Coronavirus

[Marc]

8 hours ago, Peter said:

The science President Trump was thinking about at his Alabama rally when he suggested people get "the shot." The crowd booed him. Will you join with them and boo President Trump? Come on. Let's hear a big boo.

I bet you that if you were a Tom Brady fan and were with him for all of his Super Bowl rings and loved him forever, and in the first game of the season , the exhibition season, Brady throws a pass and gets intercepted, that you would stand up and boo him too.

What have you done for me lately, right?

President Trump is saving the entire world.

 

[Peter]

3 hours ago, Marc said:

President Trump is saving the entire world.

Well, gee. So you are going to get "the shot?" If they offer a booster at the VA, I will get it. 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

14 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

The BioNTech vaccine, which has the trade name of "Comirnaty," has full FDA approval, albeit granted under sketchy conditions. But it is not even available yet

This raises a very interesting situation with the control freaks.

Let's see what a top lawyer says.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I keep referencing Dr. Malone.

This is one of the reasons why.

On top of him being an expert in virology, his position is what I call an excellent example of reason.

Michael

[ThatGuy]

For those who may be interested (live in 3 hours):
Ayn Rand Institute: Vaccines Vs. the Delta Variant: With Dr. Amesh Adalja

 

[ThatGuy]

"Plus ça change..."
 

The Photograph That Brought an End to 1918’s Mask Mandate During Spanish Flu
 

The Photograph That Brought an End to 1918's Mask Mandate During Spanish Flu

RESISTTHEMAINSTREAM.ORG

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Check this out.

quote:

At the height of the worst pandemic in American history – the Spanish flu of 1918 – cities across the country did something, modern America would find familiar. They issued mandatory mask mandates and punished anyone who didn’t comply. “The man or woman or child who will not wear a mask now is a dangerous slacker,” read a typical announcement from the Red Cross.

The city of San Francisco, took the rules so seriously that a city health agent shot a man who refused to wear a mask – he hit the two bystanders who happened to be standing behind the man. That seemed a bit much to some people, but many others went along with it. They were afraid of the virus. They wanted to do their part to stop it. Most of all, they trusted their leaders. If their leaders put a mandate in place, they assumed it was for a good reason and they wanted to help.

But then something happened that shook the American public from their blind obedience. A photograph surfaced from a boxing match in San Francisco. Among those attending were several high-ranking public officials—all unmasked.

“The photograph went national. Americans were shocked to discover that the people making and enforcing the rules had no intention of following those rules,” Carlson said. “Mask mandates across the country ended shortly after.  The public was willing to endure inconvenience, but not hypocrisy.”

end quote

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

4 hours ago, ThatGuy said:

For those who may be interested (live in 3 hours):
Ayn Rand Institute: Vaccines Vs. the Delta Variant: With Dr. Amesh Adalja

TG,

I tuned in just to see what this was about and the thing was live when I did.

I heard Adalja explaining how vaccine-induced immunity was superior to natural immunity ("more robust" was his phrase). I had to turn it off after that big sloppy one.

For God's sake...

Vaccine-caused immunity makes people more immune than natural immunity from getting ill does?

Really?

Then why such a clamor for the fucking booster shots?

Gimmee a break.

Besides, becoming immune is a result, not a cause. Once you are immune to a disease, you are immune no matter how you got there. A is not B, an effect is not its cause, and never will be.

This is Objectivist epistemology 101. 

(Pssssst... Here's an element no one wants to think about. Natural immunity is free. Vaccines cost a lot of money and, in this case, the government foots the bill.)

There's a reason I don't participate in this shit. This kind of boneheaded statement is pure philosophical toadyism for government funding.

Just look. That's what ARI has turned into.

Michael

[anthony]

2 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

TG,

I tuned in just to see what this was about and the thing was live when I did.

I heard Adalja explaining how vaccine-induced immunity was superior to natural immunity ("more robust" was his phrase). I had to turn it off after that big sloppy one.

For God's sake...

Vaccine-caused immunity makes people more immune than natural immunity from getting ill does?

Really?

Then why such a clamor for the fucking booster shots?

Gimmee a break.

Besides, becoming immune is a result, not a cause. Once you are immune to a disease, you are immune no matter how you got there. A is not B, an effect is not its cause, and never will be.

This is Objectivist epistemology 101. 

(Pssssst... Here's an element no one wants to think about. Natural immunity is free. Vaccines cost a lot of money and, in this case, the government foots the bill.)

There's a reason I don't participate in this shit. This kind of boneheaded statement is pure philosophical toadyism for government funding.

Just look. That's what ARI has turned into.

Michael

Which comes first? Until the vaccines were developed and made available, their affect upon immunity is moot, non-existent.

In the mean time, for over one year, some amount of natural immunity could have been achieved. (If not suppressed by lockdowns etc.)

