The 2020 Presidential Election Tournament

[william.scherk]

4 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Also, are you aware that the instigators of the Capitol "invasion" were mostly Antifa and BLM,

Have any of them been identified and charged so far, that anyone is aware of?

FBI Washington Field Office Releases Videos of Assaults on Officers at U.S. Capitol, Seeks Public’s Help to Identify Suspects

Quote

The FBI’s Washington Field Office has released new information and videos of suspects in the most egregious assaults on federal officers during the riots at the U.S. Capitol on January 6, 2021, and is seeking the public’s help to identify them.

It has been two months since violent extremists breached the U.S. Capitol and committed a litany of federal criminal acts. With the assistance of hundreds of thousands of tips from the American people, the FBI has arrested more than 300 individuals who took part in the Capitol riots. Of those, more than 65 were arrested for assaulting law enforcement officers. However, some of the most violent offenders have yet to be identified, including the 10 seen assaulting officers in the video footage we are releasing today.

Links:

Quote

Videos

• FBI Washington Field Office Seeking Tips Related to Capitol Violence
• Capitol Violence: AFO #91
• Capitol Violence: AFO #94
• Capitol Violence: AFO #113
• Capitol Violence: AFO #114
• Capitol Violence: AFO #123
• Capitol Violence: AFO #153
• Capitol Violence: AFO #170
• Capitol Violence: AFO #191
• Capitol Violence: AFO #231
• Capitol Violence: AFO #255

Sample video (#91)

 

Edited March 21, 2021 by william.scherk
Added links and video

[caroljane]

Still tmj, like William Jay of legend, Brian is just dead as if he had been.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

1 hour ago, william.scherk said:

Have any of them been identified and charged so far, that anyone is aware of?

Under Christopher Wray, don't hold your breath.

His thing for BLM and Antifa is catch and release.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

2 hours ago, caroljane said:

I'll look it up.

Carol,

Oh good.

I'll hold my breath until you do because I know you would never leave us all hanging...

Hint... You could start with the NY Post article I stuck right in your face.

But in the event you are unaware of how to do it, you hover the pointer over the title that is linked and click. Or on a tablet, you tap with your finger. The article appears as if by magic...

Michael

[caroljane]

2 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Carol,

Oh good.

I'll hold my breath until you do because I know you would never leave us all hanging...

Hint... You could start with the NY Post article I stuck right in your face.

But in the event you are unaware of how to do it, you hover the pointer over the title that is linked and click. Or on a tablet, you tap with your finger. The article appears as if by magic...

Michael

I just read the Ny Post article, and my first take is this was a cold blooded murder, which is indefensible,, and that the left spread false information is also indefensible,. I. Hope the murderer has been prosecuted and senteNced to the full extent of law. 

This article is still the only info I know of the case and I apologize for not reading it immediately. I would never intentionally want to leave anyone hanging, even traitorous politicians, as I cannot support capital punishment. IIt is neither reliably just nor economical.

[caroljane]

Incidentally, if the shouters for Mike Pence to be hanged succeeded in doing it, would some rightists hail them as heroes? And would that not be as repugnant as the leftists who so hailed the Portland killer? Both cases would be politically motivated murder.

[tmj]

Yes if the unarmed shouters had captured the VP and brought him out to the fake gallows and hanged him by his neck until he died , that would have been repugnant. Who thinks that was an actual plan?

With the break in , fake gallows notwithstanding, the only plan thwarted was one in which multiple challenges to states’ elector slates would force a stoppage in the proceedings. The questions now seem to me to be , were the conspirators in the stoppage plan thwarted or provided with cover , cuz the challenges ain’t did happen.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

11 hours ago, caroljane said:

Incidentally, if the shouters for Mike Pence to be hanged succeeded in doing it, would some rightists hail them as heroes? And would that not be as repugnant as the leftists who so hailed the Portland killer?

Carol,

No.

That situation would not be just as repugnant as the people calling them heroes.

It would be just as repugnant as what the Portland killer did.

Cold blooded murder is repugnant, whether done by an individual or by a lynch mob.

I'm not against vigilante justice, though. Not in some situations. I'm fine with it as a last resort. But until that point is reached, meaning morality and law have totally gone out the window and a major threat to innocents from the bad guy not being held to account is great, we are a country of due process under the law. Thus, until that point, vigilante justice is murder. That means due process is for all, left, right, heroes, scumbags, producers, parasites, weak, strong, and just plain everyday people. All.

btw - The Portland killer died in a shootout when law enforcement tried to arrest him. Probably suicide by cop.

