Autistic Spectrum Disorders

[CNA]

Kat, yeah, I so agree, it's not the easiest thing in the world. But once the dx comes in, it helps put closure to it in a sense to that aspect of it of not knowing. And from there, it opens so many gates to understanding more. Chris had an obsession with spinning objects when very young but has grown out of that. Looking at my son now, he doesn't have many obsessions. His biggest challenges right now are his speech and slowing him down and fine motor skills but he is improving slowly but surely. He is more active than most. He also had a problem with gaze. He wouldn't hold a person's gaze. But that aspect has also disappeared. My friend Rick (29 y/o I think) that I've posted about is the same way with holding a person's gaze. And as usual have asked questions about this as well and was given some interesting answers. I'm always so curious about everything and have a tendency to ask many many questions, watching, etc., just for my own sake in understanding. I have an insatiable need to understand.

One thing I've noticed is the disorder isn't really concrete and typical for each kid and their symptoms; say for instance, like depression, etc., where most have the same symptoms but can still have a few symptoms that fall outside of that bracket. Chris showed many of the typical traits of an austistic child but those traits that are typical have disappeared. Even his doctors have made comments that he is showing less and less autistic traits which I find interesting. BUT, he still shows traits that are common with autism, such as his fine motor skill problems, and speech, social aspects, etc. Yes, there is no cure but progress is always made. A good example of tremendous amounts of progress being made is Dan Marino's autistic child. According to my understanding, he was more profound than high functioning autistics. But was put into rigorous therapy, etc., and has made tremendous mile stones through the years. The last interview I saw with him, you couldn't even tell he was autistic and the autistic traits were very very mild. Another interesting aspect of it.

Another famous person I suspect as being possibly autistic was Howard Hughes. One major trait with him was echolia where the person echos other people's words or trails off at the end of the sentence and saying the words numerous times; such as, I want to go to the store, store, etc. Roger got this one down with his post about Taggart's saying, don't bother me, don't bother me, don't bother me. But seems Howard Hughes had other problems aside from autistic traits.

There is no cure but massive amounts of progress can be made. Dan Marino's son is a great example of this. Chris has also been a great example of this. I'm sure your baby Sean has also made tremendous amounts of progress, especially finding a best friend which is not easy for autistic kids.

Angie

[CNA]

In reference to being so curious about everything and always asking many many questions, when it comes to human behavior as well as a few other interests of mine and why they do what they do, I have a tendency to ask many many many questions and I sometimes get very interesting answers. I know myself extremely well as I've asked myself question after question and have always answered those questions as to what I was doing and why and have been doing this for the past 17 years or so. I also do this with people that I am friends with that also enjoy making new discoveries about themselves and those around them, those who are as curious as I am. Rick is one of them. Our personalities are very very similar. When we get together and talk sometimes for many hours, we are always engaged in asking questions and answering those questions, making observations, etc. as to why we personally do what we do and at times "brutally" honest with each other. I very much cherish the time we spend together. We always have fun and the conversation is always intriguing and very much thought provoking.

Angie

[gary williams]

Dang, I forgot about this peach of a thread.

Fran,

Thanks for the info. And you got a 25 also? Well, you know what they say about great minds!

Roger works at Disneyland? Hmm? I wonder if I can guess which Dwarf he is?

WSS,

Glad to see you. You have made yourself scarce of late.

gw

[william.scherk]

WSS,

Glad to see you. You have made yourself scarce of late.

My postings have been few, true . . . but have been lurking happily in the O-zone. It's a busy time at work (I am an HR manager for a silviculture company) and I have also been taking a step back for analysis . . . I appreciate your greeting.

-- I am taking Jenna's advice and cooking up a blog to replace my ersatz New Blog 46, which is already stale and a chore to maintain.

I scored an 8 on the adult autism quotient, dang. I am wondering (not concluding) if there is any relation between the autism quotient and the emotional deafness/malevolence found in the occasional ravings of certain O-ists . . .

[gary williams]

WSS,

Taking Jenna's advice is usually a good thing.

I look forward to your new blog.

gw

[JennaW]

I got a 17-- average-- where most people score, except I score where the men score usually. Oliver Sacks wrote some stories on autism-- especially musical or numerically inclined autism. But in general, his books are very human, very interesting, and very insightful. He's also a good writer and you can tell he's very observant and caring through his words and descriptions.

[CNA]

Hi, Jenna.