Fine, one can have the two together, eventually, but vaccine immunity alone, for masses of people from now on, is an unknown, and there is the big danger of viruses mutating even faster to fight the vaccines. And - of people's natural antibodies weakening, from those increased shots needed in future.

So i don't know about Adalja's theory, I will try to listen.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

2 hours ago, anthony said:

Which comes first?

Tony,

What does that have to do with the nature of immunity?

Does natural immunity mean partial immunity and vaccine-produced immunity mean "more robust" immunity as Adalja claimed?

I've never heard of natural immunity being weaker than vaccine-produced immunity.

I always thought the process of vaccinating people was to control and make safe a way to get immunity to individuals, not to provide them with a new and improved super-duper enhanced immunity. (One that needs booster shots at that... heh...)

2 hours ago, anthony said:

... one can have the two together...

Absolutely true if you are referring to a population.

Is it true for the same individual?

Are there two different immunities that an individual can acquire?

I know there are details like that business with producing spike proteins and so on, but all this parsing of details sounds like blah blah blah. Difference in kind is different than difference in degree. And this new way of talking about it swaps the two as if they were the same.

Here is something that does not sound like blah blah blah.

Big pharma is skinning the population as much as it can get away with through government payments and it is not liable for anything to boot.

In their position, I, too, would drum up some nice-sounding blah blah blah. After all, that's a lot of money.

It's just a little much to say their product gives a "more robust" result than herd immunity gives--except it is weaker. So it needs boosters.

How does that work? It doesn't. That's how.

It's just words, not reality.

They need that kind of bullshit in order to justify skinning the public even more than they have done through boosters, but they're not even hiding the contradiction anymore. They have the power, so Orwell's Newspeak is as good as anything for the philosophy part. 

And, apparently, ARI is helping jazz up the "A is not A" contradiction and selling it to the public under the guise of reason. Randian reason at that. It makes one wonder, who is getting money from whom?

The more I live, the more I understand that large-scale misbehavior of rulers always comes down to money, sex and power. 

Michael

[anthony]

1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Tony,

What does that have to do with the nature of immunity?

Does natural immunity mean partial immunity and vaccine-produced immunity mean "more robust" immunity as Adalja claimed?

I've never heard of natural immunity being weaker than vaccine-produced immunity.

I always thought the process of vaccinating people was to control and make safe a way to get immunity to individuals, not to provide them with a new and improved super-duper enhanced immunity. (One that needs booster shots at that... heh...)

Absolutely true if you are referring to a population.

Is it true for the same individual?

Are there two different immunities that an individual can acquire?

 

Michael

We're on the same page, Michael, if you read me right. My point being in continuance of yours - natural herd immunity has to be first, because it happens first.  One could say, it lays the necessary foundation. The vaccination "herd immunity" will gradually build later when the vaccine has been delivered, after research and testing and multi-vaccinations. I'm one to give natural immunity a high priority. Except it was drastically reduced, the fault going to locking down, masking and distancing people - against the best epidemiological advice - trying to 'flatten the curve'.  Which must cause a longer curve, they say, and now seems to be confirmed. 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Tony,

I fully agree that the control-freak measures screwed the development of herd immunity.

But only for a small while. Nature has a way of making mincemeat out of the plans of bad guys.

As Rand constantly said, "Nature to be commanded must be obeyed."

The good news is that the people who are imposing this crap are same people who think men can menstruate and become pregnant.

I predict their time in power is limited.

 

So the real issue is how to contain the damage they are doing while they have power to do so, not whether they are right or wrong. Nature itself will let them know, loud and clear, just how wrong they are.

Michael

[anthony]

And right, the herd immunity is only in reference to a population. An individual can't have a 'double' immunity, I'm sure.

Individual immunity (of any kind) is not permanent, apparently. I don't know for certain, but someone said "natural" lasts longer.

There is that story I linked of the prof who overturned the university's vaccine mandate, for that very reason: he had had Covid and therefore natural immunity, so refused a vaccination. They accepted - one small win for free will.

[anthony]

40 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

Tony,

I fully agree that the control-freak measures screwed the development of herd immunity.

But only for a small while. Nature has a way of making mincemeat out of the plans of bad guys.

As Rand constantly said, "Nature to be commanded must be obeyed."

The good news is that the people who are imposing this crap are same people who think men can menstruate and become pregnant.

I predict their time in power is limited.

 

So the real issue is how to contain the damage they are doing while they have power to do so, not whether they are right or wrong. Nature itself will let them know, loud and clear, just how wrong they are.

Michael

The concerns of some scientists are that (as one said) "throwing vaccines into the teeth of a pandemic" - with such a low threshold of natural herd immunity in the population - could have consequences. They worry that the virus mutations could only increase, in fighting back against the vaccines. And, that down the line, mankind's powerful, natural immune system would weaken by over-exposure to evermore vaccinations.

