forum and occasionally contributes.

I agree with Michael's thoughts on this subject.

[Neil Parille]

I would also note that Mr. Perigo is accusing me again of receiving orders from Barbara Branden, in spite of the fact that on at least 2 occasions I have specifically told Mr. Perigo (on SOLO, for all the world to see) that this is not the case. This guy is going to talk about problems with Objectivism?

[Wolf DeVoon]

"Objectivist ideas need steady and powerful advocacy in the culture at large, to keep reminding people who have been inspired by Rand's ideas what they mean" -- Will Thomas, 7/19/07

TAS doesn't talk to 'the culture at large.' And I don't need anyone to remind me or educate me about Howard Roark. I participate here at OL because it's low cost, friendly, diverse, and challenging. The last thing in the world I would do is spend a couple thousand bucks being hectored and bored to death. This cheery 'Ain't We Swell' cottage industry stuff bugs the heck out of me. What the world needs is another Ayn Rand-caliber novelist. Nothing less.

Okay, I'm done. Apologies to all for losing my temper again.

W.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

What the world needs is another Ayn Rand-caliber novelist.

Wolf,

Hear hear!

Enough mediocrity masquerading as Ayn Rand's progeny.

Look at their works! That says it all.

Michael

[Robert Campbell]

As I understand the process, decisions about Summer Seminar speakers are Will Thomas's responsibility.

However, Will reports to Ed Hudgins and it's hard to believe that he wouldn't consult Ed in a case like this.

Since Ed became the executive director, David Kelley has been officially out of the loop on these decisions. In most cases, he genuinely has nothing to do with them. With regard to Lindsay Perigo, could he have been consulted? I should hope they would have asked his advice, but I don't know.

What is extremely hard to believe is that David wouldn't have known about this decision. We're talking about a small organization. With the exception of Will, they all work out of the same office.

I've emailed all three. So far I've heard back from none, but it is a weekend.

As for Ed's not commenting here, perhaps he is trying to figure out what his options are for damage control.

But then, how did anyone at the TAS office imagine that they wouldn't need to do damage control, if they decided to bring Mr. Perigo in?

Robert Campbell

[Chris Grieb]

Robert;

I am going to the TOC office tomorrow and speak at least to Gene Holloway. If Ed or David are there I will speak to them.

One of my problems is I don't see an up side to this. There are other people who add much more than Lindsay.

If anyone asks I will list them.

[James Heaps-Nelson]

Robert;

I am going to the TOC office tomorrow and speak at least to Gene Holloway. If Ed or David are there I will speak to them.

One of my problems is I don't see an up side to this. There are other people who add much more than Lindsay.

If anyone asks I will list them.

A lot of that is location dependent, Chris. I think Orange County in 2006 was a perfect time to have both Brandens at the Summer Seminar. I had my reservations, but the event went really, really well. Portland is as close to Linz's home turf in the US as possible with a lot of his old friends there. I just saw Samantha Johnston show up on Solopassion and hopefully she'll be able to attend at least part of the event. Besides, Portland is the home of microbrews and you know what Lindsay brings in that department :devil:

Jim

[Chris Grieb]

Jim; I have a new post on politeness. Since I wrote it I recommend it. I don't like drunken louts and I am a little surprised you do.

I guess micro-brews aren't that big for me.

[Jonathan]

You know, it's possible that TAS is hoping that, in locking in Pigero as a speaker now, in couple of months they'll be able to promote the fact that they've scheduled a world leader to speak at their event. If you'll recall, Pigero's little militia of emotional toddlers is semi-secretly plotting to violently overthrow the government of New Zealand (a nation which will likely be renamed "The Pigero Islands" shortly after the coup). If it all goes down within the next couple of months, just think of the international exposure that TAS will receive from having Generalissimo Pigero at their seminar pooping his military fatigues over other people's tastes in music!

J

P.S. An overly ornate military costume seems to be the perfect outfit for Pigero, especially when you imagine him waving around his favorite accessory -- his golden, pomposity-powered air conducting baton.

Edited January 6, 2008 by Jonathan

[william.scherk]

I've emailed all three [Hudgins, Kelley, Thomas]. So far I've heard back from none, but it is a weekend.

I'm more distressed about it than I could have expected I'd be, and I'm not even seeing a way a plausible recovery could be made.

Interesting observations here and in the parallel thread at Lair of Ogres. I tend to take a spectator stance. A spectator of the Theatre of Ick.

Considering the really icky and irksome thread that occasioned at the Lair upon Lindsay's invitation to Ed Hudgins, considering the resultant flap, and considering the tactics and strategies of Hudgins and Lindsay . . . who knows? Do these people communicate directly? **

__________________________

** A Challenge to Ed Hudgins - May 15, 2006. In apparent response to a Hudgins post at RoR.

Hudgins: "But what I don't understand is the rage, anger, name-calling and obsession with

denunciations. It has to do with a profound misunderstanding about morality

sanctioning and an unrealistic, non-objective view of human beings. For example,

one can judge Nathaniel Branden harshly for how he handled his relations with

Ayn Rand and still recognize his excellent, cutting-edge work in psychology

where he applied Objectivism. One might admire the interesting thoughts and

insights of Linz, regret his name-calling and other failings and see the

situation as sad and tragic."