Until he was shot dead, though, he was a media darling. He got high profile media interviews and everything. The fake news press loved him and couldn't get enough of him.

Although that is not as repugnant as the actual murder, that is still plenty repugnant. Just as repugnant as anyone who would celebrate a lynching.

Cold blooded murder and celebrating cold blooded murder are both repugnant to slightly varying degrees.

And both are evil.

Michael

[caroljane]

19 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Carol,

No.

That situation would not be just as repugnant as the people calling them heroes.

It would be just as repugnant as what the Portland killer did.

Cold blooded murder is repugnant, whether done by an individual or by a lynch mob.

I'm not totally against vigilante justice, though. I'm fine with it in a situation of last resort. But until that point is reached, meaning morality and law have totally gone out the window and a major threat to innocents from the bad guy not being held to account is great, we are a country of due process under the law. That due process is for all, left, right, heroes, scumbags, producers, parasites, weak, strong, and just plain everyday people. All.

btw - The Portland killer died in a shootout when law enforcement tried to arrest him.

Until that point, though, he was a media darling. He got high profile media interviews and everything. The fake news press loved him and couldn't get enough of him.

Although not as repugnant as the actual murder, that is still plenty repugnant.

It's evil.

Michael

Michael, all I  asked was whether hailing hypothetical lynchers of Pence as heroes , would be  as repugnant as hailing the actual Portland killer as one . Both cold blooded murders whatever the motives. that was the situation I posited. Since you answered no, I am deducing that the hypothetical death of poor Pence would have been a form of vigilante justice such as you describe? Is that what you meant? 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

29 minutes ago, caroljane said:

Michael, all I  asked was whether hailing hypothetical lynchers of Pence as heroes , would be  as repugnant as hailing the actual Portland killer as one . Both cold blooded murders whatever the motives. that was the situation I posited. Since you answered no, I am deducing that the hypothetical death of poor Pence would have been a form of vigilante justice such as you describe? Is that what you meant? 

Carol,

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on your meaning because your writing was vague. Wanna see?

What does "that" refer to below? A successful hanging or hailing as heroes or both? The way you wrote it, it could be any of the three. 

(My bold in the quote.)

11 hours ago, caroljane said:

... if the shouters for Mike Pence to be hanged succeeded in doing it, would some rightists hail them as heroes? And would that not be as repugnant as the leftists who so hailed the Portland killer?

So that one goes into different interpretations. No biggie.

However, in continuing, your powers of deduction are weak.

Please reread my post and see if you can find out where you attributed the opposite meaning to what I said. If you can't see it, I will explain it.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I can't resist.

Here is what I said:

14 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Oh good.

I'll hold my breath until you do because I know you would never leave us all hanging...

And your comment.

12 hours ago, caroljane said:

I would never intentionally want to leave anyone hanging, even traitorous politicians,

Using the same Carol-logic and powers of deduction you used to get to the opposite meaning of my post, does your statement here mean that OL members are traitorous politicians?

 

Michael

[caroljane]

20 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

I can't resist.

Here is what I said:

And your comment.

Using the same Carol-logic and powers of deduction you used to get to the opposite meaning of my post, does your statement here mean that OL members are traitorous politicians?

 

Michael

truly, no. Neither word applies to any OLers that I know of. I was being ironic about poorypothetical Pence, of course.

If your question was just a rhetorical joke, then gotme. I don't mind. I am ng tougher.

 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

6 hours ago, caroljane said:

If your question was just a rhetorical joke...

Carol,

It was. The tell is, "I can't resist."

Now use that frame to look at how you got my meaning ass-backward.

Michael

[caroljane]

6 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Carol,

It was. The tell is, "I can't resist."

Now use that frame to look at how you got my meaning ass-backward.

Michael

Ok. My deduction was wrong and you would not consider the Hypolynch the kind of vigilante act you. said you approved  in some cases. Have I got your meaning now? My brain is starting to hurt.

Carol

getting tougher but not smarter

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

7 minutes ago, caroljane said:

My deduction was wrong and you would not consider the Hypolynch the kind of vigilante act you. said you approved  in some cases.

