Ellen Stuttle Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 On 12/13/2020 at 1:11 PM, PDS said: Believe it or not, I’m really not trying to Monday-Morning-Quarterback Trump’s lawyers. I’m just trying to make sense of a legal strategy that intimates to the public that there are massive amounts of “election fraud” issues while at the same time failing to take the opportunity to actually litigate those very issues. Something doesn’t add up here. Hi, David, if you're still reading. (Good to talk to you again, also.) Whatever your views on the Trump lawyers' strategy, I think that something Michael posted from Rudy Giuliani on the "2020 Presidential Election Tournament" thread - link - well demonstrates that Rudy is convinced that there has been sufficient fraud rightly to give the win to Trump in multiple states where Biden appears to have won. (I don’t know why the material I copied came out so weird looking, and I don’t know how to fix it, so there it is as is.....) (NOTE FROM MSK: I fixed it) Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 15 minutes ago, Jonathan said: Will [Trumo] go out with a bang? Trump isn’t going out. Ellen 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 As to AG Bill Barr, I am just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of DOJ activity about the election fraud. But I agree with this. Why do I agree? I trust Lin. He has seen things that I, here on the outside, have not seen. And he is right. AG Barr wrote one hell of a nice letter to President Trump, praising his many accomplishments and his weathering of the atrocious persecution he suffered. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 Let's see if this actually happens or if the bad guys find a way to stonewall it. If it does happen, I believe an enormous snowball of other states doing the same will ensue against Dominion. Or, since Barr is leaving, maybe even the FBI. As a last resort, definitively the military. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 42 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: As to AG Bill Barr, I am just as frustrated as anyone with the lack of DOJ activity about the election fraud. But I agree with this. I also agree with this: So, for me, Bill Barr was a mixed bagpipe. On to thinking about Jeffrey Rosen. I read the article. It's from last August. Rosen does bash foreign influences, especially China, but he also says the following: Quote At this point, I want to touch briefly on the current threat landscape as we head toward Election Day. The department of Justice, DHS, and other federal agencies, have engaged in an unprecedented level of coordination with and support to all 50 states and numerous local officials to ensure that their election infrastructure is secure. We have yet to see any activity intended to prevent voting or to change votes, and we continue to think that it would be extraordinarily difficult for foreign adversaries to change vote tallies. I wonder what he feels about that statement now. If he doesn't feel like he took out a big-ass lollipop labeled sucker and slurped on it in front of everyone, I don't expect much from him. But if he does feel--even just a small amount--pissed off and ashamed of being so easily duped, that might be enough to get some law enforcement things moving that should have been moving long ago. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 No time to comment right now, but for those who like a little excitement, check this out: BREAKING: FBI, Texas Rangers and US Marshals Raid Solarwinds HQ in Austin Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 10 hours ago, Jonathan said: I'm wondering what kind of "lame duck" scorched Earth stuff Trump will be willing to pull prior to leaving office. Obviously there are some interesting potential pardons, but what about other maneuvers, declassifications, releases, etc.? Will he go out with a bang? That's easy, he ain't going anywhere!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 9 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: Trump isn’t going out. Ellen Amen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "President- elect" , give me a freaking break, with that joke speech!!!!!!!!!!!!! Biden will eat those words and that's the closest that he or Harris will ever get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 8 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: No time to comment right now, but for those who like a little excitement, check this out: BREAKING: FBI, Texas Rangers and US Marshals Raid Solarwinds HQ in Austin Michael I shall comment for you, our fearless leader, Mr.MSK. Wow! 1776, err, 2020. President Donald JohnGalt Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 Here is President Trump openly warning people to not tamper with the voting machines. And he says law enforcement is shielding the machines from being investigated. Guess who that leaves to investigate the machines? Can you spell military? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 President Trump retweeted this. He's openly telling the Deep State and those who sold out to China he is coming after them. And right now they are ignoring him. I say to them, keep ignoring him. Michael EDIT: Just to give a visual of the retweet: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 President Trump also retweeted this. I wonder if a new water mains pipe is going to burst. The bad guys just keep digging themselves deeper. