The 2020 Presidential Election Tournament


Recommended Posts

6 minutes ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

What did Trump say the Chinese regime "did with the virus"?  Merely that they didn’t warn the world until after the virus had gotten well underway spreading?  Or has he gone the full mile and said that the virus was deliberately developed?

Ellen,

With Maria, he strongly insinuated the full mile without openly saying it.

This was not nuanced insinuation, either. It was clear.

He probably has to do it that way to keep from disrupting whatever negotiations are underway or keep from causing WWIII over a taunt or something.

:) 

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

He probably has to do it that way to keep from disrupting whatever negotiations are underway or keep from causing WWIII over a taunt or something.

Probably Trump does have to rest with insinuating for now.  But you thought it was clear that he knows. Good.  And helpful in forestalling a Second Act follow-up.

Ellen

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oops was that a flag of Taiwan in that hangar, those guys are going to be in big trouble , that kind of thing is just not done , tsk.

oops, not what I thought that flag was , wiki first snark later , but same sentiment , Kamala doesn’t get censored in China she knows her place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What a magnificent rant by Jimmy Dore against Michelle Obama, Barack Obama, Joe Biden and others.

It's a hateful bitter rant, but extremely targeted on policy. He does diss President Trump, but he's a lefie and I give him a pass for that.

But for every Trump diss, Jimmy dumped 10 buckets of shit on the Obamas and Biden.

Jimmy was exceptionally pissed by Michelle saying people can't afford to waste their votes, their "protest" votes, on a third party candidate with an election this close. And he was really really pissed at the term "protest vote."

He said it's not called a protest vote. It's fucking called a vote. Just a vote. He doesn't do protest voting. He does voting.

:)

Jimmy is the true Bernie wing of the Dems right now.

There's a sellout Bernie wing around AOC that is trying to do the communist takeover of the establishment routine, but they will turn into the corrupt establishment over time no matter who wins, and there's this true-believer wing Jimmy represents.

How do ya' think the voting is going to look like for Biden from these true believers? These were the ones who created the huge crowds for Bernie. I didn't see them do that for Biden...

:)

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Jimmy was exceptionally pissed by Michelle saying people can't afford to waste their votes, their "protest" votes, on a third party candidate with an election this close. And he was really really pissed at the term "protest vote."

Did Michelle describe the election as "this close"?  What about Biden's supposed substantial lead in "the polls"?

Ellen 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

Did Michelle describe the election as "this close"?  What about Biden's supposed substantial lead in "the polls"?

From The Hill. Cruz: GOP could face 'bloodbath of Watergate proportions' on Election Day Jonathan Easley  1 hr ago. Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) on Friday warned Republicans the party could face a "bloodbath" in November if voters aren't feeling optimistic about the economy and the direction of the pandemic. But he warned the party could also face landslide losses similar to what happened in 1976, when Jimmy Carter won the White House in the first election following the Watergate scandal and Richard Nixon's resignation.

"I am worried. It's volatile, it's highly volatile ... if people are going back to work, if they're optimistic, if they're positive about the future, we could see a fantastic election - the president getting reelected with a big margin, Republicans winning both Houses of Congress and I think that's a real possibility," Cruz said.

"But I also think if on Election Day people are angry and they've given up hope and they're depressed, which is what [Speaker Nancy] Pelosi and [Senate Minority Leader Charles] Schumer want them to be, I think it could be a terrible election. I think we could lose the White House and both houses of Congress, that it could be a bloodbath of Watergate proportions."

Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden has opened up a 9.7-point lead over Trump in the RealClearPolitics average of polls, his largest lead in months. Biden has also opened up healthy leads in key battleground states, including Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania, and the president is polling weaker than expected in states  . . . .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone have some advice? With less than a month to go, Cruz makes some good points above and I also worry about the bad counting effect on President Trump from mail in voting. As an example of a snafu, my wife and I both sent away for a mail in ballot and I received one but my wife did not.