Carol,

See? It took a few extra seconds, stepping outside the core story and actually looking and seeing.

Of course, if that fails, 2020 hindsight works, too. (But not for all people...)

Michael

[caroljane]

50 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Carol,

See? It took a few extra seconds, stepping outside the core story and actually looking and seeing.

Of course, if that fails, 2020 hindsight works, too. (But not for all people...)

Michael

thanks. However I did it I'm glad to know this.

[Ellen Stuttle]

15 hours ago, tmj said:

With the break in , fake gallows notwithstanding, the only plan thwarted was one in which multiple challenges to states’ elector slates would force a stoppage in the proceedings. The questions now seem to me to be , were the conspirators in the stoppage plan thwarted or provided with cover , cuz the challenges ain’t did happen.

Repeating part of that with emphasis:

"...the only plan thwarted was one in which multiple challenges to states’ elector slates would force a stoppage in the proceedings."

The purpose of the leftist infiltrators was to prevent the electoral-slate challenges from getting anywhere beyond hasty dismissal.

Something I’ve wondered about ever since the incident is, What was wrong with Trump's intel?  

Did he have advance info that there would be the attempt to disrupt consideration of challenges?  If he didn’t have that information, why didn’t he?  Where was the failure to inform him - and was the failure deliberate - on the part of his people?

Alternately, if Trump knew of the plan in advance, why didn’t he tell his real supporters at the rally, Don’t go to the Capitol building?

Ellen

[ThatGuy]

1 hour ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

Alternately, if Trump knew of the plan in advance, why didn’t he tell his real supporters at the rally, Don’t go to the Capitol building?

Inquiring minds want to know...still feels as if they were thrown under the proverbial bus, on that one...

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

This feels like sabotage by certain Trump insiders to me. (That is, keeping actual intel from him while painting a rosy picture.)

But don't forget. By that time, President Trump was issuing orders and nobody in the Deep State was obeying him anymore--for example, to release documents he just declassified.

I think he wanted to show Congress, and the people he had been bickering with, how much the American people wanted to look into the election fraud. He was staging a Voice of the People narrative.

Also, I think he didn't imagine an outright attack on the Capitol was within the realm of the possible since it could be repelled so easily. And he got caught off guard because, instead, the police invited Trump supporters in, which only a few cameras caught (and that footage of the tourist behavior was ignored in the mainstream), while in other parts of the building, a handful of instigators did bad stuff or colorful stuff for the cameras. Voila. A new ending to his narrative.

But it was all smoke and mirrors. Notice the mainstream did not have footage of a huge number of different people doing bad things. After all, about a million people showed up to President Trump's speech. But the fake news media showed the same footage of the same handful of people doing the same bad things over and over and over and juxtaposed it with wide shots of the crowd. In montage, it was a total snow job. 

Michael

[tmj]

One video , I only saw once, shows a shot of the crowd on the 'steps' of the Capitol singing the national anthem, is that something insurrectionists do ? sing the anthem of the government before 'taking it over'?

[Ellen Stuttle]

1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

This feels like sabotage by certain Trump insiders to me. (That is, keeping actual intel from him while painting a rosy picture.)

Sabotage by certain Trump insiders is what I suspect, too.

But have you heard or read anything indicating names?  (I haven’t, but you go poking in a wider range of stuff than I do.)

Ellen

[caroljane]

I doubt many saw themselves as insurrectionists, but as patriots making their point forcefully but legally,though things did get a bit out of hand .Many have said publicly that they were only obeying the orders of the president, which must have been legal because the president gave them.Their actions however, were certainly those of .insurrectionists, whatever they were singing. Their next number is that durable oldie,"I Fought the Law".

[tmj]

Most were singing “I fought for the law”, but that song is verboten , way too much money in being complicit with the CCP.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

7 hours ago, caroljane said:

Many have said publicly that they were only obeying the orders of the president, which must have been legal because the president gave them.Their actions however, were certainly those of .insurrectionists, whatever they were singing.

Fake news media talking point.

Not based on reality.

Michael

[caroljane]

Of course Trump did not call them up individually and tell them to revolt. But Michael , I saw them and/ or their lawyers being interviewed, I think on CTV.They were introduced as people who had participated in the event and some were under arrest. And they said they were doing what the president wanted. Were they impostors? What about the lawyers?