I got my "Golden Compass" demon

[Mike Renzulli]

http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1573421/story.jhtml

Nov 2 2007 6:27 PM EDT

"Thought Harry Potter was blasphemous? That was kids' stuff compared to the "His Dark Materials" trilogy, in which God is an imposter, angels are sexually ambiguous and the Church kidnaps, tortures and assassinates to achieve its goals, one of which is stealing children's souls."

At least I know there is a movie worth seeing come December. Matter of fact, this might be a good activity for my Objectivist group. Right around Christmas time. Great timing!

Edited November 20, 2007 by Mike Renzulli

[emb021]

http://www.mtv.com/movies/news/articles/1573421/story.jhtml

Nov 2 2007 6:27 PM EDT

"Thought Harry Potter was blasphemous? That was kids' stuff compared to the "His Dark Materials" trilogy, in which God is an imposter, angels are sexually ambiguous and the Church kidnaps, tortures and assassinates to achieve its goals, one of which is stealing children's souls."

At least I know there is a movie worth seeing come December. Matter of fact, this might be a good activity for my Objectivist group. Right around Christmas time. Great timing!

I read the trilogy about 4 years ago.

Its not so 'blashpemous' as they try to make it out, and the movie actually downplays these elements.

For more info, I recommend you check out the Wikipedia articles on the author and the books. There are some pretty deep philisophical/scientific backgrounds to this work.

[BaalChatzaf]

I got my "Golden Compass" demon. She is Calista the Lioness, so don't piss her off. She claws and bites.

Even before I received her I know my demon would be a cat.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Chris Grieb]

What the F. are you talking about?

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I have a Kat...

Michael

[syrakusos]

What the F. are you talking about?

start here:

http://www.goldencompassmovie.com/?engine=adwords!10098

Then google GOLDEN COMPASS to discover the controversy. Like "Harry Potter" and LOTR, this is a fantasy for the rational-empirical person. According to ABC News: "Ever since the film was commissioned – and even before shooting began – religious groups were outraged, pegging "The Golden Compass" as a direct attack on organized religion, particularly Catholicism." -- http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/story?id=3970783

What I want to know is where do get the little icons? Do I have to buy a Happy Meal or what?

[BaalChatzaf]

What the F. are you talking about?

start here:

http://www.goldencompassmovie.com/?engine=adwords!10098

Then google GOLDEN COMPASS to discover the controversy. Like "Harry Potter" and LOTR, this is a fantasy for the rational-empirical person. According to ABC News: "Ever since the film was commissioned – and even before shooting began – religious groups were outraged, pegging "The Golden Compass" as a direct attack on organized religion, particularly Catholicism." -- http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/story?id=3970783

What I want to know is where do get the little icons? Do I have to buy a Happy Meal or what?

Go to www.imdb.com and use that to go to the "Golden Compass" website. Follow the arrows thereafter. You will have take a twenty question personality survey to get the right demon for you.

I have read Pullman's book. It is a tour de force. It is wonderful fantasy. It is as powerful as anything Tolkien ever wrote and it beats the crap out of Harry Potter.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Dragonfly]

My deamon is Aspasa, the snow leopard. Of course also a cat.

[Chris Grieb]

I don't plan to see the movie. I'm going to read the books. I hope I have better things to do.

[Laure]

Cleon the Spider. Solitary, modest, humble, dependable, and assertive.

[Roger Bissell]

Aditi the Chimpanzee. Modest, responsible, humble, assertive, and sociable.

[Ross Barlow]

Go and see this movie, friends! I was most pleasantly surprised and delighted by it. Do not put it off. See it while it is on the big screen. I will go see it again because I missed some dialogue (why can’t people from England speak proper English?). ;-)

The young girl, Lyra, is an exceptionally individualistic and plucky heroine (played by Dakota Blue Richards). The virtues that are celebrated in this story are rationality, independence, courage, science, skepticism and resistance to mere authority and dogma. Heresy is honored. I can see why the Catholic Church in particular is afraid of these stories entering the minds of children.

The author of the book series, Philip Pullman, is an outspoken atheist, but the movie series has reputedly toned down the controversial references to religion in order to not scare away American prude puritan audiences. The Christians are afraid that if this movie is a Xmas-time hit then parents will buy their kids the (much more explicitly atheistic and heretical) book series. I knew nothing about the book series before this movie, but it is obvious that this film is crying out for a sequel – which I look forward to. I might even get the book series (called “His Dark Materials”).

In Lyra’s parallel universe, humans have their souls/spirits – or “daemons,” in the Greek sense (think of Aristotle’s “eudaimonia,” i.e., “truest” or “best spirit,” “happiness” or “human flourishing”) – living outside their bodies as accompanying animals whose “personalities” match their own most genuine individual styles. Be forewarned that the sense of life in this movie is a tad “Byronic” and dark. Much of it takes place in the darkness of the far North. But I never was convinced that dark, Viking or Byronic fiction could not also contain elements of the benevolent and inspiring.

Modern film special effects capabilities have allowed Fantasy movies to take on such a realistic appearance that the stories have a kind of believability to them. These techniques provide a kind of seamlessness to the aesthetic experience which were never possible before.

This movie has a great cast. Daniel Craig (our new James Bond) plays Lord Asriel, whom I believe we will see more of in future films of this series. Sam Elliot (a favorite character actor of mine) may be playing his greatest role here, making the best use of his characteristic light-hearted goodness mixed with thoroughly American grit. Christopher Lee is the First High Councilor of the sinister Magisterium (which is eerily similar to the RC Church), and his brief cameo absolutely reeks of evil – this beloved actor has perfected his craft. Eva Green plays Queen of the witches (good witches), and is as enchantingly beautiful as ever. Ian McKellen provides the voice of an animated warrior ice bear. Nichole Kidman plays the bad, bad Mrs. Coulter (and she almost seduced me with her incredible charm; in fact, I think I am right now starting to defect to the Dark Side because of her smile; I cannot resist it; I am falling…).

