Ellen Stuttle Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 On January 15, 2017 at 3:46 PM, william.scherk said: Yeah, Ellen. Greg has spoken. Mind you, he knows sweet fuck all about your life and has obviously not read your many well-argued statements against government on a plethora of issues. William, Greg doesn't bother me. He amuses me. I'm often reminded by his posts of Gracie Allen's ditziness - with the major differences that Gracie Allen was kindly intended and wasn't on a superiority trip. I'm especially amused by Greg's accusation against persons he castigates that they're in a "child/parent" relationship to government. This coming from a guy who evinces a need to feel that BIG Daddy in the Sky is patting him on the head and rewarding him for being a good boy. You're correct that Greg talks from ignorance of my actual life. I don't, however, understand your remark that I've written "many well-argued statements against government on a plethora of issues." What many such statements? I can't think of any such by me. Government has never been a focus of my intellectual interests. From early years I found the subjects of government and politics primarily boring (unless featured in the historical novels I enjoyed reading). I grew up feeling glad that I lived in the U.S., where (I thought) I didn't have to concern myself about government and politics. It's only been in recent years that I've begun paying much attention to the political scene. The reasons for my becoming attentive have been twofold: One, I think that the country's been brought to the brink of possibly irredeemable disaster under Obama's administration. Two, I'm very concerned about the corruption spreading in science because of the illegitimate marriage of political policy and the pseudoscience being pushed on climate issues. I'll remind readers that what started Greg's accusing me of being under the thumb of government, being in a child/parent relationship to government, etc., was my saying (here) that a Hillary Clinton presidency could have meant direct trouble for my life due to (anticipated, if she was elected) intensified attempts to criminalize climate "denialism." Yeah, sure would make a difference to a person's life, being classified (or having one's spouse classified) as a criminal for not accepting pseudoscience as science! As I've pointed out, Greg himself would be classified as criminal, too, if climate "denialism" became a crime, although very probably he wouldn't be in line for hassling. Who cares about the opinion of an electrician and minor construction engineer living in a Podunk town and having no "presence" in the public dispute? The hasslers would have their hands full trying to go after significant players. This doesn't mean, however, that Greg's belief that he's immune to effects of government policies is anything but mythological. The quality of life of all persons on earth - unless maybe that of tribal people living in remote areas - is affected by environmental and energy insanity. Including Greg's. As he should have abundant reason to know, given the sort of work he does. He's pulling thick layers of wool over his own eyes if he really believes his immunity tale. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 45 minutes ago, Ellen Stuttle said: On 1/15/2017 at 0:46 PM, william.scherk said: Mind you, he knows sweet fuck all about your life and has obviously not read your many well-argued statements against government on a plethora of issues. I don't, however, understand your remark that I've written "many well-argued statements against government on a plethora of issues." What many such statements? I can't think of any such by me. Thanks for the note. It was rather an orbital generality. The point I should have made, perhaps, is that you are an able critic of government over-reach in some areas (I remember interesting disputes surrounding the 'abandoned baby' and the government attempts to take FLDS children in Texas). To make the point that you have differences with government-as-practiced in the USA. An even better generality would have been to stress that you are honest and forthcoming in your opinions, and you should not be assigned to a team that you do not play with. I appreciate the time you took to correct my error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 1 hour ago, william.scherk said: Nope. This is so far from the Ellen Stuttle we know ... She's the one who professes the primacy of her bureaucracy. Government public union employees share her secular faith in government as the ultimate power. When the government says "pay your property taxes, bitch" you pay them, you do not disregard the notice. You aren't even aware of what you just said... ...you just professed exactly the same secular faith in the ultimate power of your government god... because you also have the spineless pussywhipped liberal government educated intellect of a bureaucratic employee just like Ellen does. I'm the one who chose how much property taxes I pay by producing my own home. Bureaucrats like you who produce nothing can't comprehend American Capitalism because it's beyond their own personal experience. You'll NEVER understand American freedom, William... ...because you are NOT free. You live under the thumb of your government so you believe the lie that everyone else lives under the same thumb as you do... ...well, you're a fool... because the reality is, everyone else doesn't live by the law of the bureaucrat like you do. Americans who do what's morally right by being personally accountable to Divine moral law don't bow to your liberal government like you have to do. If you changed the values you live by, you could experience American liberty, too... But you won't because government educated secularists never change... you'll go your grave taking what you chose with you and all of its consequences just as you rightfully deserve. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: I'm especially amused by Greg's accusation against persons he castigates that they're in a "child/parent" relationship to government. Who employs you, Ellen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 I am Spartacus. No, I am Spartacus. No! I am Spartacus. Greg? You are talking to the Queen. Shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 On January 18, 2017 at 4:40 PM, moralist said: Who employs you, Ellen? No one at this time, Greg. I retired from free-lance editing a number of years ago. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 20, 2017 Share Posted January 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: No one at this time, Greg. I retired from free-lance editing a number of years ago. Ellen Ah ha! You were editing government papers! This reflects your parent-child child-parent relationship with--uh--the President? --Brant dunno Greg does this better--he's the master Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 20, 2017 Share Posted January 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: No one at this time, Greg. I retired from free-lance editing a number of years ago. Ellen Who was your employer? Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 20, 2017 Share Posted January 20, 2017 3 hours ago, moralist said: Who was your employer? Greg Apparently you don't understand what free-lancing means. Who is your employer when you sell your services as an electrician? It's called self-employment. I have worked for employers, but none of them were government agencies or at all bureaucratic sorts of places. The last was J. B. Lippincott Publishing Company. I left my editing job there to free-lance in 1977. You're barking up a non-existent tree, along with displaying invalid reasoning. Question to you: Suppose a government union employee is found guilty of a murder the person didn't commit. Would you say the person got the government he or she deserved because, hey, public union employees deserve anything bad they get? Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 20, 2017 Author Share Posted January 20, 2017 7 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: Apparently you don't understand what free-lancing means. Who is your employer when you sell your services as an electrician? It's called self-employment. I have worked for employers, but none of them were government agencies or at all bureaucratic sorts of places. The last was J. B. Lippincott Publishing Company. I left my editing job there to free-lance in 1977. You're barking up a non-existent tree, along with displaying invalid reasoning. Question to you: Suppose a government union employee is found guilty of a murder the person didn't commit. Would you say the person got the government he or she deserved because, hey, public union employees deserve anything bad they get? Ellen You are beating your head against a wall, Ellen. Everyone is a slave of government except our Moralist, Greg. He is the only Free Man in the United States. Truly, truly our Greg is a Legend in his own mind. The rest of us are pathetic Government Slaves and we all got what we deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 21, 2017 Share Posted January 21, 2017 11 hours ago, BaalChatzaf said: You are beating your head against a wall, Ellen. Any bets that the wall has clandestinely been relishing the inauguration of a President who says that loads of Americans have not been getting the government they deserve? Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 On 1/19/2017 at 9:51 PM, Ellen Stuttle said: Apparently you don't understand what free-lancing means. Ellen, I know what a free lancer is. What doesn't add up right is your claim of having no relationship to the government and your whining about becoming a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government. The only people who make victim noises like that are cashing government checks. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 hour ago, moralist said: Ellen, I know what a free lancer is. What doesn't add up right is your claim of having no relationship to the government and your whining about becoming a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government. The only people who make victim noises like that are cashing government checks. Greg Greg, you could have become "a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government," and you aren't cashing government checks. You almost certainly wouldn't have drawn any attention, since you don't have any scientific status such that the public would listen to you, but you do express what's called "denialist" views I guess you really don't understand what's been going on with the administration wanting to silence dissent on climate issues, all the better to push regulatory policies. I was surprised by your not recognizing the names "Heartland Institute" and "Anthony Watts." Where is it that you get your views on the climate scare? Watts has the most widely read website on the subject and I expected Heartland to be known about by someone with Tea Party connections. Take a look at these sites: Heartland and Watts Up With That?. They are not government funded. The government has leverage with people who get government-funded research grants, although the leverage doesn't work with some of those people. The people the administration has wanted to get leverage on are those who are independent, who don't receive government funds. The RICO act has been one route, hassling by the IRS has been another. Targeting "disinformation" was in the pipeline. Fortunately - and I think for everyone on the planet because of the effects of climate policy on people's lives and the U.S.'s significance in leadership - Hillary Clinton, who would have continued the Obama administration's approach, lost the election. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 2 hours ago, moralist said: Ellen, I know what a free lancer is. What doesn't add up right is your claim of having no relationship to the government and your whining about becoming a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government. The only people who make victim noises like that are cashing government checks. Greg Some people, many people, all but a few people, but only people--people who? Betcha you didn't know Ellen is a black swan in your cosmology. I mean, how could you know she isn't? When you try to apply logic to your ideological thinking your ideology--or you--are coming up a little bit short. --Brant strange how your religion has little room for salvation and none for grace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 On 1/21/2017 at 6:44 PM, Ellen Stuttle said: Greg, you could have become "a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government," Well... there you go again, Ellen. Yet another demonstration of your ferverent secularist religious faith in the omnipotence of your god... government bureaucracy. Government benefits check cashers, public employee unioneers, government tenured academics, usless unproductive do nothing bureaucrats, and bottom feeding government funding whores... ALL share the same faith that you have in the ultimate power of your government. So who's cashing government checks? If not you, your husband? Because you're making ALL of the SAME whining "oppressed innocent victim of unjust tyrrany" noises as the bureaucratic teat suckers... ...and that's why you're so scared of it. I learned a valuable lesson when I was President of our local Tea Party Patriots. I wanted it to be a private sector Capitalist free market for-profit organization so that we would not be under the thumb of the government and would be totally free to endorse any local or national candidates we wanted... as well as be totally free to do anything else we wanted to do. However, the founder of the group wanted it to be a 501 C3 non profit even though it would be financally regulated by the government and any political endorsements would be completely forbidden. So she applied for non profit status and was "targeted" by the IRS for denial of that status. She even testified to Congress as a "innocent victim of government oppression". She was playing the victim of a situation that she caused by going to the government hat in hand begging to be given some benefit. So here you have a situation drenched in irony... an organization which is supposed to be promoting small Constitutional government, fiscal responsibility and private sector free market American Capitalism... ...in reality, was sucking up to the government in order to be granted favored status. And when I found this out... I quit. So sorry, Ellen... someone has to tell you. You're full of crap. You believe the coward's lie that everyone else lives subjugated by the same power of your stupid "bureaucracy uber alles" that you do. Well... I don't. And it's because I govern my self, so I have no need for your bureaucracy to govern me. You haven't got the slightest idea of what it means to live like a free American because it's completely beyond your experience... ..and as long as you belong to the secularist bureaucracy worshippers... you never will. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 On 1/21/2017 at 6:45 PM, Brant Gaede said: strange how your religion has little room for salvation and none for grace Sorry... wrong god, Brant. Secular government worshippers live and die by their own false god of bureaucracy just as they deserve... and Ellen is no exception. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellen Stuttle Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 7 hours ago, moralist said: On January 21, 2017 at 9:44 PM, Ellen Stuttle said: Greg, you could have become "a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government," Well...there you go again, Ellen. Yet another demonstration of your ferverent secularist religious faith in the omnipotence of your god... government bureaucracy. [....] You haven't got the slightest idea of what it means to live like a free American because it's completely beyond your experience... ..and as long as you belong to the secularist bureaucracy worshippers... you never will. Greg I have no such faith and no such god except in your imagination. Nor am I "so scared of it." Nor is anyone in this establishment cashing government checks. If an action were declared a crime and you did that action, you would be legally prosecutable, whether you were prosecuted or not - same as, if the speed limit is X miles/per hour and you drove faster than X miles/per hour, legally you could have been ticketed whether you were or not. That's merely an identification of reality, not a faith in bureaucracy. What I think you live like, Greg, is someone who deludes himself about how free he is while getting income from types of work which are heavily regulated and quite obviously affected by governmental policies. Or does electricity grow on trees in your neck of the woods? And are federal, state, and local regulations governing construction, septic-system engineering, etc., rendered null and void as pertaining to you? Anyway, myth onward - and enjoy the difference in your life which Trump's instead of Clinton's being President is likely to make. Ellen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted January 25, 2017 Author Share Posted January 25, 2017 On 1/21/2017 at 9:45 PM, Brant Gaede said: --Brant strange how your religion has little room for salvation and none for grace That is characteristic of people who believe in the God that gives everyone what they deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 21 hours ago, Ellen Stuttle said: I have no such faith and no such god except in your imagination. Yes you do have faith in the power of your bureaucracy, Ellen. And that's because it has power over you so you believe it has power over everyone else... but it doesn't. And you've been trying to convince me of how powerful it is. (Your own words.) Quote Greg, you could have become "a potential victim of global warming persecution by the government," That dramaqueen bullshit could only come from a secular government worshipper. Quote ...enjoy the difference in your life which Trump's instead of Clinton's being President is likely to make. I'm not like you, Ellen. Because I live by American values, I prospered during the 8 years of Obama's presidency. Who happens to be President is irrelevant to the qualtiy of my life, because I'm the one who is personally responsible for that... and no one else. So go peddle your secular bureaucracy worship to someone who's stupid enough to believe you. Bob will buy your crap. Sell it to him. He's also a self inflicted victim who granted his sanction to your government just like you did.. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 5 hours ago, BaalChatzaf said: That is characteristic of people who believe in the God that gives everyone what they deserve. You're getting what you deserve just like I am and everyone else is. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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