Satan needs love too...

[moralist]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2015/07/25/group-to-unveil-satan-statue-in-detroit-during-largest-public-satanic-ceremony-in-history/

Group To Unveil Satan Statue In Detroit During ‘Largest Public Satanic Ceremony In History’

I think "largest public Satanic ceremony in history" is just a tad overblown. In Noah's time, everyone had degenerated into Satan groupies. A rainbow in the sky was the sign of a promise that the world would never again be destroyed by water...

...but that didn't rule out fire.

Whenever evil grows to achieve critical mass, it's time for a cleansing. So be sure to stand clear at a safe distance so as not to become collateral damage.

Greg

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Greg,

I looked into those people. They're not even worshipping Satan. Just the name and some of the trappings.

They like publicity more than depth, or good, or evil or any of that stuff.

I call it cheap profundity. Pop religion fit for the pages of a teeny-bopper magazine.

Stupid, not really evil in a Hitler sense...

Michael

[Kyle Jacob Biodrowski]

In addition to what MSK said, that isn't Satan. That's Baphomet.

How is it the author of the article kept calling the statue "Satan" when the group clearly identified it as Baphomet?

[Jjeorge]

Greg,

I looked into those people. They're not even worshipping Satan. Just the name and some of the trappings.

They like publicity more than depth, or good, or evil or any of that stuff.

I call it cheap profundity. Pop religion fit for the pages of a teeny-bopper magazine.

Stupid, not really evil in a Hitler sense...

Michael

Nearly the same as Pastafarians.

Of course that makes them evil secularists, right Greg? ;)

[william.scherk]

Nearly the same as Pastafarians.

Of course that makes them evil secularists, right Greg? ;)

I think that there must be a bit of tongue-in-cheekiness among the Satanic Temple set. Consider their advertised "Mission":

The mission of The Satanic Temple is to encourage benevolence and empathy among all people. In addition, we embrace practical common sense and justice.

As an organized religion, we feel it is our function to actively provide outreach, to lead by example, and to participate in public affairs wheresoever the issues might benefit from rational, Satanic insights. As Satanists, we all should be guided by our consciences to undertake noble pursuits guided by our individual wills. We believe that this is the hope of all mankind and the highest aspiration of humanity.

Replace Satanic with Presbyterian and the evul remains the same from a Randian perspective: altruism.

Exploring the franchise's various 'products,' besides the regular t-shirts, mugs, special membership cards and miniature Baphomet sculptures and busts, this will probably ring the wrong bells among the pearl-clutchers:

-- and then there is the insidious secular amoral feminized libertine queenly Borg menace represented by their tenets of faith:

There are seven fundamental tenets.

• One should strive to act with compassion and empathy towards all creatures in accordance with reason.
• The struggle for justice is an ongoing and necessary pursuit that should prevail over laws and institutions.
• One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone.
• The freedoms of others should be respected, including the freedom to offend. To willfully and unjustly encroach upon the freedoms of another is to forgo your own.
• Beliefs should conform to our best scientific understanding of the world. We should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit our beliefs.
• People are fallible. If we make a mistake, we should do our best to rectify it and resolve any harm that may have been caused.
• Every tenet is a guiding principle designed to inspire nobility in action and thought. The spirit of compassion, wisdom, and justice should always prevail over the written or spoken word

Who will be the first to indulge their innate bureaucracy curiosity and dig up evidence of a Satanic subgroup dedicated to Objectivism? Extra points for outrage.

Edited July 25, 2015 by william.scherk

[Selene]

William:

Is it just Christian religious symbols that you sneer at?

Exploring the franchise's various 'products,' besides the regular t-shirts, mugs, special membership cards and miniature Baphomet sculptures and busts, this will probably ring the wrong bells among the pearl-clutchers:

1. I don't remember you sneering at the little beanies that the Jews clutch at...
2. I also do not remember you sneering at the magic carpets that the Muslims clutch at...

Why is that do you think?