My son was dxd as being a high functioning Autistic. Since the diagnosis, I've done much research into it, have many doctors and therapists for Chris, etc.

Actually boys are 4 times more likely to be dxd with Autism, (they typically score at 32 or higher) and Autism is more common than most people think it is. When girls are affected, the disorder is more profound for them.

From the National Autistic Society

"Why are boys far more likely to develop autism than girls?

It is not difficult to demonstrate the fact that there are more boys with autistic spectrum disorders than girls. Hans Asperger originally believed that no girls were affected by the syndrome he described in 1944, although clinical evidence later caused him to revise this statement. In Kanner's 1943 study of a small group of children with autistic syndrome there were four times as many boys as girls; and in their much larger study of Asperger syndrome in mainstream schools in Sweden in 1993, Ehlers and Gillberg found the same male to female ratio of 4:1. The ratio of male to female clients in NAS adult services is approximately 3:1.

In epidemiological research Wing (1981) found that among people with high-functioning autism or Asperger syndrome there were as many as fifteen times as many males as females. On the other hand, when she looked at individuals with learning difficulties as well as autism the ratio of boys to girls was closer to 2:1. This would suggest that, while females are less likely to develop autism, when they do they are more severely impaired."

The first quote is from Continued Medical Education and the second quote is from the National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke

"Autism affects an estimated two to 10 of every 10,000 people, depending on the diagnostic criteria used. Most estimates that include people with similar disorders are two to three times greater. Autism strikes males about four times as often as females, and has been found throughout the world in people of all racial and social backgrounds."

"Experts estimate that three to six children out of every 1,000 will have autism. Males are four times more likely to have autism than females."

It seems that the autism "epidemic" is steadily rising every year and I find this to be very interesting. Since my son was dxd, if I am not reading about it somewhere, I am given new information about it by his doctors, therapists, teachers, etc. It's a very interesting disorder and it looks like there is more to it than a psychological aspect of it. That there is actually a "medical" aspect into it which I find very interesting.

Angie

[Kat]

Although more males are diagnosed as having high functioning autistic spectrum disorders such as Aspergers and PDD, there is one ASD that is almost exclusively found in females, Rett's Disorder. It is very similar to cerebral palsy and far more severe than the other autistic spectrum disorders.

Kat

[CNA]

Thank you, Kat, for referencing the Rett's disorder for girls and that it is more profound for females when dxd with an ASD. I was focused in on the male aspect of it when I posted because of Jenna's post about scoring where the men score usually; whereas, men typically score higher and are 4 times more likely to be dxd. But with Asperger's syndrome or high functioning, according to the NAS as well as recent studies I've read show that it can be as much as 15:1. That's a pretty large ratio between the two sexes and that males are affected more so than females.

To my understanding, Rett's is definitely severe and morbidity rate is high for those dxd. I'm not as familiar with this aspect of ASD as I am with the others. But I have definitely heard of it. I've also read where they've characterized the Autism disorder as the "male intelligence to the extreme." This is where they are talking about the "emotional quotient" and that empathy is extremely low with ASD and is a typical trait more so with men versus women. It also talks about indifference towards others and that this is another trait characteristic of the "male intelligence to the extreme" and the "emotional quotient" of men. I find it all so very interesting. It helps me to understand more about my son, especially the medical aspects of it and I know it is the same for you and your baby Sean. It puts closure to not knowing and opens up so many gates to understanding our babies more. As you know, Chris' challenge as of right now, is fine motor skills but he's improving and is getting so much better. He'll have handwriting like mine. No one can read it but me...LOL I'm not that bad but my handwriting isn't the neatest of all.

Between me and you and being mom's to austistic kids, we're just going to tear it up on this thread with providing information to others regarding ASD or giving our perspective of it living with a child that has been affected to whatever degree with ASD. Again thank you for referencing the female aspect of it.

Angie

[JennaW]

This might be interesting:

The beginning of the book Descartes' Error: Emotion, Reason, and the Human Brain, by Antonio Damasio, introduced a patient who was neurophysiologically damaged in the emotive aspects, described by S.S. Ackerly and A.L. Benton:

Their patient sustained frontal lobe damage around the time of birth and thus went through chlidhood and adolescence without many of the brain systems that I believe are necessary for a normal human personality to emerge. Accordingly, his behavior was always abnormal. Although he was not a stupid child, and although the basic instruments of his mind seemed intact, he never acquired normal social behavior… The patient was never able to hold a job. After some days of of disobedience he would lose interst in his activity, and even end up stealing or being disorderly. Any departure from routine would frustrate him easily and might cause a burst of bad temper, although in general he tended to be docile and polite… His behavior was stereotyped, unimaginative, lacking in initiative, and he developed no professional skills or hobbies.

