Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 In terms of stated efficacy of the vaccines on the Fact Sheets, Robert Barnes, a lawyer I like a lot (and I normally do not like lawyers ) goes through the Pfizer Fact Sheet, but mentions that the others have almost identical language. Shared post VIVABARNESLAW.LOCALS.COM Connect with VivaBarnesLaw and other members of VivaBarnesLaw community His conclusion after reading through all the salient points, is that the Vaccine companies, through their legally required Fact Sheets, give the same chances of their respective vaccine working as for it not working. Their own words. This means the Vaccine companies do not stand behind their product enough to say it works. Instead they hedge their language to say nothing. I think this is important information for a person to know when deciding whether to take the vaccine or not. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 24 minutes ago, Peter said: What are the “rich and famous” doing? From Business Insider: . . . Trump privately received the coronavirus vaccine while he was president in January . . . . Trump encouraged his supporters to get the shot for the first time on Sunday . . . . As president, Trump frequently dismissed following public health guidelines during the pandemic and mocked mask-wearing on several occasions. The former president contracted the coronavirus in October and was hospitalized for three nights at the Walter Reed National Military Medical Center. From The Sun: . . . On December 21, 2020, then-President-Elect Biden received the first dose of the Pfizer and BioNTech coronavirus vaccine. "Private jets and no masks — how Obama’s party was height of elite hypocrisy" Quote As the rest of America struggles with uncertain employment status and school reopenings, shifting mask mandates, anxiety over vaccinations and variants, the health of the economy and the citizenry at large, Obama had to go and throw himself a huge, epic, three-day birthday bash on Martha’s Vineyard. You would think a former president — one who clearly considers himself more intelligent and sensitive than most — would exercise some restraint. Or at least understand that this was a supremely bad look. Here were a host of left-leaning eco-warrior celebs, all Obama’s “close friends,” of course, descending on an already understaffed and emotionally depleted Vineyard. “His birthday party is insane,” one of Obama’s caterers told The Post last week. “What is he thinking?” Clearly, Obama thought to do whatever he damn well pleased — even after such backlash caused him to effectively cancel his party. Private jets and no masks — how Obama's party was height of elite... NYPOST.COM For someone who prides himself on optics, Barack Obama just gave us quite an ugly spectacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 "Your papers, please..." "Lost in Tuesday’s hoopla about the resignation of Andrew Cuomo and the nightmarishly expensive — cough cough — infrastructure bill was a disturbing appearance by Fauci on MSNBC’s “Morning Mr. Mika” program. Fauci finally admits that he’s “sorry” and he knows that although “people must like to have their individual freedom,” it’s time for mandates anyway." 'Sociopath' Fauci Finally Openly Admits He Doesn't Care About Freedom PJMEDIA.COM Fauci Finally Comes Clean At this point, I have written volumes about my dislike and distrust of one Anthony “The Real Dr. Faustus” Fauci... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 "Fauci vs. Ayn Rand": Q: "Should the government require inoculations against diseases, or the quarantine of people with communicable diseases?" Rand: "Requiring inoculation against disease is definitely not a job for the government. If it is medically proven that a certain inoculation is desirable, those who want it will take it. If some disagree and don’t want it, they alone are endangered, since the others will be inoculated. Nobody has the right to force a person to do anything for his own good and against his own judgment. "If someone has a contagious disease, however, against which there is no inoculation, then the government has the right to quarantine him. The principle here is to prevent diseased people from passing on their illness to others. Here there is a demonstrable physical damage. In all issues of government protection against physical damage, before the government can properly act, there must be an objective demonstration of an actual physical danger. [emphasis mine]To quarantine people who are ill is not a violation of their rights; it merely prevents them from doing physical damage to others. [APM 62] Q: "Should the government license physicians and dentists? " Rand: "The government has no right to pass judgment on the fitness of professionals. So, what would protect us from quacks in a free society? The free judgment of individual men, and the professional organizations and publications that report to its members or subscribers on the standing of various practitioners. Government licenses and medical school diplomas do not protect us from quacks. We must still exercise our judgment in selecting a physician, which is what we would do in a free society. Government licensing protects us from nothing, but could be used to keep better people out of a controlled profession. [APM 62]" Mayhew, Robert. Ayn Rand Answers: The Best of Her Q & A (p. 13). