Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Cruz has made plain that he is an opponent. He's the slob of a tactician you should criticize. He could still have a future right now. But he couldn't help himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 The choice between Trump and Clinton is in sharp focus now. Hillary is scripted, dodges the truth. Donald just says whatever he feels like saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveWolfer Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 14 minutes ago, Jon Letendre said: Cruz has made plain that he is an opponent. Is there anyone - ANYONE - who believes that Ted Cruz is a threat to Donald Trump at this point? Seriously! What's he going to do - say bad things? Stick out his tongue? Maybe all the Trumpers should start launching a pre-emptive attack on John Kasich or Bush - who knows, they might be big threats as well (using the same lack of logic). Doesn't anyone get what I'm saying? I think that it is obvious that Trump has a weird preoccupation with attacking people who do NOT need to be attacked and it doesn't make him look good. Hell, I'm hardly the only person to notice this - as a personal quirk it isn't even news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KorbenDallas Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 45 minutes ago, SteveWolfer said: Of course he wanted to dominate the news cycle. He always does. But I don't think that had anything to do with his attack on Cruz. Lots of ways he could have dominated the news cycle that would have helped him. You only go after Errol Flynn style coverage when you can't get positive coverage, or at the least coverage that attacks your opponents. Trump is sadly mistaken to hold Cruz in mind as still being an opponent. To even mention Cruz at this point elevates him as if Cruz still had any power. I don't think he can help himself. Maybe Trump did this on purpose. More middle-class voters fight mano-e-mano like this in their everyday lives than they do politics, so when they see this play out they get it--and Trump wins. Lyin' Teddy C goes down. Low energy Jeb! shoulda' had his momma run. Sweaty Little Marco can't take the heat so Trump kicked his ass outta the kitchen. Crooked Hillary: Lock her up! Lock her up! I think there's a wink and a nod when Trump does something like this, there are a lot of intellectuals backing him and people that really know him say he's not like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Is Trump a threat to Ted? Would endorsing have threatened Ted? No, in fact, it was required to avoid his undoing. But he couldn't help himself. I like that Trump continues to say bad things about Ted. Ted is bad. Very bad. Saying so is the right thing. Saying it again is better. Ted can shut his mouth and then I will consider the value of not saying how bad he is anymore. Until then, I want to hear again from Trump what a waste of potential Ted is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turkeyfoot Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 53 minutes ago, SteveWolfer said: Is there anyone - ANYONE - who believes that Ted Cruz is a threat to Donald Trump at this point? Seriously! What's he going to do - say bad things? Stick out his tongue? Maybe all the Trumpers should start launching a pre-emptive attack on John Kasich or Bush - who knows, they might be big threats as well (using the same lack of logic). Doesn't anyone get what I'm saying? I think that it is obvious that Trump has a weird preoccupation with attacking people who do NOT need to be attacked and it doesn't make him look good. Hell, I'm hardly the only person to notice this - as a personal quirk it isn't even news. No. Id say its vindictiveness but what do I know. The guy cannot pass up a chance to stick it to those who he feels has disrespected him. First he knows Cruz wasnt going to endorse him. Then he says its ok, then he doesnt want it, then acts po'd. Its evident to me through all of his past dealings. And it smells similar to self sabotage although in Trumps mind it may be hes sending a pre emptive subliminal message to those with whom he will be negotiating with. It just strikes me as being totally inefficient with ones resources. Its as if hes playing when the stakes are high and the gamble to big, like an adrenaline rush. It makes me concerned for every serious comment he makes on policy or substantive issues that he cavalierly deals with them and then runs to his twitter feed to jazz shit up. I dont follow the media claims well so I dont know if credible evidence exists for Trumpists to claim the upper hand in this dispute over their wifes and who was first. For me its always been a matter of taking ones word with their character and adding it up. For someone who takes time taking petty shots at rivals youve got to wonder about a lack of diplomacy getting the better of them/us as our steward. He is for me the definition of what non Americans call American arrogance. Its similar to Putin bearing his chest. I think its mostly ridiculous, vain and petty but harmless until you figure this idiotic behavior could actually be on the world stage as the president. He wouldnt be the first. Id worry more if he werent to be surrounded by very smart people, (another of his comments) including a psychiatrist. Ive considered hes acting virile due to an increase in medication thats helped him keep up with the campaign demands. He seems like many young people who twitter away their time saying silly things that get them in trouble without thinking through the consequences. Yea. I get it Steve. You and I have similar instincts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveWolfer Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 12 minutes ago, turkeyfoot said: The guy cannot pass up a chance to stick it to those who he feels has disrespected him. Well said. I have the same worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 14 minutes ago, Jon Letendre said: Is Trump a threat to Ted? Would endorsing have threatened Ted? No, in fact, it was required to avoid his undoing. But he couldn't help himself. I like that Trump continues to say bad things about Ted. Ted is bad. Very bad. Saying so is the right thing. Saying it again is better. Ted can shut his mouth and then I will consider the value of not saying how bad he is anymore. Until then, I want to hear again from Trump what a waste of potential Ted is. I forgot to add a ?. To make my point more explicitly, I think he does it, and that it works, and that it works because so many people are tired of the sweep-it-under-the-rug status quo. Media that systematically deceive. Institutions of justice that don't