[moralist]

However they try to dress up the pig. Satanism is merely another dime a dozen leftist political secular religion. Their mission:

"The Satanic Temple facilitates the communication and mobilization of politically aware Satanists, secularists and advocates for individual liberty."

Secular leftism is the most dynamic political religion in the world. It is antithetical to American values.

Greg

[william.scherk]

William:

Is it just Christian religious symbols that you sneer at?

Unless 'pearls' are Christian religious symbols ... I have no idea what you are on about. Maybe re-read the comment above in full context, and try again to comprehend its various points?

Maybe if you spell out what is ticking you off, I can give a useful response.

[Selene]

William:

Is it just Christian religious symbols that you sneer at?

Unless 'pearls' are Christian religious symbols ... I have no idea what you are on about. Maybe re-read the comment above in full context, and try again to comprehend its various points?

Maybe if you spell out what is ticking you off, I can give a useful response.

So what image were you creating by:

Replace Satanic with Presbyterian and the evul remains the same from a Randian perspective: altruism.

Exploring the franchise's various 'products,' besides the regular t-shirts, mugs, special membership cards and miniature Baphomet sculptures and busts, this will probably ring the wrong bells among the pearl-clutchers:

So the following will be a complete shock to you?

A trendy cliché become useful for dismissing ordinary people.

I just did a post - as yet unpublished - where I referenced the expression 'clutches pearls' and noted that it's often a disparaging phrase used to dismiss another person - especially conservative women - who are dismayed by permissive, liberal attitudes or social behaviors. Most recently, the expression was liberally used for anyone who was disappointed by the SCOTUS resolution legalizing same sex marriage.

Pop-culture adopted the phrase and one author traces the contemporary usage here:

The phrase pearl clutching, which means being shocked by something once-salacious that should now be seen as commonplace, like sex, is ubiquitous on blog posts, especially in media geared towards women. For instance, a recent post on Jezebel called Girl Land author Caitlin Flanagan a “professional pearl clutcher.” Less than two hours later, another Jezebel writer called a sexy Calvin Klein ad “sure to inspire pearl-clutch-y local news stories across the nation.” The feminist website Feministe used the phrase in a blog post about privilege and oppression; another feminist website, Tiger Beatdown, used it to deride a Wall Street Journal writer who was panicking about the subject matter of YA novels. But the phrase isn’t just used in the lady blogosophere: A Washington Post columnist wrote dismissively last week about the “pearl-clutching that hippies’ parents did in the 1960s.” Basically, a writer who discusses pearl-clutching is saying, “I’m too blasé and worldly to be shocked by this.” - Slate

The entire article is quite interesting. I've always thought the image was amusing, knowing full well there is a tendency to silence traditional women, stay at home moms, homeschoolers, conservatives, by shaming them to some degree, often relying on cultural stereotypes - such as ladies who dress appropriately and modestly for Mass. They might be pearl clutchers.

A complete surprise?

A...

[william.scherk]

The entire article is quite interesting. I've always thought the image was amusing, knowing full well there is a tendency to silence traditional women, stay at home moms, homeschoolers, conservatives, by shaming them to some degree, often relying on cultural stereotypes - such as ladies who dress appropriately and modestly for Mass. They might be pearl clutchers. [see

http://abbey-roads.blogspot.ca/2015/07/the-history-of-pearl-clutching.html ]

A complete surprise?

The only mild surprise is that you seem to be quite upset about "pearl-clutching" ... but, given your inability to respond in your own words to the Satanic Presbyterians and their boring altruistic Mission and Tenets, no, no surprise is possible.

I will now think of you as OL's sensitive stay at home flower, Church Lady.

"All the criminal, ludicrous, tragic nonsense of Christianity and its morals, virtues and consequences."

"Women and girls -- silly, homely, uninteresting and insignificant, over-rouged, just utterly blank in every way. Old-fashioned little women, shabbily dressed, wrinkled and shriveled."