But i said that already. What the world is doing with freedoms and individual choice while justifying dictatorial actions with saving lives, alarms me.

I agree with you and Bacon. "Obey", identify and understand nature before you go messing with it.

These guys have forgotten the basic rule of science.

[tmj]

If history is any guide (is there another ?) , then it seems reasonable to assume time is on our side . As more variants emerge that suggests changes are occurring on an evolutionary continuum, and in the past viruses that travel with longevity through populations tend to evolve to less virulent versions .

I haven’t studied or even looked at what the landscape in global health concerns was in 1920 , but I think it is a safe bet it was waaayyy better than 1918, and that was without benefit of modern medical technology and applied knowledge.

A huge wrench is what , other than the furin site manipulations is in the encoding of the engineered virus.

It is getting harder and harder to use the word vaccine in reference to the jabs , maybe it’s age but the word connotes a concept in my head that just doesn’t look like what the term denotes today.

[anthony]

1 hour ago, tmj said:

If history is any guide (is there another ?) , then it seems reasonable to assume time is on our side . As more variants emerge that suggests changes are occurring on an evolutionary continuum, and in the past viruses that travel with longevity through populations tend to evolve to less virulent versions .

 

But isn't that the precise point? That viruses can be allowed to "travel...through populations ..."?

But, what if their travel has been severely curtailed (lock downs) and the apparent solution, when it arrives, is to immediately vaccinate the whole population, will they have become less virulent in the interim? Doesn't that prolonged transmission curve, which was artificially flattened, not eventuate in more virulent mutations because of the extra time in circulation?

Of course I don't know enough. What I suspect is that many scientists are still guessing and finding out as they go.

After all, the older tried and tested vaccinations have nearly always been chosen by one individual at a time, for his/her personal safety, and here we're vaccinating many millions at once for mass safety. This seems unknown territory.

Naturally speaking, a virus eventually wears itself out. Not eliminated, altogether. Right, the more virulent and more transmittable the variant, the more the fatalities; but as one epidemiologist insisted from the start - the objective is we protect the known, soft targets. This way, we likely reduce the severe cases and deaths and let the virus spread while the population goes about things as normal. When they get here, the vaccines will release the 'soft targets' from isolation (and anyone who wants/needs them, e.g. those who haven't contracted the virus and have no immunity to it). Sounds counter-intuitive, but from all angles I can imagine I believe the results today would be better off in every way and probably with less fatalities (or at least, no more). I don't know enough but I can see what the other method has done to people everywhere.

[tmj]

Tony

I believe we agree. 

The more time that passes the closer we are to the virus being integrated into the rest of the universe.

As a side note , I thought I was hearing a lot about AI and protein folding solving , isn’t this right up that alley? Or does It only play Jeopardy?

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I have received the following article by Makia Freeman from several people offline.

Irrespective of the merits of the science, the following are 10 societal trends:

COVID Trends: 10 Current Operation Coronavirus Trends (August 2021)

THEFREEDOMARTICLES.COM

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Learn the 10 current and important COVID trends in Operation Coronavirus as of August 2021. Will humanity rise up to stop this?

Here are the trends listed without discussion as an overview.

But read the article for both discussion and sources.

Quote

COVID Trends #1: Vaccine Mandates and Segregation of the Vaccinated and Unvaccinated

COVID Trends #2: Blaming the Unvaccinated

COVID Trends #3: Punishing the Unvaccinated

COVID Trends #4: Tyrants Pushing It to the Extreme

COVID Trends #5: Masking Children

COVID Trends #6: Vaxxing Children

COVID Trends #7: Forcing Mental Assessments and Psych Evaluations on Those Who Don’t Buy the Narrative

COVID Trends #8: Heartless Rules and Heartless Rule-Followers

COVID Trends #9: Inventing Scary-Sounding Variants Out of Thin Air

COVID Trends #10: Vaccine Injuries and Deaths Mount Sky High

This is not America.

This is what tyranny looks like.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

For people who are worried about the unknown effects of the vaccines and wish to explore ways to detox from the vaccines, here is a start.

Dr. Merritt Talks COVID Vaccine Detox

WWW.BITCHUTE.COM

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Dr. Lee Merritt of https://themedicalrebel.com joins The Alex Jones Show to break down the ways people can detox from the COVID...

 

I don't endorse any of this with certainty, but I, personally, already do some of this stuff and I will likely do some of the stuff I don't do right now. But not all. After all, I didn't get the vax.

From what I saw, I didn't see anything dangerous recommended by Dr. Merritt. So the biggest risk from side-effects from following Dr. Merritt's recommendations is that nothing will happen.

Watch this video. Take notes if you like, and use the information or not. Go deeper or not. Find similar stuff or not.

