Israel in American politics

[william.scherk]

1) we now are sure that this President "allowed," wink wink nod nod, NSA data to be used to influence negotiations with Iran;

I'd like some more information on this point. I'd like to be sure. I guess I will have to google "NSA data Iran-negotiations influence," and get back to the porch with the gen later.

Unless you want to add a reference and more detail, Adam. Hint hint wink wink.

Israel Spied on Iran Nuclear Talks With U.S.?

U.S. Spy Net on Israel Snares Congress?

Israel Spies On U.S. Negotiations With Iran, Gives Info to Congressmen Trying to Block a Deal?

NSA, Mossad Bugged Iran Nuclear Talks but Tehran ‘Was Ready for it’?

Edited December 30, 2015 by william.scherk

[Selene]

1) we now are sure that this President "allowed," wink wink nod nod, NSA data to be used to influence negotiations with Iran;

I'd like some more information on this point. I'd like to be sure. I guess I will have to google "NSA data Iran-negotiations influence," and get back to the porch with the gen later.

Unless you want to add a reference and more detail, Adam.

Bill, please do not take this as an insult, however, let us just use common sense...

let's think Richard Nixon and LBJ - if they had this NSA capabilities, is there any doubt in your mind as the most powerful man on the face of this beautiful planet would not "permit" it's use?

Answer please?

A...

[william.scherk]

Bill, please do not take this as an insult, however, let us just use common sense...

let's think Richard Nixon and LBJ - if they had this NSA capabilities, is there any doubt in your mind as the most powerful man on the face of this beautiful planet would not "permit" it's use?

Answer please?

Dude, in another place you write of my inconsequential, unread, "infantile chatter." Here I hold out the hope that you will give context to a statement that I have a hard time interpreting on its face. I supply links to stories that you may be referring to. I supply four (4) questions marks.

By this President, you mean Obama. By the NSA I get it. By the Iran negotiations, I know what you mean. But the 'allowed NSA data to be used to influence negotiations' is murky. You introduce your statement with "We Know," thus my probe. Thus the question marks.

The passive voice or construction is sometimes the culprit when we find murk. Mistakes were made (by whom? which mistakes?). Things became murky. Responsibility was taken. NSA data was used to influence negotiations with Iran.

By whom? Which data? What kind of influence? Is using NSA data to influence negotiations a good idea or a bad idea or a mix? Well, it depends. It depends on the salient details. Who shared what data with whom and why is that bad?

You remember journalism school, Adam, and W5. I like to figure out who, what, where, when, why -- and how, if possible. Passive constructions often omit the subject, omit essential information, answer partial questions.

So, I am perplexed. You are invited to add specificity to a statement about which you think "We Know." You are given the suggestion to add more information. But your focus then moves on to LBJ and a rhetorical question about some murky irrelevance about 'permission,' and a friendly demand answer. I am not trying to be insulting, William, but use a little common sense. Answer one pointless question. Fuck your own request which preceded, and which I ignored.

I can't get at any facts with you here, Adam. It may be my fault. I am not arguing with you, but still trying to figure out what you are trying to say.

Maybe you are suggesting that Obama shared inside gen, something he shouldn't have, something garnered from US spying on Israel, shared it with the negotiating partners, let some shit out of the bag. And somehow this gen got to influence the outcome in an improper way. Or maybe you are alluding to something in the news today.

I still don't have a clue.

If I could ford this stream again, I might do it by asking, "can you please expand on your first point?"

Edited December 30, 2015 by william.scherk

[Selene]

William:

see post # 27 above, re: Nixon and LBJ

A...

[william.scherk]

1) we now are sure that this President "allowed," wink wink nod nod, NSA data to be used to influence negotiations with Iran;

I'd like some more information on this point. [...]

Israel Spied on Iran Nuclear Talks With U.S.?

U.S. Spy Net on Israel Snares Congress?

Israel Spies On U.S. Negotiations With Iran, Gives Info to Congressmen Trying to Block a Deal?

NSA, Mossad Bugged Iran Nuclear Talks but Tehran ‘Was Ready for it’?

Here is Herman Cain, with a brief explainer: Obama NSA spied on Netanyahu, GOP congressman to protect Iran nuclear deal, which looks like it was freshly published today:

This is not a sexy or juicy topic for a commentary, but it is a subject an informed reader should know about. Because, you’re not going to hear about it on the nightly news.

Many have pointed out, and rightly so, that it’s hardly unheard of in geopolitics for friends to spy on each other. We all know the U.S. and Israel have done this to each other for years, which is why Jonathan Pollard spent so many decades behind bars.

But when it comes to how you treat your allies, not all spying is the same. We may very well spy on the Israelis, or the Brits, or the French, or the Canadians, in order to make sure we know everything there is to know – and to make sure our own interests are protected in the context of the alliance. It’s messy business but it’s often necessary, and we don’t use the information we gather for the purpose of compromising our allies’ security.

Then there’s the spying that Barack Obama’s NSA recently perpetrated against Israel Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, who may be a friend of America but is clearly an enemy of Obama. (Think about that.) The NSA was seeking very specific kinds of information, which was anything Netanyahu might be doing to undermine the nuclear deal Obama was pursuing with Iran. That’s because Netanyahu strongly (and correctly) believes that the deal is a threat to Israel’s security, and usually that’s the sort of thing an ally cares about.

But not when your “ally” is Barack Obama, whose spying on Netanyahu included his conversations with Republican members of Congress also opposed to the deal. Obama’s purpose in conducting this spy activity was expressly and specifically to undermine an effort by Netanyahu to protect Israel’s strategic interests.

[Selene]

I think I will order a 9 9 9 pizza tomorrow...

Now if I was Evita's husband, I would invite her in for some wine and ludes...

Let me see if Cosby delivers...

[william.scherk]

???

[Selene]

???

What caused you to pull a black entrepreneur, who was known for saving a chain pizza business, ran for President on the Republican line in 2012 and came up with his 9-9-9 tax plan to analyze the use of the NSA to influence the Israeli election?

A...