"The common woman with ugly clothes, a fat, soft white face and religious pins ..."

[Selene]

So your intention in using "pearl clutchers" had no intention to sneer at a Christian religious artifact?

[william.scherk]

So your intention in using "pearl clutchers" had no intention to sneer at a Christian religious artifact?

Exactly. One of my points was that the Mission and Tenets could be swapped out for a nice middle-of-the-road Christian denomination like our United Church (in Canada, the bulk of Presbyterians merged with a majority of Methodist and Congregational folk to become the United Church of Canada). I pointed out also that the Satanic coloring book would likely raise a lot more stink than the rest of the church's activities.

I find almost all organized religions to be vaguely ridiculous and/or incompatible with my beliefs about the world and the humans in it. I try not to bait or rudely mock religious people to their face -- only when they initiate hostilities. In a way, in some senses, OL is a haven for the 'anti-religious' side of me. I don't expect to get attacked for not making cognitive room for what I consider nonsense.

I apologize for the tone and tartness above. I over-reacted to what I thought was hostility and contempt. Maybe we will do better next round of disagreement or misunderstanding.

-- that water under the bridge, what do you think of the Satanists and their racket?

[Makiaveli]

However they try to dress up the pig. Satanism is merely another dime a dozen leftist political secular religion. Their mission:

"The Satanic Temple facilitates the communication and mobilization of politically aware Satanists, secularists and advocates for individual liberty."

Secular leftism is the most dynamic political religion in the world. It is antithetical to American values.

Greg

So all secularists are leftists? Advocating for liberty, pursuing one's own interests, advocating science and Reason etc sure seems a far cry from the typical Collectivist. Yes they mention empathy etc but they also say respect the freedoms of others.

Is it a racket? Thinkgeek.com sells silly stuff to nerds, geeks, etc which could be considered "preying" on their weaknesses but I don't think they qualify as immoral. Am I wrong, and is this the wrong section to ask such questions?

PS: Normally I try not stir so many pots with my first post on a forum, but it's past my bedtime so what the hey!

[moralist]

So all secularists are leftists?

No. Just many forms of the same secular leftist political religion.

The political spectrum is actually a circle where the extreme right meets the radical left in total accord on their three pillars of faith:

1. dope

2. perversion

3. fetusnuffing

Welcome to OL, Mak.

I hope you enjoy your visits and I'll do my best to entertain you.

Greg

Greg

[Makiaveli]

So all secularists are leftists?

No. Just many forms of the same secular leftist political religion.

The political spectrum is actually a circle where the extreme right meets the radical left in total accord on their three pillars of faith:

1. dope

2. perversion

3. fetusnuffing

Welcome to OL, Mak.

I hope you enjoy your visits and I'll do my best to entertain you.

Greg

Greg

Your three pillars seem...odd.

Dope is a personal choice. A bad one, but personal. Perversion is highly subjective, and while some forms are bad for you, again personal choice. Assuming you mean "snuffing" as in killing, then I tend to agree with you there.

But hey, at least it looks like I can argue here with people who might actually be able to spell "debate".

[Selene]

So your intention in using "pearl clutchers" had no intention to sneer at a Christian religious artifact?

Exactly.

...

I find almost all organized religions to be vaguely ridiculous and/or incompatible with my beliefs about the world and the humans in it. I try not to bait or rudely mock religious people to their face -- only when they initiate hostilities. In a way, in some senses, OL is a haven for the 'anti-religious' side of me. I don't expect to get attacked for not making cognitive room for what I consider nonsense.

I apologize for the tone and tartness above. I over-reacted to what I thought was hostility and contempt.

William:

On the "exactly" answer, I want to be clear, your use of "pearl-clutchers" was not employed "consciously."

However, you do recognize that it is condescending to Catholic folks who use Rosary Beads for meditation and prayer****.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

No apology is necessary.

Finally, please do not keep asking me for my take on something.

I may not have one.

If I do and I want to, I will.

Fair enough.