Perigo: "Now, I know not the detailed context in which Ed posted that, and I care not to find out. I would just like to say the following to him, directly and personally:

Ed, come over here and say these things to me directly and personally."

Me, for sheer entertainment, and the opportunity to see up close some of the players in the O-league, I gotta collect my pennies to be in Portland. For those who will shun the Perigo effusions, make sure you give me some advance questions to put to the Emperor of SOLO.

What was so stupid about Perigo's and Church Lady's appearance at Borders contra Barbara's "Objectivist Rage" -- the fact that Perigo dodges confrontation if it comes in forms not under his control. Would he stay on his front porch, spitting tobacco juice and gumming up the ears of his porchmates with "Evil Witch," "Scum," "Lying Bitch," "Evil, lying, scummy bitch witch"?

Oh yes.

So, looks like Hudgins and his minions have gotten Emperigo off the island and into the sharkpit. Surely the Q&A following the bellowing will be a must-see piece of Objectivist Theatre.

[Robert Campbell]

WSS,

You're right that the Q&A following either of Mr. Perigo's orations in Portland will be prime Theater of Ick. Worthy of preservation on Hi-Def digital video, and worldwide distribution on YouTube.

Unless, of course, Mr. Perigo follows through on his threatened request for bodyguards.

Can you see him being hustled offstage by big guys with trenchcoats and earpieces, after an announcement that the question and answer period has been cancelled for security reasons?

What a disappointment...

But it can't be ruled out. For Mr. Perigo seems to think his opponents are poised to set upon him, in the manner of Grand Kloogles on the bedsheet circuit.

Robert Campbell

[Ellen Stuttle]

What is extremely hard to believe is that David wouldn't have known about this decision. We're talking about a small organization. With the exception of Will, they all work out of the same office.

Right; that's what I'm thinking, too, hard to believe David wouldn't have known, though I'm holding out the hope that he didn't.

I keep remembering the first occasion when I met David, circa 35 years ago: A restaurant, the New Haven area. Raymond Knapp had arranged a dinner gathering. Robert Knapp, a friend of his named Bob Rubenstein, Larry and me, I think Evan Picoult; maybe Debbie Goldstein was there, though I don't think Shosh was. The table was a rectangular one; the foyer entrance of the restaurant was to the left of the long side at which I was sitting. David strode in, so confident and intelligent-looking, the trim figure, the clean-cut features. He looked like a good guy from an AR novel. Robert described him afterward as "like a young conqueror."

Hurts to think of the young man I met all those years ago acceding to an invitation to Linz Perigo -- as Linz Perigo is now -- to speak at the Summer Seminar. Maybe David just doesn't know what goes on in the O'ist world at large, of course. Could be Ivory Tower head-in-the-clouds unawareness.

Ellen

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[Martin Radwin]

It certainly would have been perversely entertaining listening to Mr. Perigo screaming "Saddamite" at anyone in attendance not sufficiently enamored of his worship of an American foreign policy of perpetual war for perpetual peace, wars in which Mr. Perigo will regretfully not be able to participate due to previous commitments. But now that Saddam is dead, he'll need a new label for such heretics. "Musharrafite" might work, but Musharraf is our dictator, after all, and we American taxpayers do send him a hell of a lot of money, even though most of us, given a choice, would much rather allocate our money to more worthy causes. And "Admadinejadite" just doesn't have the right ring to it. So Mr. Perigo had better think long and hard about this, in order to come up with an appropriately pleasant sounding label. This should require all of the deep philosophical introspection of which Mr. Perigo is capable.

Martin

[James Heaps-Nelson]

Jim; I have a new post on politeness. Since I wrote it I recommend it. I don't like drunken louts and I am a little surprised you do.

I guess micro-brews aren't that big for me.

You know, with all of the talk of politeness, and I think of myself as a reasonably polite guy, the one person I haven't seen a lot of politeness or courtesy to here is Ayn Rand. For all of Perigo's faults, that's definitely one thing he's gotten right. And no, I'm not a big drinker beyond the free Guinness every so often for playing music at the local Irish pub, but damn, I think there's few people around here who could use a drink.

Jim

[Dragonfly]

You know, with all of the talk of politeness, and I think of myself as a reasonably polite guy, the one person I haven't seen a lot of politeness or courtesy to here is Ayn Rand. For all of Perigo's faults, that's definitely one thing he's gotten right.