Some other worrying possibilities are the INCREASING ten percentage points for a left coast California “liberal’ in charge if Biden is incapacitated, a democratic Senate along with an already democratic House, and Biden saying unashamedly and confidently, that he will think about packing the Supreme Court after the election when he and his cronies assume positions of power. They think they will own us.  

Among likely Trump voters, you know we are looking at President Trump’s dangerous dismissal of the coronavirus and science, and then the payback to him, his wife, and a lot of top Republicans and military for poor judgement. “As ye sow, so shall ye reap” or whatever that saying is about. ‘Karma?”

We can murk the waters and speculate that there was a conspiracy to infect “our” people and I did half joke about it myself when the virus first arrived. But seriously who gives a rat’s ass? It will never be proved in less than 30 days. This virus does not require stealth to infect you! If we lose the election because of stupidity and ego during a time of crisis, aargh! So ask yourself this: 1) Did WE deserve this? or 2) We did deserve this. Knives out! Peter             

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Peter said:

Does anyone have some advice?

Don't take any polls too seriously right now, especially national polls. Don't get caught up in the moment, but be braced for the impact survey findings have on people who are not hardcore Trumpists. Clinton had somewhat similar levels of support at this time in 2016 ... but the race tightened in the final week until she was barely over 2%. Biden support may well fade away.

There are said be to some "warning signs" that key demographics -- general groups considered key to Trump's 2016 Electoral College victory -- have been slipping away from the Trump camp, but consider that turnout can obviate presumed losses. 

Are seniors actually "breaking for Biden," or are surveys too coarsely-grained to accurately assess this group? How do we anticipate the relative success of Get Out The Vote efforts?

Same for the conventional wisdom that surveys show Trump is losing women's support by a wide margin. How solid is this notion?

Same with punditry that claims "suburbs" will not return the same Trump margins as 2016. 

3 hours ago, Peter said:

Among likely Trump voters, you know we are looking at President Trump’s dangerous dismissal of the coronavirus and science, and then the payback to him, his wife, and a lot of top Republicans and military for poor judgement. “As ye sow, so shall ye reap” or whatever that saying is about. ‘Karma?”

Trump will be campaigning hard. He will not give up the fight. These next two weeks could upend a whole raft of assumptions. I did a review of OL-friendly YouTubers and their impressions of the actual situation. I'll perhaps share my read of those Trump-positive analyses in the All Polls Are Wrong topic.

[posted via cell phone. I may add to this back at my main computer.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

William,

I appreciate a little more reality in your comments about polls this election.

But with all the walking around the elephant in the room you still don't name it.

In general, the people running the polls cheat.

On purpose.

All the time.

That's the elephant.

What's more, everybody sees it.

And they will stop cheating about a week before the election in order to seem like they are accurate and be qualified to get a gig the next go around.

In other words, this is another form of cheating. They are cheating their future clients.

Cheating is what they do.

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/8/2020 at 2:09 PM, ThatGuy said:

(pic shows NPR reporting "militias" contrasted with the anarchist video...)

TG,

Just so we're clear about that rightwing militia (we meaning all of us, not just you and me):

Not Making Headlines: Alleged “Right-wing” Militia Member Arrested for Plot Against Gov. Whitmer Was Black Lives Matter Protester and Sympathizer

Quote

... now there is evidence a second “rightwing” militia member attended at least one Black Lives Matter protest and was sympathetic to George Floyd and BLM protesters.

They were probably running a false flag thing to blame Trump supporters.

Kinda like a Jussie Smollett move, except with real guns--and they got caught before they could stage their media splash.

Michael

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This:

I Didn’t Vote For Trump In 2016, But I’d Crawl Over Broken Glass To Vote For Him Now

:) 

The article is from the Federalist by David Sound

Quote

Even though I had voted for every Republican presidential candidate since 1980, I didn’t vote for Donald Trump in 2016.

Many Republican nominees had been huge disappointments to me, and I wasn’t going to vote for yet another GOP candidate I thought would betray my trust. I couldn’t imagine Trump as a genuine conservative who would champion limited government, respect individual freedom and liberty, and protect the unborn — but was I ever wrong. Although I didn’t vote for Trump in 2016, I would crawl over broken glass to vote for him in 2020.