apply justice. And lying and cheating, like Ted does, it's part of the decline we see everywhere around us. We want a president that will expose and hit and expose and hit, and not stop until the bullshit stops. So he will continue until we see and hear Ted as much as we see and hear from Jeb. It is reassuring to many, myself included, to see him behave this way. It's what's required. Kicking down the door is not going to be easy, and that's BEFORE 8 years of Hillary. So nothing less than his maniacal persistence will do. He's doing great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveWolfer Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Jon, we'll just disagree on this aspect of Trump's personality. Cruz is history and I don't care about him. He is no longer a player. I do care about Trump's personality. But, we'll just disagree on that. We do agree that he is great for smashing political correctness, and that is something we desperately needed. We also agree that the sweep-it-under-the-rug Washington standard is way past its sell-by date. We also agree that institutions of justice aren't. And I suspect that we also would agree that making serious headway against progressivisms many generations of entrenched crap will take really bold actions. 12 minutes ago, Jon Letendre said: It is reassuring to many, myself included, to see him behave this way. I like you, but your being reassured doesn't do anything for me and what is needed is the knowledge that this man is going to be stable in important ways, and that he isn't just lying like everyone else that wants to make Washington their next power base. Those two things: 1.) Is his narcissism not so severe that it will be a danger, and 2.) can we trust that he will take on most of the big things he promises, or are they just his own brand of hot air. (Please don't try to convince me on these two things. With due respect to your powers of persuasion, only time is going to give me those answers - and that is if he wins. If he doesn't, he will become no more of a future player than Ted is.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 26 minutes ago, SteveWolfer said: Jon, we'll just disagree on this aspect of Trump's personality. Cruz is history and I don't care about him. He is no longer a player. I do care about Trump's personality. But, we'll just disagree on that. We do agree that he is great for smashing political correctness, and that is something we desperately needed. We also agree that the sweep-it-under-the-rug Washington standard is way past its sell-by date. We also agree that institutions of justice aren't. And I suspect that we also would agree that making serious headway against progressivisms many generations of entrenched crap will take really bold actions. I like you, but your being reassured doesn't do anything for me and what is needed is the knowledge that this man is going to be stable in important ways, and that he isn't just lying like everyone else that wants to make Washington their next power base. Those two things: 1.) Is his narcissism not so severe that it will be a danger, and 2.) can we trust that he will take on most of the big things he promises, or are they just his own brand of hot air. (Please don't try to convince me on these two things. With due respect to your powers of persuasion, only time is going to give me those answers - and that is if he wins. If he doesn't, he will become no more of a future player than Ted is.) I like you, too, and your worries about Trump don't have much volume for me either, so we're cool. ? ? (That's a fist bump, like a handshake.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KorbenDallas Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 2 hours ago, KorbenDallas said: I think there's a wink and a nod when Trump does something like this, there are a lot of intellectuals backing him and people that really know him say he's not like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Trump the marketer (75 minute speech in 28 seconds): I love it. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Korben, That's a very good video on confusing narcissism with confidence. There's nothing like an opinion by an expert in narcissism and a story of what he personally saw with Trump behind the scenes. I don't know if Ollie Mathews is an academic or just a person who devotes a lot of time and effort and thought to this theme. Here is his description on his YouTube channel: Quote This is a Help Channel for abuse survivors of Narcissistic/Borderline/Histrionic Personality Disorder. I am the adult son of TWO Narcissistic Parents. One with NPD, one with BPD. I loved the video. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 11 hours ago, KorbenDallas said: I think there's a wink and a nod when Trump does something like this, there are a lot of intellectuals backing him and people that really know him say he's not like this. If Trump is not really like the person he appears to be in public, may we assume that he is trying to deceive us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 40 minutes ago, BaalChatzaf said: If Trump is not really like the person he appears to be in public, may we assume that he is trying to deceive us? Bob, Maybe--to the extent anyone who cultivates a well-defined public persona for the media tries to deceive. For example, Sylvester Stallone is actually an intellectual, shy, self-deprecating, gentle, all-round nice guy who loves modern art, yet his public persona is as a cunning good-guy meathead warrior who kicks asses for fun. Is he trying to deceive us? This is different than someone like Hillary Clinton who says she didn't send classified emails over a private server (then the FBI says she did), a YouTube video was the reason for an Ambassador being killed (when she told other people privately it was not), etc. That's another way of "trying to deceive us." You have to decide for yourself if there is a fundamental difference between the two... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turkeyfoot Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 The only way Trump will persuade me to vote for him is by presenting sound, made for government fiscal ideas. The kind that can also pass muster amongst the built in lethargic Congress. I can ignore the noise if what he says makes sense in the context of effective limited government. At best hes high risk. He doesnt play well with others. Other than irrelevant noise, the theatrics, one liners or the game being rigged. They have an expiration date. I agree with him, the game is rigged. Where is his nuts and bolts proposal for repeal of ACA? Its a highly technical thing, of that Im sure. Other than arm wringing how does he expect to get a wall built? What military might is he set on delivering the decided blow to ISIL? What resistance might be expected in getting his tax proposal enacted and how likely is it that his proposal survives? Or a balanced budget. My vote is contingent on him convincing me that he has a handle on these things. At the moment they are out of his grasp as he struggles to contemplate Cruzs' future. Cruz made a poor decision that he alone is accountable for. Whether he is done or not is to miss the point other than there goes another politician who lied. While Cruz has redeemable qualities they dont matter. Whats missing in the eleventh hour is Trumps attention to the detail of governance. I look to the candidate to tell me, to show me he has a coherent grasp of the field hes embarking on. Tell me how you play a rigged game and win. Brick by brick by brick. Listening to pundits explain his meanderings doesnt help me. Twitter feeds are the worst. Speaking contemporaneously doesn't help. He needs to show me he gets what hes undertaken, the rebuilding of a breath taking gorgeous vista of Americas past. He talks of a hundred days. Pssshhhhh. For someone who struts his builders credentials where is the security to allay fears stakeholders have when calling for a re- laying of a foundation? He cant bulldoze. He has to build on top of a shit pile. Its at once the simplest thing and the hardest to chose between a criminal and a builder of buildings for president. A third party or write in at the moment is the better choice for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 "better choice for me" is pure narcissism, this is about the country. ? Seriously though, just don't imagine that you will ba able to pin a bad Trump presidency on us, whereas you will escape having your name on the guaranteed disastrous Clintonian third and fourth terms and the unassailable superstate we face after that. Either Trump or Clinton will be president. You can burnish your moral purity for refraining from Trump, but it's going to feel tarnished, I guarantee you, sometime between years 3 and 5 of her reign. Either Trump or Hillary are going to be president. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Letendre Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Hillary is impervious to the FBI, now, before even becoming president. Checks and balances are good. Will there be any? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 16 minutes ago, turkeyfoot said: At best hes high risk. He doesnt play well with others. Geoff, Really? Here's one example that doesn't align with your fear. Trump's influence on the Republican Party platform was all over the news a little while back. And the committee behind that thing was infested with people who absolutely hate him. They didn't get what they wanted except for a minor point here and there. Trump did. And when they balked about minority sex rights and managed to keep it out, Trump put it in his speech, saying the term "LGBTQ" loudly several times. And the conservative crowd at the convention went wild over it. Trump doesn't play well with losers who want to take him out. I agree with that. But play well with others in general? Hell, that's all he does. Donald Trump is one of the preeminent team-builders on market. At 70 years old, I doubt he will change and want to stop building teams based on merit, excellence and results. 43 minutes ago, turkeyfoot said: He needs to show me he gets what hes undertaken... If this, The Trump Organization, doesn't convince you that he gets the job done with vision, I doubt anything will. If you're looking for a sweet message from Ted Cruz about Trump's competence and vision, that won't happen. Besides, in terms of getting things done, that kind of endorsement is irrelevant. I have a question. How do people who don't like Trump reconcile their fear that he has the competence to get all kinds of bad things done with Congress (and others) to become a dictator, etc., but the certainty that he is not competent enough with Congress (and others) to get good things done? Doesn't that create any cognitive dissonance at all on how these people define competence? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 Man, did this backfire on CNN: LOL... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 A Trump victory will be a shock to the system. Which it really needs. Some shocks cure. Some shocks kill. I think a Trump administration will demonstrate convincingly that our government has become shit. It has been shit for over one hundred years. Now it will become completely obvious. What will come of it? I don't know, but I am sure a Trump victory will be, so to speak, interesting. I am going to vote for Trump not because I think he will do that much good, but because he might break the machine. In which case we shall have to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 23 minutes ago, BaalChatzaf said: I am going to vote for Trump... Woo hoo! I'll take it. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 A few more classic Trump tweets: Tim Kaine is, and always has been, owned by the banks. Bernie supporters are outraged, was their last choice. Bernie fought for nothing!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) July 23, 2016 Pocahontas wanted V.P. slot so badly but wasn't chosen because she has done nothing in the Senate. Also, Crooked Hillary hates her!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) July 23, 2016 Just saw Crooked Hillary and Tim Kaine together. ISIS and our other enemies are drooling. They don't look presidential to me!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) July 23, 2016 The Wikileaks e-mail release today was so bad to Sanders that it will make it impossible for him to support her, unless he is a fraud!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) July 23, 2016 Drip... drip... drip... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Stuart Kelly Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 To add to the last post, if anyone is interested in the DNC emails leaked by Wikileaks. Wikileaks hits DNC ahead of convention, competes with Kaine VP nomination No lookin' good... Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 23, 2016 Share Posted July 23, 2016 2 hours ago, Michael Stuart Kelly said: Woo hoo! I'll take it. Michael my voting for Trump is a hostile act against the government of the United States. I had initially thought about writing in Bernies name, but that would be a wasted vote. Under no circumstances would I vote for Hillary., Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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