...The Hebb-Penfield and Ackerly-Benton patients shared a number of personality traits. Rigid and perseverant in their approach to life, they were both unable to organize future activity and hold gainful employment; they lacked originality and creativity; they tended to boast and present a favorable view of themselves; they displayed generally correct but stereotyped manners; they were less able than others to experience pleasure and react to pain; they had diminished sexual and exploratory drives; and they demonstrated a lack of motor, sensory, or communication defects, and an overall intelligence within expectations, given their sociocultural background… One way of describing their predicament is by saying that they never construct an appropriate theory about their persons, or about their person’s social role in the perspective of past and future. And what they cannot construct for themselves, they also cannot generate for others. They are bereft of a theory of their own mind and of the mind of those with whom they interact.—p. 58, [my emphasis]

From wikipedia:

Social development

Typically, developing infants are social beings—early in life they do such things as gaze at people, turn toward voices, grasp a finger, and even smile. In contrast, most autistic children prefer objects to faces and seem to have tremendous difficulty learning to engage in the give-and-take of everyday human interaction. Even in the first few months of life, many seem indifferent to other people because they avoid eye contact and do not interact with them as often as non-autistic children.

Autistic children often appear to prefer being alone to the company of others and may passively accept such things as hugs and cuddling without reciprocating, or resist attention altogether. Later, they seldom seek comfort from others or respond to parents' displays of anger or affection in a typical way. Research has suggested that although autistic children are attached to their parents, their expression of this attachment may be unusual and difficult to interpret. Parents who looked forward to the joys of cuddling, teaching, and playing with their child may feel crushed by this lack of expected attachment behavior.

According to Simon Baron-Cohen, autistic children often also appear to lack a "theory of mind", the ability to see things from another person's perspective, a behavior cited as exclusive to human beings above the age of five and, possibly, other higher primates such as adult gorillas, chimpanzees and bonobos. Typical 5-year-olds can develop insights into other people's different knowledge, feelings, and intentions, interpretations based upon social cues (e.g., gestures, facial expressions). An autistic individual may lack these interpretation skills, an inability that leaves them unable to predict or understand other people's actions.

The social alienation of autistic and Asperger's people can be so intense from childhood that many of them report having imaginary friends or inventing imaginary worlds or scenarios. Making friends in real life, and maintaining those friendships, can be difficult.

Although not universal, it is common for autistic people not to be able to regulate their behavior. This can take the form of crying or verbal outbursts that may seem out of proportion to the situation or self-injurious behaviours. Autistic individuals generally prefer consistent routines and environments; they may react negatively to changes in them. It is not uncommon for these individuals to exhibit aggression, increased levels of self-stimulatory behavior, self-injury or extensive withdrawal in overwhelming situations.

Between the two excerpts here, autism sounds like an emotionally abnormal condition-- where the emotive aspects of the human being are absent, unbalanced, or inactivated. I think there are also gradations of autism, different kinds of autism, and people who are bordering on it. In any case, it has a tie to emotional intelligence.

[mweiss]

My score was 28. I'm not sure that this means anything in terms of autism though.

[rilli]

This might be interesting:

The beginning of the book Descartes' Error: Emotion, Reason, and the Human Brain, by Antonio Damasio, introduced a patient who was neurophysiologically damaged in the emotive aspects, described by S.S. Ackerly and A.L. Benton: - - -

From wikipedia: - - -

Between the two excerpts here, autism sounds like an emotionally abnormal condition-- where the emotive aspects of the human being are absent, unbalanced, or inactivated. I think there are also gradations of autism, different kinds of autism, and people who are bordering on it. In any case, it has a tie to emotional intelligence.

The different gradations form the autistic spectrum. Among them, probably the most difficult is the Narcissist Personality Disorder. Autistic spectrum disorders are generally considered to have mental basis, here's a good link:

http://home.earthlink.net/~maxmcdowell/autism_joap.pdf

Autistic spectrum disorders seems to be disorders in children development, caused by bad, wrong or lacking care.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Autistic spectrum disorders are generally considered to have mental basis, here's a good link:

http://home.earthlink.net/~maxmcdowell/autism_joap.pdf

Autistic spectrum disorders seems to be disorders in children development, caused by bad, wrong or lacking care.