A...

****

How to Pray the Rosary

Eight Methods:Basic Rosary TextThe IntroductionThe First DecadeThe Second DecadeThe Third DecadeThe Fourth DecadeThe Fifth DecadeThe Conclusion

In the Roman Catholic Church, the Rosary is one of the most beautiful, powerful, and sacred prayers. The Rosary is a devotion to God through a devotion to the Virgin Mary. The Rosary is Scriptural, Christ centered, and the twenty Mysteries reflect the life of Jesus Christ. The Rosary offers hope when life can be unbearable. Keep reading for instructions on praying the Rosary.

http://www.wikihow.com/Pray-the-Rosary

This is a strong religious Talisman for a Catholic.

[moralist]

So all secularists are leftists?

No. Just many forms of the same secular leftist political religion.

The political spectrum is actually a circle where the extreme right meets the radical left in total accord on their three pillars of faith:

1. dope

2. perversion

3. fetusnuffing

Welcome to OL, Mak.

I hope you enjoy your visits and I'll do my best to entertain you.

Greg

Greg

Your three pillars seem...odd.

Dope is a personal choice. A bad one, but personal. Perversion is highly subjective, and while some forms are bad for you, again personal choice. Assuming you mean "snuffing" as in killing, then I tend to agree with you there.

But hey, at least it looks like I can argue here with people who might actually be able to spell "debate".

To the secular extreme right and the secular radical left those three are Holy Sacraments.

Dope is a personal choice. A bad one, but personal.

A narcissistic choice to be sure.... for the drug cartels derive their power from millions of stupid fools who eagerly purchase their products.

Perversion is highly subjective, and while some forms are bad for you, again personal choice.

Also narcissistic, and not so benign when perversion becomes mainstreamed into a society. AIDS anyone?

Assuming you mean "snuffing" as in killing, then I tend to agree with you there.

Yes, killing... as in abortion.

Greg

[william.scherk]

So your intention in using "pearl clutchers" had no intention to sneer at a Christian religious artifact?

Exactly.

...

I find almost all organized religions to be vaguely ridiculous and/or incompatible with my beliefs about the world and the humans in it. I try not to bait or rudely mock religious people to their face -- only when they initiate hostilities. In a way, in some senses, OL is a haven for the 'anti-religious' side of me. I don't expect to get attacked for not making cognitive room for what I consider nonsense.

On the "exactly" answer, I want to be clear, your use of "pearl-clutchers" was not employed "consciously."

That doesn't make sense to me, sorry. I used the phrase consciously. The thing you need to keep in mind is that "Pearl Clutchers" refers to offended Catholic numpties in your own cognitions, not mine.

However, you do recognize that it is condescending to Catholic folks who use Rosary Beads for meditation and prayer.

No, I don't recognize that. That is your own strained interpretation of my words and intent. If you are a practicing Catholic, a believer or follower of the Catholic faith, I cannot recall any instance in which you made that clear. As far as I know you may have a cultural affiliation with Catholic tradition and surface trappings, but you accept no papal authority, no hierarchy, no moral claim of the church over your mind and actions. You don't go to confession, you don't participate in communion, and you couldn't give a shit what the Pope has to say on this or that matter (since he is in your mind a marxist/Marxist) ...

As for your take that my using "pearl clutchers" means I am condescending to Catholic numpties, I don't care. I don't take moralistic posturing seriously from people who aren't honest and forthright, and I don't generally have much respect for people who keep their beliefs cloaked from view.

If some Catholics here are feeling a bit faint over being condescended to, then I hope the frail beings can make an appearance ...

Finally, please do not keep asking me for my take on something.

I may not have one.

If I do and I want to, I will.

I will ask you for your take on issues if and when I feel like it, and when I feel it would be interesting to have your views made apparent.

In this instance, you apparently are implying that you have no view on the topic of the thread -- and it seems you only have a view of bad manners against some folk who do not make any appearance here. If you want to come out of the closet as a practicing, believing Catholic, have at 'er.