Seriously, don’t miss this film.

-Ross Barlow.

[Ross Barlow]

My daemon is Azaria the chimp: modest, a leader, fickle, softly spoken and solitary. It fits. But I sure wish that I could climb like a chimp (or, better yet, like a gibbon).

-Ross Barlow.

-P.S. – I briefly reviewed this movie on a separate thread/new topic on the Movies forum here at OL.

[Dragonfly]

Gosh, a lot of modest people on this forum... Do I smell a Barnum effect? (Not to be confused with the Barnes effect.)

[Mike Renzulli]

I also saw this movie last night and agree with everything you said. Its a wonderfully well-made, individualistic film.

[John Dailey]

~ William A. Donahue has been ranting against this movie, more than against the book which it's very watered down from. He properly has some complaints re the book...but...only for his dogmatic followers. Re the movie, he clearly hates anything that even hints at the idea of being anti-religious-authoritarianism; and from what I've read, the movie barely touches on that, unlike the books. He sees all disagreement with his 'catholic' views as attacks and shows little prob going into rabid pit-bull mode against such.

~ Anyhoo, he hates it: that makes it a 'must-see' in my book. --- 'Sides, I'm curious to see how 'evil' Kidman can seem. The last witch who impressed me was in CHRONICLES OF NARNIA.

LLAP

J:D

[syrakusos]

artimidoris

Mouse

assertive, solitary, softly spoken, spontaneous and responsible.

Second daemon. First is being stored for 12 days. My answers were somewhat different the first time and I got another rodent, a white weasel or something.

[John Dailey]

~ For what this 'personality profile' is worth, my daemon is Valthera...a 'female' one regardless I checked off 'male.' --- Same happened on a SuperHeros one where I was most akin to Wonder Woman.

~ Oh, yes: 'modest' is also one of her characteristics.

~ I'm not one for fantasy-fiction reading anymore, so, I'll take everyone's word that the books were good. Still, I'll catch the movie; now, also for the reason to see what Valthera's like.

LLAP

J:D

Edited December 9, 2007 by John Dailey

[BaalChatzaf]

~ For what this 'personality profile' is worth, my daemon is Valthera...a 'female' one regardless I checked off 'male.' --- Same happened on a SuperHeros one where I was most akin to Wonder Woman.

~ Oh, yes: 'modest' is also one of her characteristics.

~ I'm not one for fantasy-fiction reading anymore, so, I'll take everyone's word that the books were good. Still, I'll catch the movie; now, also for the reason to see what Valthera's like.

LLAP

J:D

For humans, demons are most frequently of the opposite gender.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[emb021]

Its 'daemon', not 'demon'.

Problem is that most people think of 'demon' they think of 'devils'. 'Daemons' are helper spirits. That is why on unix, the background processes are called 'daemons'.

In the "His Dark Materials" trilogy, all humans have their souls as separate beings called 'daemons', who take the form of animals. These beings are like companions, who stay with you and speak with you. Children's daemons can change shape at will, until they reach adolescent, in which they take one form. In many ways, the form they take is symbolic of the soul of the individual. (the witch's daemons are always swans, the Cossacks are vicious wolves, others are of small insects, dogs, cats, and othe small animals).

[emb021]

I read the books a couple years back. You can get the entire trilogy in one volume, which some additional notes by Pullman.

Quite frankly, I didn't see the Magisterium as being specifically the Catholic Church. It seemed just their world's version of any other authoritarian/autocratic organization. I was puzzled by comments on the back cover and in the book flap that claimed stuff like the "gobblers may turn out to be the good guys". Sorry, but AFAIK, they turned out to be amoung the true villians.

I saw the movie this past weekend. Overall very good. There are some very good lines of dialog on the matter of freedom and free will, so you understand the evil of people like the Magisterium (who felt that what they were doing was 'good', because it would make sure children didn't turn away, which really meant they wanted to end free will and that people would do what they were told. because others knew what was better for them.)

Mrs Coultier was very evil, both her and her golden monkey daemon. (I always wondered who the hell Mr Coultier was. He never appeared in the books...). Daniel Craig was great, as was Sam Elliott. Ian McKellan did a good job as the voice of Iorek, the Armoured Bear that held Lyra. I think they did a good job of showing the Golden Compass working, and touching on the matter of "Dust". I think they did a decent way of showing this as another world, and hopefully explaining what daemons where. I didn't like that they pronounced the word 'demon'. I prefer to pronouce it 'daemon', with a clear 'a' sound, to differentiate it from 'demons', which most people think of devils.

I do hope this film is successful, as only then will they do the next 2.

[cjsmall]

Its 'daemon', not 'demon'.

Problem is that most people think of 'demon' they think of 'devils'. 'Daemons' are helper spirits. That is why on unix, the background processes are called 'daemons'.

Of course, that didn't stop some people from making a big stink about the term being used in UNIX back in the early '80s. Right along with the uproar over the satanic Proctor and Gamble logo! Also see Wikipedia.

--

Jeff

[Reidy]

Aristotle's expression "eudaimonia," which Objectivists are fond of using, comes from this root. In historical and etymological origin it means "protected by a good spirit."

[Chris Grieb]

On IMDB the figures for Golden Compass were described as disappointing it made the most money.

Objectivists who like the idea of the film should try and see it this week so the film will not be pulled.

[John Dailey]

~ Given these type of connections, might there be merely '6 degrees of separation' between Objectivists and 'daemons'? B)

LLAP

J:D