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 19 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: ... well demonstrates that Rudy is convinced that there has been sufficient fraud rightly to give the win to Trump in multiple states where Biden appears to have won. Ellen, I want to clarify the persuasion thingie that was going on, which is why I abruptly changed. David gave us two alternative views of Rudy, all based on the same premise--that Rudy knew he didn't have evidence that would stand up in court. That's a false premise, but that was his premise. The first view is that Rudy didn't include fraud because he was faking it or was inept. The second view is that Rudy had it and didn't include it on purpose, which would be akin to legal malpractice. In both cases, Rudy turns out to be a dork or immoral or both. He is talking about Rudy Giuliani! The guy who took out five mob families and cleaned up NYC when it was a shithole. That's what irritated me, but that's not the persuasion thingie. The persuasion thingie is called a "double bind." This is where you give a false alternative based on the same outcome. The standard way of illustrating this is the following. A guy wants to ask a girl out and, after warming her up, asks her if she prefers to have dinner with him on Wednesday or Friday. In both cases, there is a presupposition that she will have dinner with him even though she never said she would. Both alternatives are bound to the same outcome (dinner with him), which is why it is called a double bind. David's double bind led to Rudy knowing he did not have evidence that would stand up in court, which is a flat-out fabrication. Since both parts of the double bind were derogatory about Rudy, guess why the double bind existed in the first place? He was running that lame attempt on a person (me) who saw this evidence and saw it was in a court-friendly form to prove Rudy's case, who posted copious amounts of it on OL (which he never looked at), and who told him several times I had seen it. I watched this double-bind unfold thinking, uh oh, here comes a double-bind trying to sneak the lie past everyone and pretend it's a fact. But when it got to malpractice, I shut it down. Twinklefoot was going a little too fast to get to the goal line. He forgot he had to have the football to score. I don't know if this explanation is of any value to anyone, but that's what happened from my end. I didn't just blurt out nonsense. Michael 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: Ellen, I want to clarify the persuasion thingie that was going on, which is why I abruptly changed. [....] I don't know if this explanation is of any value to anyone, but that's what happened from my end. I didn't just blurt out nonsense. Michael, I understand your explanation re the "double bind" and your irritation about it, but I'm wondering if you felt that I was perceiving you as "blurt[ing] out nonsense." I wasn’t. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: The bad guys just keep digging themselves deeper. They've been confessing guilt from the start with their stonewalling. If everything were aboveboard, they’d have said right off, Please do examine the tabulating machines and let’s have these charges laid to rest. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 2 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: And [Trump] says law enforcement is shielding the machines from being investigated. Is law enforcement shielding the machines from being investigated or from being tampered with before they can be investigated? I interpreted Trump’s tweet as meaning the second. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 36 minutes ago, Ellen Stuttle said: I understand your explanation re the "double bind" and your irritation about it, but I'm wondering if you felt that I was perceiving you as "blurt[ing] out nonsense." I wasn’t. Ellen, LOL... That's the problem with writing on a forum. Some comments are directed to the person and some are written with the audience in mind. I put that last comment in for the reader, not you. It didn't even cross my mind you yourself thought I blurted out nonsense. 26 minutes ago, Ellen Stuttle said: Is law enforcement shielding the machines from being investigated or from being tampered with before they can be investigated? I interpreted Trump’s tweet as meaning the second. I just reread the tweet with a fresh frame of mind and I believe you are correct. Still, after Michigan used law enforcement to bar Republican electors into the State Capitol in Lansing... Nah... I'll go with your interpretation and hope it is the correct one. I think law enforcement has finally started to get involved on the good guy side. In both cases, though, Trump said don't tamper with the friggin' machines. I am sure he means everybody for that sentence. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatGuy Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 28 minutes ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: Ellen, LOL... That's the problem with writing on a forum. Some comments are directed to the person and some are written with the audience in mind. I put that last comment in for the reader, not you. It didn't even cross my mind you yourself thought I blurted out nonsense. I just reread the tweet with a fresh frame of mind and I believe you are correct. Still, after Michigan used law enforcement to bar Republican electors into the State Capitol in Lansing... Nah... I'll go with your interpretation and hope it is the correct one. I think law enforcement has finally started to get involved on the good guy side. In both cases, though, Trump said don't tamper with the friggin' machines. I am sure he means everybody for that sentence. Michael The problem with that second interpretation is that if they were shielding from tampering, then why wouldn't Republican electors be able to witness that along with Democrat witnesses? Why exclude the Republicans? More likely the first suggestion, given the precedents elsewhere, and who the governor is. On second though...nah, I'm sure it's nothing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 18 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: ... for me, Bill Barr was a mixed bagpipe. To add to Emerald's earlier tweet. No one can deny these facts. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 Very interesting article on the SES (Senior Executive Service). From the article: Quote It’s the most powerful three-letter agency in government. More powerful than the CIA, the NSA and the FBI. In fact, it’s so powerful it has its own seal and its own flag. And no, it’s not the FDA, the SEC, or the IRS. And it’s not part of Homeland Security or FEMA… Although its tentacles reach deep into every one of those agencies. The mainstream media rarely mentions it by name… So most Americans have no idea it even exists. . . . The Senior Executive Service, or “SES,” was created on September 19, 1979 during the Carter administration. It was originally formed to professionalize career civil service, while attracting the nation’s best and brightest in an effort to improve and modernize the management of the federal bureaucracy. A position within the “SES” is considered the equivalent to general officer or the flag officer ranks in the U.S. Armed Forces. For that reason, they are often referred to as our “civilian generals.” Their pay scale starts above the top level of civil service (GS-15), with base salaries ranging from a minimum of $127,914 to a maximum of $192,300. Ostensibly, the SES was to be a corps of non-partisan, career managers who serve as the executive management of federal agencies… Their job being to implement policy, not create it. At least it was until then President Barack Obama changed that with a mere flick of his pen… Making SES members nearly impossible to fire, once hired. . . . There are more than 2 million federal government employees. And at the top of that pyramid are approximately 8,000 SES (Senior Executive Service) employees who service as the professional managerial class linking our political leaders to the civil service rank and file. And Barack Obama as president, replaced more than 6,000 members of the 8,000-member SES during his two terms, assembling what became a stay-behind army of political operatives… . . . Here’s a list of the number of SES employees that were embedded in the following government agencies at the end of Obama’s 2nd term in 2016: Department of Education – 86 Department of Housing & Urban Development – 115 Department of the Air Force – 182 Department of Labor – 200 Department of State – 204 Department of Transportation – 231 Department of Interior – 258 Department of the Army – 261 Department of the Navy – 326 Department of Veterans Affairs – 357 Department of Agriculture – 361 Department of Commerce – 425 Department of the Treasury – 458 Department of Health & Human Services – 468 Department of Defense – 478 Department of Energy – 490 Department of Homeland Security – 639 Department of Justice – 821 All Other Agencies (all non-Cabinet level agencies) – 1,796 And it wasn’t just a purge of patriots from governmental agencies… Obama’s purge of the military was especially damaging to our national security, as he literally gutted the command structure of the U.S. military. Not to mention the demoralization of the ranks due to his policies of radical political correctness. In all, Obama’s patriot purge included 9 Senior Commanding Generals, 2 Nuclear Commanders, 197 high ranking Senior, General and Flag Officers, along with thousands of non-commissioned officers… . . . And as damaging as Obama’s purge of the military was, it was his takeover and transformation of the Department of Justice, the F.B.I. and the Intelligence Agencies that raise the greatest threat to America today. Because instead of being tools for implementing the policies of the president and the United States government… They’ve become the defacto 4th Branch of Government and are now dictating and carrying out their own policies, while openly subverting and sabotaging those of a duly elected president. But, before we go any further, please understand this… Barack Obama was not the architect of these changes, merely the front-man in charge of carrying them out as the Deep State and Shadow Government’s placeholder president. And that’s the root of President Trump’s problems… More garbage for President Trump to haul out once he is sworn in for a second term on Jan, 20, 2021. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 21 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: Let's see if this actually happens or if the bad guys find a way to stonewall it. If it does happen, I believe an enormous snowball of other states doing the same will ensue against Dominion. Or, since Barr is leaving, maybe even the FBI. As a last resort, definitively the military. Michael It looks like it is happening. Representative Mark Finchem, 54th Legislature, House of Representatives Quote December 15, 2020- "Subpoenas issued! Finally we will gain visibility into what happened in the Maricopa County election, which affects the entire state because of population concentration." Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted December 15, 2020 Share Posted December 15, 2020 Never mind. I misunderstood what TG was referring to about the Michigan electors. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 15, 2020 Author Share Posted December 15, 2020 Oh, yeah... I'm just itching for this to go to court. Discovery will be a party... And then there's this. Dominion CEO John Poulos Says Dominion Not Linked to SolarWinds Orion – Denies that Votes were Sent Off-Site to be Manipulated (VIDEO) Poulos was real arrogant about it, too. Now, don't forget, the military (especially the 305th Military Intelligence Battalion, Sidney Powell and Lin Wood, most likely Rudy & Co., and so on have evidence you and I don't see. So what can we see on the outside looking in right now? How about the following from some amateurs, Pepe and all? Tsk tsk tsk... That could do it all by itself... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted December 16, 2020 Author Share Posted December 16, 2020 Finally it looks like the goddam Russians actually did something. If is SolarWind stuff, then the Deep State is up to their eyeballs in it. Treason. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted December 16, 2020 Share Posted December 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: 305th Military Intelligence Battalion Star witness of 'Kraken' lawsuit washed out of intel training in the Army Army Hits Back Against False Claim that Soldiers Died in CIA Op to Nab Election Servers | Military.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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