Oh, really? I can't remember anyone calling Rand here a pomowanker, saddamite, piece of shit, limp-dick, scumbag, to name a few names Perigo uses against other Objectivists, and of which he's no doubt very proud (soo original! soo KASS!). Of course he has little else to be proud of.

Quite comical is his latest muscle flexing: "Instructive, but not surprising, that none of the witch-hunters has the guts to front up here and confront me directly." Ha ha, how often does the fierce Perigo confront his opponents on their turf? What a big hero!

[Wolf DeVoon]

For the record I need a drink. Maybe five.

[James Heaps-Nelson]

You know, with all of the talk of politeness, and I think of myself as a reasonably polite guy, the one person I haven't seen a lot of politeness or courtesy to here is Ayn Rand. For all of Perigo's faults, that's definitely one thing he's gotten right.

Oh, really? I can't remember anyone calling Rand here a pomowanker, saddamite, piece of shit, limp-dick, scumbag, to name a few names Perigo uses against other Objectivists, and of which he's no doubt very proud (soo original! soo KASS!). Of course he has little else to be proud of.

Quite comical is his latest muscle flexing: "Instructive, but not surprising, that none of the witch-hunters has the guts to front up here and confront me directly." Ha ha, how often does the fierce Perigo confront his opponents on their turf? What a big hero!

Dragonfly,

I think the highlight here for me was when there was a discussion of whether Ayn Rand admired a serial killer named Hickman when she was young. The list of things I find to be annoying here could fill an encyclopedia. I'm sure there are things people find annoying about the Summer Seminars but my approach is to go find the good stuff I like. Chris Grieb was at the Summer Seminar in 2004 in Vancouver. He and I were sitting at the same final banquet table.

Lindsay Perigo was not drunk. I didn't know him at the time, but I saw him unobtrusively chatting with a few people in the common room and like everyone else enjoying the atmosphere. Unfortunately, I didn't get to hear his talk because I was only there for the last two days of the Seminar. I'm very much looking forward to hearing him speak this year.

[Jonathan]

Quite comical is his latest muscle flexing: "Instructive, but not surprising, that none of the witch-hunters has the guts to front up here and confront me directly." Ha ha, how often does the fierce Perigo confront his opponents on their turf? What a big hero!

Yeah, that is pretty funny. Many of us have confronted him many times in the past on his own turf, usually with substantive arguments to which he would respond with nothing more than childish temper tantrums or whining about what a poor little victim he was of "Linz-bashing." As far as I'm concerned, there's no reason to believe that confronting him directly now would result in his suddenly offering intelligent arguments rather than throwing hissy fits or banning those whose arguments he can't deal with. I see no value in interacting with the emotionally unstable twit.

J

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Me, for sheer entertainment, and the opportunity to see up close some of the players in the O-league, I gotta collect my pennies to be in Portland. For those who will shun the Perigo effusions, make sure you give me some advance questions to put to the Emperor of SOLO.

William,

Actually I do have a question you can submit to him, since I have emails from Perigo to back this up. Ask him how sending a person to sexually seduce others to get information (like he tried to do with Michael Newberry at the time) fits in with his view of an Objectivist strategy to save the world. I thought Objectivism looked down on prostitution, albeit defended the freedom of the individual to choose to be a whore.

(Just lowering the bar a bit... )

Michael

[syrakusos]

My 2 cents from RoR:

Come to the TAS Summer Seminar and engage Linz in a 100-against-1 argument in which everyone demands to know who he thinks he is and what justification he now offers for everything he ever said or did. Compete in a shouting match in which a crowd corners an egomaniac. Linz will suck the mental energy from the audience and use it to engorge his projection of himself on himself.

[Robert Campbell]

I have now heard from Will Thomas.

His email to me is civil in tone, but I see no sign that Will understands Lindsay Perigo.

For instance, he seems to be under the impression that Jim Valliant has dried up and blown away and that Mr. Perigo is no longer stirring up any significant dissension with his campaign against "the Brandens."

Quite often those who are not personally motivated by narcissism or a desire to dominate fail to understand those who are. But in Rand-land, as well in some other walks of life, innocence about these matters can be hazardous.

More later, but it is clear that the decision was Will's and there is no sign that he expected, or expects, any objection from Ed Hudgins.

Robert Campbell

[Brant Gaede]

Sorry Clemson lost to NC on that 3-pointer, but then, you weren't at the game now, were you Robert?

--Brant

Edited January 7, 2008 by Brant Gaede

[Mike Hardy]

Has the TAS Summer Seminar schedule been posted? Perigo has to come from New Zealand and that is an expansive proposition.

Sorry, Chris, but that typo -- expAnsive -- is too appropriate to pass by. ;-) "ExpAnsive proposition," both geographically and bloviatingly indeed.

If they really are inviting Perrigo...how can they present any facade of intellectual seriousness?

Ellen

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Geez, where's Roland Pericles? -- Mike Hardy