At least this is a door open. These are some things you can try to detox from potential vaccine side effects if you wish to and scientists are recommending them.

Here's a novel idea:

You look. You decide. It's your life.

(Man, I bet that pisses off the control freaks something awful.  )

Michael

[Peter]

1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

You look. You decide. It's your life.

At the King of Prussia Mall in Pennsylvania, some mask use was required. On a more positive note The VA has gone back to a 90 day supply of a blood pressure med I take. There is no longer a shortage. Most doctor's offices in my area, clinics, and hospitals are still requiring masks.       

[ThatGuy]

 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Here is part of what happened between Robert Kennedy Jr. and President Trump re the vaccines early in his presidency.

Robert F Kennedy Jr. Blows Whistle On Trump Taking $1 Million From Pfizer

WWW.BITCHUTE.COM

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Trump on the vaccine.... https://www.bitchute.com/video/dynxtqZMfWIC/

The headline is misleading. It makes it seem like Trump took a bribe. But even common sense blows that idea up. What is $1 million to a billionaire who just became president? it's a drop in the bucket.

But Trump did receive a barrage of pressure from the people around him to go with Big Pharma. Don't forget, this was before COVID-19. I don't know what tipped it, but whatever it was, they did it right. Trump did shut down the program he was setting up with Robert Kennedy Jr.

And the rest is history. Here came COVID-19 and the vaccines.

Draw your own conclusions.

 

I was, am and will still be a huge Trump supporter.

This is one area where I am at odds--really strong odds--with what he did. He was wrong. And this one is a doozy. 

I hope this is past tense only, though, and does not extend to the future.

Once Trump is reelected, if he goes off into the arms of Big Pharma again, I will work against it.

Enough of this crap.

Michael

 

 

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

YouTube is not allowing this video on its platform since it gives information on the failures of the FDA and that goes against the intentions of the current batch of authoritarians.

But I think it is important to look at this stuff in addition to recognizing the benefits Big Pharma has contributed to mankind.

Emotionalism and censorship are poor substitutes for reason.

And if you don't identify something correctly, it is really hard to judge it correctly, and near impossible to judge it correctly with consistency. 

So the first step in using reason, always, is to identify the relevant facts, good, bad and indifferent. Then judge.

Well how can one identify something at all, much less correctly, if he never sees it?

You will not see in the mainstream the relevant facts in the video below. But they are as relevant as they can be in evaluating the FDA.

As full disclosure, I did not dig and double check the info in this video. But it is so easy to research (is a drug on the market now or not?), and the visuals look so informative, it all looks pretty accurate.

URGENT! History's 7 Deadly Lessons on “Full FDA Approval”

WWW.BITCHUTE.COM

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***URGENT....PLEASE READ*** Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. There are MILLIONS who've trusted the FDA and Big Pharma in the past. They've trusted them with their VERY LIVES...

After seeing that, it does make one pause and think about the true value of an FDA approval. 

It's certainly not a guarantee, or at times, even an assurance, of anything.

And don't forget, Big Pharma gets to keep the money it makes from selling dangerous drugs that have addicted, damaged and/or killed millions of people. Oh, there are the lawsuits, but they never get the bulk of the money.

In this sense, especially when Big Pharma is granted immunity from prosecution, it turns into a racket, not a boon to mankind.

That's why one always has to look behind the "controlled narratives."

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Man, if this doesn't say it all.

This actually is funny and I want to put a smiley in, but I promised myself never to do that when I want to spit at the same time.

Michael

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

It seems like I am going on a campaign against vaccines.

I am not.

I am on a campaign against misinformation, censorship, crony-government-corporation grift, health scams and coercion.

For example, here is a fact you will not find much in the mainstream.

New Israeli Study Finds Fully Vaccinated People are at "Greater Risk of Hospitalization" and 13 TIMES MORE LIKELY to Catch Covid-19 Than Those Who Have Recovered and Have Natural Immunity

WWW.THEGATEWAYPUNDIT.COM

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A new study out of Israel has seemingly confirmed that individuals who have natural immunity have better protection against the NEW DELTA VARIANT than people who are fully vaccinated. The team of...

I'm not putting this up to do a gotcha or win any argument.

I don't care about that shit.

(Well... er... maybe a little...  ... But not here. Not with something this serious.)

I'm putting it up to add to the access of credible information since it is being censored at major venues.

Michael

[william.scherk]

43 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said:

[H]ere is a fact you will not find much in the mainstream.

It's in the "mainstream."  The mainstream reported it first

Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a

WWW.SCIENCEMAG.ORG

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Israelis who had an infection were more protected against the Delta coronavirus variant than those who had an already highly effective...

The preprint is available here:

Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections

WWW.MEDRXIV.ORG

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medRxiv - The Preprint Server for Health Sciences