In 2016, I was convinced Trump was just another New York liberal. On election night, however, I smiled. I was happy that at least Hillary Clinton wouldn’t be president, and I suspected that the next four years with Trump would at least be entertaining.

The primary reason I didn’t vote for Trump in 2016 was that I didn’t believe him.

Frankly, this last statement is why Sound was easily able to come around and say he would now crawl over broken glass to vote for Trump.

He uses his own eyes. Not just words.

He notices when words and deeds do not line up. And he holds deeds higher than words as an indication of what a person truly believes and will do in the future.

He ended with this:

Quote

As president, Trump has largely kept his promises and fought against relentless opposition. I don’t care about the tone of his tweets nor if his opponents think he’s rude. I’ve seen that he is a patriot who genuinely loves the United States of America and its people. I misjudged Trump in 2016, but I will do everything I can to see that he is re-elected in 2020 — and I’m sure I’m not the only one.

 

To put a cherry on that Ice Cream Sunday:

 

Also, Rush Limbaugh discussed this article with President Trump in his MEGA MAGA! The Largest Radio Rally in History yesterday and he said he was honored by it.

Things are looking really good for this election. Pro-Trump people are super-pumped. I know I am.

:) 

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/8/2020 at 1:10 PM, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

TF,

You mean like spying on Trump through the intelligence services, the Russian hoax, the impeachment, etc., etc, etc.? Those kind of conspiracies?

In my understanding of the world, people who do these things and get caught actually do these things and keep doing these things.

They don't stop.

And they don't turn into angels from one day to the next just because some people don't like the idea of conspiracy theories.

Let me turn the question around on you.

Why is Trump the only one who has to be attacked? Is sanction of the victim such a noble thing in your view?

And most of all: 

Where is the list of high-level Democrats getting sick?

Just a coincidence there is none, huh?

Michael

I don't think the lefts "response" on Trump extends to the virus is all I said.  I'm limiting my part in this discussion to the 200 attendees with 11 testing positive which to me sounds like a sampling of the population at large who contracted the virus, also considering no masks and no 6' distance at this event.

Is it possible? Sure. And its a great story line with banter created on all sides. I do realize and know that suspect rumors going on since '16 and virtually all had a basis in truth. We just had to wait for the evidence. Now, for me, at least, I prejudge on the basis of most all of what we heard being true from the moment Trump came down the escalator.

But. Were there "high level Democrats" getting together in large numbers publicly somewhere so it didn't escape the press?

I'm interested in the thought process in how the targeting was accomplished. My op is the Rose Garden guests were a microcosm of what takes place in the world. I don't conduct myself according to rules put out by anyone re flu, etc. I'm in large groups of people expelling volumes of breath and sputum for hrs at a time playing pickleball 3x a wk. I dont wear a mask - ever, other than to agree to a Drs office protocol once this summer to get stem cells. So, while I know there's risk, I choose like Trump to live life since everything carries an amount of risk.

My wife as much told me there was an attempt made on the Presidents life. Similar to how the Chinese virus spread, I think, and which has been the case for as long as I've been alive; '57,'68. Come to think about it, can we say that is a targeted attempt by the Chinese that's simply proven to be ineffective if their goal was to bring the US to its knees?

All of the 11 will be ok, I think. The first line of defense against SARS-CoV-2 is for his doctors to have forged a plan based on his age and co-morbidities to get him well asap. But that is the first time I ever heard Walter Reed being world class! I myself was there in '71 and it was bad news. I guess Trump can make that claim given his good news and the broken state of affairs at VA while claiming also he made it better. While the MSM focuses on more and more cases, eh people get sick....the vast majority also get well. Don't think that forms the basis for newsworthy events.

I liked his response about his possible immunity. My first instinct in March was I wanted to contract SARS-CoV-2 to lay to waste to the claims. Because it didn't pass the stink test and I wanted my own proof.