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 2 hours ago, Peter said: From The Sun: . . . On December 21, 2020, then-President-Elect Biden received the first dose of the Pfizer and BioNTech coronavirus vaccine. Biden's border policies are also allowing in illegal aliens with no vaxx, but hey, let's bully American citizens into the jab and MORE mask mandates and lockdowns... Biden failed to reconcile border policy with the science: Hundreds of THEHILL.COM If Biden is going to let them into the U.S., he should at least test them for COVID-19 before releasing them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmj Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Aunt Bea leads the effort for schools to administer statins at lunch for students k-12., based on the fact that no study shows adverse effects in long term use in children. And the CDC said it may prevent cardiovascular disease. They are the experts so.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 A tale in two parts: From this: -to this. (What’s that, Zuby? Oh, that’s just the sound of Barbara Branden rolling over in her grave…and an earthquake in Valhalla…) ID2020 | Digital Identity Alliance ID2020.ORG The ID2020 Alliance is a global partnership maximizing the potential of digital ID to improve lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 They're not even trying to hide it... And New Zealand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 On 8/11/2021 at 5:01 AM, Michael Stuart Kelly said: We are in a bad state in this country when the following is considered good news. BREAKING: Delta, Southwest, and American Airlines WILL NOT Require Employees to Receive Experimental COVID-19 Jabs BREAKING: Delta, Southwest, and American Airlines WILL NOT Require Employees to Receive Experimental COVID-19 Jabs WELOVETRUMP.COM I’ll admit, this was shocking news. After United Airlines announced an ultimatum for all their employees to receive the experimental... Hopefully, their courage will give courage to the other airline companies. Freedom is serious. It's easy to lose and hard as hell to get back. Michael Bucking the trend. Man, am I heartened by this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted August 12, 2021 Author Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 hour ago, anthony said: Bucking the trend. Man, am I heartened by this. I certainly don’t think shots should be mandatory Tony, but I have also heard that more and more stores and restaurants are requiring proof of vaccination. There was a story on one of the major news network where a woman took her sick husband to a hospital (in Texas?) but they were out if ICU beds. The state of New Mexico took him in. Unfortunately he is still getting worse. From The New York Times: . . . Across Texas, health officials warned of overloaded, strained hospitals, a growing crisis not seen since early February, when a late winter wave deluged the state’s health care system. More than 10,000 Texans have been hospitalized this week and at least 53 hospitals were at maximum capacity in their intensive care units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 5 hours ago, ThatGuy said: They're not even trying to hide it... TG, Arnie says: "SCREW YOUR FREEDOMS!" Arnie should learn to keep his mouth shut. Stuff like this could happen. That's the father Arnie grew up with? Something to think about... Michael 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Let's add this to Uncle Arnie. Arnie should know. He knows how this works. His father was there. Michael 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 On 8/12/2021 at 6:48 AM, Peter said: I certainly don’t think shots should be mandatory Tony, but I have also heard that more and more stores and restaurants are requiring proof of vaccination. There was a story on one of the major news network where a woman took her sick husband to a hospital (in Texas?) but they were out if ICU beds. The state of New Mexico took him in. Unfortunately he is still getting worse. From The New York Times: . . . Across Texas, health officials warned of overloaded, strained hospitals, a growing crisis not seen since early February, when a late winter wave deluged the state’s health care system. More than 10,000 Texans have been hospitalized this week and at least 53 hospitals were at maximum capacity in their intensive care units. The thing is Peter, I absolutely agree with you about your decision to vaccinate (from what I read about your context). I'd advise anyone who asked my opinion and was uncertain of their health viability, to do the same and not take unnecessary risks. But for those unlike you who would force mandatory jabs, what's their outrage? Why are so many getting so vicious about this? Not much sympathy for the fate of the unvaxxed, I am certain. And yes, they will point in justification to a recent upswing of hospitalizations. But (some of) the unvaxxed are the ones taking chances with their lives. Not them. They