Ril,

Welcome to Objectivist Living. I gave a quick overview of the article you linked. I have some quick observations.

1. Unfortunately, right now I am finishing a difficult project, so I only had time for a quick skim. It is 26 pages and I will give it a more thorough reading later.

2. The basis of McDowell's argument is what he calls "image-of-the-eyes hypotheses." Obviously a hypothesis is not a "generally considered" position as you postulated.

3. McDowell's hypothesis, from what I gather from my initial skim, is based on innate Jungian archetypes in newborns with a bit of behaviorism thrown in for good measure ("ontology and ontogeny of social gaze" is a gem of a phrase). Then there is an attempt at some kind of biological/spiritual collectivism, especially with phrases like ""shared attention," "intersubjectivity," and a host of others. In short, McDowell hypothesizes that an infant's lack of looking into its mothers eyes is the source of developing autism (or related conditions). Apparently this does not allow the innate archetype to guide development properly (or something like that).

4. The very first question that comes to mind is to ask why autism and related conditions are growing in children (as even the article claims). If the mother to infant "image-of-the-eyes" hypothesis is true, why are present-day mothers no longer making sure that their infants look into their eyes? Obviously they did that in yesteryear because this mental condition was not as serious before as it is today. This question is one serious strike against the hypothesis without even going into more depth.

5. At any rate, as an Objectivist, I do hold that some innate pre-wiring of the brain is present (in a seed-like form), but I am wary of innate archetypes of the Jungian variety without investigating them further. I am very wary of Behaviorisnm in general and, although I hold the species considerations have been poorly developed in Objectivism, I am also wary of shared mental experiences like "intersubjectivity." This would be a form of ESP. (I don't outright deny what I don't know, but I am naturally wary.)

6. Kat's experience with Sean is a glaring exception to this hypothesis. She used formal "attachment mothering" techniques with him until he was 3 years old.

My own inclination is to look at what is different between nowadays and before and seek the causes there. This would cover nutrition, environment, genes, etc., in addition to learned behavior. Obviously I hold that the causes are varied. I shy away from oversimplifications.

Michael

[Robert Campbell]

Michael and Ril,

I don't have time right now to go through McDowell's article carefully.

However, I note that in addition to the Jungian influence there is a heavy overlay of latter-day Freudianism (e.g., Heinz Kohut's theories about infant development) and this poses its own set of problems.

I've never heard narcissism (as the term is used by today's clinicians, not as it is used by hard-core Freudians) classified as part of the autistic spectrum.

Also, the theory that autism is caused by inadequate parenting of infants was prevalent in the early days of research on the subject, but has been rejected because the data utterly fail to support it. Parenting inadequate enough to make babies or young children autistic would have to be beyond nightmarish.

Robert Campbell

PS. "Intersubjectivity" is a common term in infancy studies. All it normally means is some kind of shared understanding--the kind that is necessary for even the most rudimentary forms of communication. No reference intended to telepathy, or to Vulcan mind-melds.

[rilli]

Robert, Michael,

The image of the eyes is very interesting because it is parallel to Konrad Lorentz' hypothesis concerning imprinting, a mechanism with which newborn animal primates "decide" who is their "mother". In Konrad Lorentz' experiments newborn geese chose Lorentz their mother because his eyes were the first pair of eyes the geese saw. It could be the link from biology to psychology, the first (and only?) wired connection from "genetic clockwork" to perceptive and learning being.

Autistic and narcissist disorders are the two ends of the autistic spectrum. Autism is the lower end, narcissism the higher one. In general, autists live in their own world, narcissists are struggling halfway (in different grades) to the human world. Common to both is that they have not learned (emerged) the ability to understand other's feelings, i.e. empathy.

A child must learn empathy from his/her caretaker, it is not wired. Without empathy you feel strange among people and your self-consciousness is very low. Autists don't care too much but narcissists do, they are desperate in hidind bad and pretending good self-consciouness - which could lead to abuse and unconscious violence.

Michael, your item 4 is very important. Why present-day mothers do no more look in their childen's eyes? My answer is that present-day mothers do no more look in their children's eyes during a couple of first years whenever child needs it. Present-day mothers go to work, take care their career or simply spend more time outside home leaving children to some temporary persons to care (whom the child don't know as mother). This is socially very difficult situation. This age turns human values to technical or medical issues. If mothers (or fathers) feel that growing a child is a prison, should they be sterilized - or abortized in the case of accident? That's just rethorics, but you understand my point.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

A child must learn empathy from his/her caretaker, it is not wired.