 

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

TG,

Just so we're clear about that rightwing militia (we meaning all of us, not just you and me):

Not Making Headlines: Alleged “Right-wing” Militia Member Arrested for Plot Against Gov. Whitmer Was Black Lives Matter Protester and Sympathizer

They were probably running a false flag thing to blame Trump supporters.

Kinda like a Jussie Smollett move, except with real guns--and they got caught before they could stage their media splash.

Michael


Yeah, I've seen the Smollett comparisons, and the suspicion that this was a potential false flag.
To add to that, yesterday, John Brennan tweeted out something that lends further speculation on that, and is speculated to be a "comm" on the matter, with his claim that Trump has been allowed to "KIDNAP" and destroy the GOP.
 

"Hard to think of a member of Congress more deserving of defeat than the unprincipled Devin Nunes....except maybe Senators Graham & McConnell & all the other party quislings who have allowed Donald Trump to kidnap & destroy the GOP. #DevinWontDebate"

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/8/2020 at 1:12 PM, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

TF,

I have no idea what you are talking about here.

That sounds like anti-Trump wishful thinking to me.

Michael

I forgot to include this '16 and '20 take. Take a look at his energy levels. See how vociferous he becomes while 4 yrs later hes saying, "Sure". And then gobbledegook, "stand back and stand by."

I'm not anti Trump by a long shot. Gotta leave room for me seeing things differently, I guess.

 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, turkeyfoot said:

I forgot to include this '16 and '20 take. Take a look at his energy levels. See how vociferous he becomes while 4 yrs later hes saying, "Sure". And then gobbledegook, "stand back and stand by."

I'm not anti Trump by a long shot. Gotta leave room for me seeing things differently, I guess.

 

I suspect his energy has been diverted, not so much lessened. 

--Brant

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, turkeyfoot said:

My wife as much told me there was an attempt made on the Presidents life.

My initial belief was that Trump had been deliberately infected as an assassination attempt.  The timing looked so suspicious.

I've come to think that the rash of Trump's and associates' getting the virus was a natural occurrence - though the existence of the virus isn’t.

Ellen

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, turkeyfoot said:

Well, not by ordinary human standards. He has the strength of 4 men and more to say he does. 😉

He is going to need that strength.

Fox News Poll: Biden-Trump a 5-point race in post-convention poll The Joe Biden-Kamala Harris ticket is ahead of the Donald Trump-Mike Pence ticket by a 51-46 percent margin. 

You would think Fox what lie, wouldn’t you? After all, the left thinks Fox is a front for the Trump or conservative campaigns. I keep hoping for a swing as occurred in 2016 but, ho hum, not much has changed. As many have mentioned fake polls are one way to under-mind the candidate the pollsters want to lose. But I also think pollsters make money when they are right, they are scoffed at when they are wrong, and they are ignored or go kaput when they are really, really off.

On September 9th to September 15th The Rasmussen Poll had Trump ahead by one percent. Since then, NO POLL has shown Trump ahead or tied with Biden. The latest polls from September 30, 2020 show a Biden victory from 3 points to nearly 10 points. 270 electoral college votes are needed to be elected president. Today’s Real Clear Politics no toss-up electoral college map, has Biden at 358 and Trump at 180.

Friday, October 09, 2020. The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Friday . . . .  shows that 46% of Likely U.S. Voters approve of President Trump’s job performance. Fifty-two percent (52%) disapprove.

Let me count on my fingers . . . only four percent are undecided. But 46 and 4 are 50. Can he squeeze out a narrow victory using those numbers? Yes! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Peter said:

Let me count on my fingers . . . only four percent are undecided. But 46 and 4 are 50. Can he squeeze out a narrow victory using those numbers? Yes! 

I can't do math even with my fingers. joke edit 46 and 2 are 48.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said:

My initial belief was that Trump had been deliberately infected as an assassination attempt.  The timing looked so suspicious.

I've come to think that the rash of Trump's and associates' getting the virus was a natural occurrence - though the existence of the virus isn’t.

Ellen

Ellen,

What about no high-level Democrats getting the virus?

Do you believe that's just a coincidence?