are apparently quite immune. Not forgetting this: the vast majority of the dubious, the unvaxxed, know they are also highly immune, due to health and youth, or previous exposure. I don't accept that any aged etc. should reject vaccination merely on principle. Life must come before principles. Yet, if that's the risk they re willing to take, on their own heads be it. Perhaps some, consciously, would rather "die on their feet than live on their knees". For the large majority who will not give up self-responsibility and free choice, who don't actually need vaccination, they have my full support. (Then the responsibility is on each to do their utmost to protect and/or try to have vaccinated their own frail etc. family members). The pandemic will some day be over, due to a combination of herd immunity and vaccinations, but what will not be over, what will be certainly lost in this process will be much of our individual freedoms of choice and action. They won't be regained in a hurry - or at a great cost. That outcome, the final control over societies, is what too many people aspire to (for "our good" of course). In the last analysis, there are many around us today who hate and/or are scared of the idea of others living free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Speaking of Tuskegee..."Those who learn from history are doomed to repeat it." Well, there's a certain demographic who remembers history well enough to "question the scientists", if not the science, and for good, valid, OBJECTIVE reasons... L on Gab: '' - Gab Social GAB.COM L on Gab: 'It ain’t just Republicans.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted August 12, 2021 Author Share Posted August 12, 2021 Tony wrote, “But for those unlike you who would force mandatory jabs, what's their outrage? Why are so many getting so vicious about this?” They may be authoritarians or afraid. On the private front, a landowner, store owner, or any type of owner is simply mandating that what is done on their property is their business and they have the right to say yes or no. Many restaurants require fifty percent capacity. But of course "the state" is a different situation. Here is an interesting, somewhat humorous, non-relevant point. I have corn fields on two sides of my house and woods on a third side. We are not on a main artery though we are close to the resort city of Ocean City, Maryland. A lot of people pull over to the side of the road to “rush” into a corn field, especially children. You can surmise what they are doing, with their parents watching from the car. I consider this an emergency situation. Is requiring masks, distancing, or vaccinations an emergency situation? Look at the evidence. I think the motives for mask mandates, isolation, and mandatory vaccinations vary among the “imposers.” But the steep rise in hospitalizations in two “anti-mask,” “anti vax” states, Texas and Florida, does give a degree of validity to the claim that those impositions are for the public good if instituted. Children in America who wish to attend public schools are required to be vaccinated for a wide variety of diseases. If we lay aside the wild claims of those who are anti vax’ers is this any different? Will the governors of Texas and Florida ever apologize for the deaths? I doubt it. Will they "feel remorse?" I think so. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted August 12, 2021 Author Share Posted August 12, 2021 Notes. The Prime Directive of Non-Interference, also known as the Prime Directive or the Non-Interference Directive, were the colloquial terms for the Federation Starfleet's General Order One. The Prime Directive dictated that no Starfleet personnel knowingly interfere with the natural progression of pre-warp civilizations. end quote A whisper from the dark? I am violating the prime directive by communicating with my “pen pal” but I feel I must. Is the “right thing to do” still the “right thing to do” if a free citizen is ordered to do so by the state? Granted “accepted” authoritarian interference is generally reserved for laws like speed limits but what if the interference merely codifies what is for the “rational interest?” If it weren’t demanded, people who could be saved, will die. Are vaccination and mask mandates violating The Prime Directive? Will mandates necessarily expand to infringe upon the rights of all citizens? Commander Data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 4 hours ago, Peter said: Will the governors of Texas and Florida ever apologize for the deaths? I doubt it. Will they "feel remorse?" I think so. Peter Now let's do the nursing home deaths, thanks to the governers of blue states like PA, NY, and CA, Obama's birthday party, Pelosi's hair-dresser appointments, the Texas Dem's "superspreader" flight to DC, the migrants being released with COVID, and all the rest of the hypocritical "rules for thee, but not for me" actions from the Left... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Prelude to more censorship. The real question is why did the press try to so hard to undermine the inexpensive medicine for the virus? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 This is exactly what I have seen and how I feel. (Except the being rich part. ) He's outspoken against the people who he says are in a dream. I'm not posting this to make an indirect criticism of anyone on OL, though. Especially Peter. He and I disagree, but I know where he's coming from. And it's not anywhere bad. But Tate does have a point. Pay $50k for an airline ticket on a small jet and you don't need no damn mask. Nor do the pilots. Nor do any other employee or passenger. Pay economy on a cheapo airline, and the employees nag you to death about your mask. At least the virus has enough sense to leave the wealthy alone, huh? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted August 12, 2021 Author Share Posted August 12, 2021 2 hours ago, ThatGuy said: Now let's do the nursing home deaths, thanks to the governers of blue states like PA, NY, and CA, Excellent point, ThatGuy. Those Gov's are monsters. Michael wrote about where I am coming from said, “And it's not anywhere bad.” The zones and tones of many of my thoughts come from liberty and sensibility, and medicine and protection. If we were talking about any other disease other than “politicized Covid” many of OL’s subscribers and the things they reference would not be an issue. Some examples? Who’s thinking Typhoid Mary’s rights were infringed upon? OR, whoa! Just because some person was spreading polio before there was a vaccine doesn’t make them a bad person. It is their right to spread anything they choose because it is only their rights we are talking about. So what if that dude had syphilis or gonorrhea. His penis and sex drive have rights too. Damn it, just because I am vomiting and sick why should I get off the bus or plane before take-off? Coronavirus is being politicized by the anti vaxer’s AND some of the elites who want to control the public arena. As Paul Simon didn’t sing, “If you know you are a disease spreader, get off the bus Gus. And set yourself free.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted August 12, 2021 Author Share Posted August 12, 2021 Arnold Schwarzenegger: You’re an ‘absolute moron’ if you make masks political . . . . “There is a virus, here,” the 74-year-old bodybuilder said. “It kills people.” Whoa! That Arnold must hate freedom! Not funny joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmj Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 I’m sure Gus would if he thought it prudent. Hey Arnie what about overhead fans in public areas ! That would be good too right ? Let’s see a podcast on that ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 4 hours ago, ThatGuy said: Will the governors of Texas and Florida ever apologize for the deaths? I doubt it. Will they "feel remorse?" I think so. Peter Will the lying liars who keep lying about Texas and Florida ever apologize for their lies? I doubt it. Will they "feel remorse"? Probaby not... Correction, Aug. 12, 2021: An earlier version of this story overstated the number of children who have been hospitalized in Texas recently with COVID-19. The story said over 5,800 children had been hospitalized during a seven-day period in August, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. That number correctly referred to children hospitalized with COVID-19 since the pandemic began. In actuality, 783 children were admitted to Texas hospitals with COVID-19 between July 1 and Aug. 9 of this year. Texas children and children’s hospitals are under siege from two viru… WWW.TEXASTRIBUNE.ORG More children are being treated in Texas hospitals for COVID-19 than ever before, and an unseasonable outbreak of respiratory syncytial... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 On 8/12/2021 at 6:57 PM, Peter said: Children in America who wish to attend public schools are required to be vaccinated for a wide variety of diseases. If we lay aside the wild claims of those who are anti vax’ers is this any different? This isn't polio, Peter, there's one (under-mentioned) rationale why the Vax authorities want to vaccinate children and teens against coronavirus and it is not to the child's advantage, that I can see. There must be slight risk with the vaccine on their immature bodily system/heart, e.g. myocarditis, which some doctors have put forward - while their fatality risk from contracting CV is vanishingly miniscule, thankfullly. Why the hasty drive to vaccinate them also, then? Like with bringing everyone else, the healthy adults, into line, the motive evidently is to retard the virus' transmission - at all costs. I find no way the youngster to be the health beneficiary, much the opposite. There will be many parents who find this cynical, treating kids like lab rats and placing them in possible future risk for the good of the wider populace, and I wouldn't blame them for rejecting child vaccinations. The question: what's in it for the youngsters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Here's more proof that the Coronacrap is about power and submission to the fearless rulers, not about a virus. Even lawmakers are being censored if they don't bow down. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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