Ril,

This is an opinion, not a fact. This view is not borne out by the empirical observations of Sylvan Tomkins. Please see the essay in this thread, The Wonderful Way Shmurak Faces Emotion.

Lack of empathy is an exception, not a norm. Empathy does have a biological basis in addition to a learned one. Affects come pre-wired in a seed-like fashion. As the child grows, the seed develops and unfolds. In human behavior, this automatic growth is intermingled with a growing conceptual and volitional faculty and experience. By adulthood, volition becomes more important than biology for "operating" a mind, but biology is still present.

Biology-wise, on a physical level a comparison could be made between empathy-less individuals and midgets. Nobody would ever claim that height is learned from crawling or something like that, although it can be helped along in being stunted through nutrition, disease, etc.

To be clear, I agree that there is learned component, but this does not eradicate the biological one. It will be interesting to see DNA analyses of autistic and narcissistic people over time.

I also have difficulty with your classification of "higher" and "lower" for narcissism and autism. What standards of degree are you using?

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Here is a news report I found interesting:

'Copying' nerves broken in autism

5 December 2005

BBC News

They have located the physical part of the brain that is under-performing.

Michael

[Victor Pross]

Here is an Autism test to find out how you score and if you have traits of being autistic. It's not to give a diagnosis but many of the questions are interesting. I can definitely relate, especially to social aspects, etc. But I myself also have an interesting past with certain issues; such as, I rarely talked until I was almost 4, very little speech pattern. I talked but not much. Around 4 years old, I just exploded on the scene and couldn't get me to be quiet and using words well advanced for my age amongst other interesting aspects of it. But I'm not autistic.

Here is the site to go and take the test. It's not long, 50 questions, easy to get through.

http://www.msnbc.com/modules/newsweek/autism_quotient/

Finally, I discovered this thread and I have taken the test that Angie has linked. It is most interesting.

Man-o-man, I scored 28. Whew! Now, it seems that autism has a rather odious stigmatism to it, which Angie deplores. She tried to make the case that people who exhibit autistic traits (or who are actually autistic) is not such as horrible thing. Yet people continue to fear the unknown and react to it as if it were a contagious form of leprosy. It is not so bad and a little understanding can go a long way, and I plan to read this thread straight threw and do some other reading beyond it on this very topic.

Now, having scored at 28, Angie tells me that I am on a rather high end---not so high, but still. I invite you those who haven’t taken the test to do so. Do it! :turned:

EDIT:

Like my sweetie, I have never been diagnosed as being autistic, but unlike my sweetie, I have not seen a neurologist, and both psychologists and neurologists can give diagnoses of autism. But whoa, 28! Hey, I’m an artist, what do you want? :shocked: (That I wet my bed and suck my thumb is irrelevant).

-Victor

Edited April 6, 2007 by Victor Pross

[CNA]

Here is an Autism test to find out how you score and if you have traits of being autistic. It's not to give a diagnosis but many of the questions are interesting. I can definitely relate, especially to social aspects, etc. But I myself also have an interesting past with certain issues; such as, I rarely talked until I was almost 4, very little speech pattern. I talked but not much. Around 4 years old, I just exploded on the scene and couldn't get me to be quiet and using words well advanced for my age amongst other interesting aspects of it. But I'm not autistic.

Here is the site to go and take the test. It's not long, 50 questions, easy to get through.

http://www.msnbc.com/modules/newsweek/autism_quotient/

Finally, I discovered this thread and I have taken the test that Angie has linked. It is most interesting.

Man-o-man, I scored 28. Whew! Now, it seems that autism has a rather odious stigmatism to it, which Angie deplores. She tried to make the case that people who exhibit autistic traits (or who are actually autistic) are not such as horrible thing. Yet people continue to fear the unknown and react to it as if it were a contagious form of leprosy. It is not so bad and a little understanding can go a long way, and I plan to read this thread straight threw and do some other reading beyond it on this very topic.