[Brant Gaede]

The Catholics have it right with ceremony and upliftedness and man being made in God's own image. St. Peter's Basilica, in an incredible foldout in the latest National Geographic, is not so much to the glory and power of God but to the men who could build such a thing. Or, man qua man.

--Brant

[Selene]

Finally, please do not keep asking me for my take on something.

I may not have one.

If I do and I want to, I will.

I will ask you for your take on issues if and when I feel like it, and when I feel it would be interesting to have your views made apparent.

Fair enough.

A...

[william.scherk]

Off on a tangent from the Temple of Satan, the mild-mannered secular cousin to the Church of Satan and the Temple of Set, I invite OLers to read a great book by Debbie Nathan and Michael Snedeker, Satan's Silence: Ritual Abuse and the Making of a Modern American Witch Hunt. This is the second edition of the book, which first appeared in 1995.

Nathan is the author of another great investigative book, Sybil Exposed: The Extraordinary Story Behind the Famous Multiple Personality Case

Back in the day (post 1980, the publication year of the mother of all satanic conspiracy tales, Michelle Remembers) the topic of Satanic Ritual Abuse hit the airwaves hard and engendered a moral panic. One of the primary exponents of Satanic Panic was Geraldo Rivera. This is the full programme he presented back in 1988, as part of a serial exposé ,.. as the moral panic took hold, so did a therapeutic cult dedicated to 'recovering memories' of cult abuse. That cult still exists. Compared to the imagined horrors of satanic ritual abuse conspiracy, the Satanic Temple has the horror-quotient of a doggie daycare.

Fast-forward to 37:00 to see the arch-villain, Michael Aquino of the Temple of Set. Also features Ozzy Osbourne.

[Makiaveli]

Off on a tangent from the Temple of Satan, the mild-mannered secular cousin to the Church of Satan and the Temple of Set, I invite OLers to read a great book by Debbie Nathan and Michael Snedeker, Satan's Silence: Ritual Abuse and the Making of a Modern American Witch Hunt. This is the second edition of the book, which first appeared in 1995.

Nathan is the author of another great investigative book, Sybil Exposed: The Extraordinary Story Behind the Famous Multiple Personality Case

Back in the day (post 1980, the publication year of the mother of all satanic conspiracy tales, Michelle Remembers) the topic of Satanic Ritual Abuse hit the airwaves hard and engendered a moral panic. One of the primary exponents of Satanic Panic was Geraldo Rivera. This is the full programme he presented back in 1988, as part of a serial exposé ,.. as the moral panic took hold, so did a therapeutic cult dedicated to 'recovering memories' of cult abuse. That cult still exists. Compared to the imagined horrors of satanic ritual abuse conspiracy, the Satanic Temple has the horror-quotient of a doggie daycare.

Fast-forward to 37:00 to see the arch-villain, Michael Aquino of the Temple of Set. Also features Ozzy Osbourne.

Is it just me, or is LaVey's Church of Satan have a lot in common with Objectivism? Atheism, individuality, etc.

[Brant Gaede]

Just goo you.

[Makiaveli]

Just goo you.

How so? Individual rights, serve yourself not others or a god. Not saying his philosophy is on par, but that it has valid points. Just like Aristotle had some good ideas mixed in.

[Brant Gaede]

Superficial points of commonality don't count. And atheism is not part of Objectivism simply because it's only a consequence of being rational. There is no Objectivist atheism. Objectivism is a positive construct and anything negative is what can't fit in 100 percent positively. It would be the equivalent of saying the moon is not made of green cheese is part of Objectivism. True individuality is core Objectivism. There are four basic principles of Objectivism and the first two are the metaphysics and the epistemology and are 100% individualistic because the thinking, rational mind is a one-man or woman enterprise. When you go into the ethics and politics it's still off that core base, but what's "off" is the elaboration on human social existence.

"Etc." What's "etc."?

--Brant