I agree getting sick with this thing is a natural occurrence, but there is more than just timing going on. There's targeting, too.

Nobody can prove anything right now and we all have our own opinions, but when there is this much coincidence, and it is so easy to purposely infect others undetected, and high-level Democrats openly compare Trump to the worst monsters in human history, and there was massive celebration in the mainstream media and among Dems about President Trump's impending demise over getting COVID-19, it's just too much for me to ignore.

They want him dead. Not gone. Dead. Many Dems say so right up front.

Then President Trump got a deadly disease and they didn't when they are constantly exposed to the same things and they keep getting busted for breaking protocol.

I just can't ignore that and brush it into the "superspreader" bin as the most likely cause.

Michael

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Brant Gaede said:

I suspect his energy has been diverted, not so much lessened. 

--Brant

Brant,

I agree. I think he's sick and tired of being asked the same damn question by the same damn people when he keeps answering them.

How enthusiastic can you get over a person like Chris Wallace acting like a retard on purpose and demanding you swear an oath to do what you normally do to boot? Getting exasperated and holding it in is energy-draining, but it is a whole lot better than saying, "Fuck you, asshole," in the middle of a presidential debate. :) 

Besides, President Trump's energy level for rallies and presentations and tweets--and his normal workload--is just as high as it has always been.

Michael

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Certainly no shortage of death wishes, ill will for the President. 

Wouldn't be taken up casually by anyone seriously interested in results. To believe it you'd have to consider it to be a pros job. Someone who could isolate, concentrate the virus and move around easily within the Presidents entourage, subject themselves to SS scrutiny and then because its too much of a wish and prayer for it to be delivered to its subject with an exposure level likely to kill render in a lot of luck. Hypothetically, I figure it wouldn't be difficult for someone like Hope Hicks to get bumped and carry live virus onto Trumps plane. But the President enjoys 24/7 medical care. I think the problem with most 70+ dying occurs due to the waiting until it's taken hold, to figure out when the right time is to go to the hospital, where the chances of getting it there are real. If it was a Dem wet dream look how badly they shot themselves in the foot. 

USA Today did a piece that publicly asked for the identity of unknown guests to the Rose Garden. SS probably has the event on reel, time stamped with everyone known and has followed up leads. After all they are responsible for the Presidents life. There were comments from the irascible Left that made it seem Trump had unnecessarily exposed the SS protectorates. Bullets aren't as forgiving as germs.

And again when have the Dems had a public event, other than protests/rioting with top people together enough to lead to an equivalent outcome?

But if we entertain this level of hatred to not just passing comments from uncivil people but people with a real axe to grind and real benefits to gain why would it be unthinkable that an invisible Chinese hand in it or any such foreign entity made an attempt on the Presidents life? Why stop at SARS-CoV-2 why not something out of Wuhan that will literally kill? The Russians are known to do this type of thing. Ha ha there we go again, R-U-S-S-I--A. The foe not friend.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Illustrating Peter's reference to Real Clear Politics' no-toss-up Electoral College Map [click images or link to visit the cited page: ]. 

2 hours ago, Peter said:

The latest polls from September 30, 2020 show a Biden victory from 3 points to nearly 10 points. 270 electoral college votes are needed to be elected president. Today’s Real Clear Politics no toss-up electoral college map, has Biden at 358 and Trump at 180.

notossup01b.png

notossup01C.png

-- if anyone asks "Is Biden doing any better in the polls right now than Clinton was at this point in the campaign four years ago?" you can say "Not really, but ..."  and make sure you have all your buts in a row.  The most skeptical of "Polls Show" Trump-supporting YouTube pundits regularly cited on OL ask that we "Observe 'Swing States'" or variations of  "look at the grille of results above and ponder."  

Why wouldn't the race tighten up in Trump's favour, as with 2016?  

-- I think the lasting true answer will come after the election, though we can utter many festive speculations until then. In the meantime, is Trumplove stronger than Trumphate? How to assess the probabilities in the absence of reliable or indicative public opinion surveys?

Why not Objectivist Intuition©?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now