Now, having scored at 28, Angie tells me that I am on a rather high end---not so high, but still. I invite you those who haven’t taken the test to do so. Do it! :turned:

EDIT:

Like my sweetie, I have never been diagnosed as being autistic, but unlike my sweetie, I have not seen a neurologist, and both psychologists and neurologists can give diagnoses of autism. But whoa, 28! Hey, I’m an artist, what do you want? :shocked:

-Victor

Honey, 28 is on the high side but not enough for a neurologist or psychologist to investigate further and to give a dx of autism. Many factors have to be taken into account. I didn't post the link to give a dx. I posted it so anyone can take the test, look at the questions asked, get more information, as well as finding support as both me and Kat have high functioning autistic kids. But if I am remembering correctly, if you score 32 and above, you have enough traits to warrant a doctor to perform more tests, etc. The neurologist I saw was not set up specifically because of any autistic traits. I had some other medical issues such as acute migraines and others that were unrelated to autism. I was given many many tests to try to figure out what was going on and autism was eventually discussed because of a test he had perfomed which eventually was a non-issue to the symptoms I was having.

Autism does have such a horrible stigma to it which is very unfortunate. People fear what they don't understand. It's not a death sentence as so many see it. It's not the end of the world. It's not horrible. The more a person understands the disorder, the more you realize it's not all that bad. Of course, there are different degrees of severity and can cause some serious problems. But those are few and far between. I know quite a few that would be dxd as being a high functioning autistic. But as long as it doesn't interfere with the quality of your life and how you live it, no worries. But if anyone is concerned, I would advise seeing a doctor. Unfortunately the disorder has gotten a bad rap and most people I talk with about it have a very negative opinion of it. Well, you know, a bit difficult to have an opinion regarding something when you don't have any clue as to what it is. Anyway, you're fine, Honey.

[Greybird]

I'm usually dubious of these tests, but my score of 23 out of 50 (just above "average," which ended at 22) pretty much matched my own self-appraisal, for once: mildly less than comfortable or perfectly functioning among others in groups, but certainly not at all resisting doing so, as such.

One friend with whom I've chatted on line for over two years — and who, unlike nearly all such people, actually met me in person once — made a remark and long-distance "diagnosis" I didn't care for. He thought, apropos of my tending to have friction with several types of people in Net message boards, that I might have Asperger's Syndrome.

I don't think so. Net.life tends to concentrate verbal efforts, shearing off the two-thirds of daily communication that comes through body language, voice tone, word emphasis, and physical cues. When I can deal with others "in the flesh," I do well. When all but the ideas get stripped away, I get combative over ideas. (And far too wordy, most of the time.)

That comes from a lack of context, in a medium relatively new in human history. That isn't the same as autism, though, whether cloaked in the guise of a "syndrome" or not.

I've gathered that some people use such a viewpoint to dismiss others from their net.landscape, so to "speak." This, to me, isn't proper in any discussion. Disagreements should be identified and, if appropriate, dealt with, and not simply excused ... unless, that is, someone responding isn't being civil enough to talk with at all.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

He thought, apropos of my tending to have friction with several types of people in Net message boards, that I might have Asperger's Syndrome.

I don't think so.

Steve,

Have you ever considered that you might be a dishonest, subjectivist, intrinsicist, evasive, mystical, altruistic, Kantian, brutish and thuggish looter and second-hander who does not choose to think?

Michael

[Greybird]

Yeah, the truth will come out. It's all those angels in my winged-art collection, as anyone can plainly see among my favorites.

Guess I'm a mindless religious fruitcake after all {sob!} :angel: :whistle:

[John Dailey]

~ Crap! I hate these 'tests' where 100 isn't a 'perfect score'; it's all so...uninterpretable. Worse than Rorschach analyses!

~ I got a 26...whatever that means (yeah, I read the 'evaluation' list; as I said: whatever that 'means.')

~ What I really hate is how 'loaded' these test questions are re the ASSumptions obviously made in most of them, as in "IF you stopped beating your children, would you treat them better or worse?" JEE-E-E-Z-Z-UZ-Z-Z; uh-h, 'better'! Does that sound ok from a bachelor?

~ I'm an autistic RainMan looking for a real party somewhere, now that I've finished this F***n' 50-question idiot-created test.

LLAP

J:D

Edited April 8, 2007 by John Dailey

[Victor Pross]

John,

I sympathize with your mistrust and anguish over the reliability of that test. I took it over the phone with Angie and I muttered under my breath here and there “Hmm, loaded question…what the hell does that mean?...that is an already assumptive question….too broad a question! What the hell...." Grumble, grumble!

It was curiosity that saw me through it, but I am not too fast to dismiss it or embrace it. :turned:

-Victor

Edited April 8, 2007 by Victor Pross

[John Dailey]

Vic:

~ Obviously...I AM.

LLAP

J:D