Jeezus Q Kryst!!!!


BaalChatzaf

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MARK LEVIN: The Redskins still OWN their name, logo and will sue you and WIN if you try to use it

There's a 13 minute video at that link that does not embed. Very instructive for those who do not know much about intellectual property. I, myself, was not aware how much Common Law applied.

Levin talks about the fundamental legalities involved. As I thought, this issue is harassment, a tempest in a teacup. Nothing is going to come of it in practical terms.

In fact, the same stunt was tried twenty years ago and it was overturned on appeal.

At the end, he said something I resonate with: not one of the morons mouthing off about this as a civil rights issue has been on an Indian reservation. That was his word--morons--not mine. :)

I agree. They don't give a crap about Indians, not really. This is just a banner for them to try to get more power.

Michael

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Michael,

When I click on "Quote" to reply to a post, none of the previous material shows up. All I get is a blank screen, as if I were starting a post from scratch. The problem is not confined to this thread; it happens no matter what the thread. The problem seems to have started within the past few hours.

So is this a problem on my end, or is it a glitch in the software?

Ghs

George,

What browser are you using? There should be no problem with any of them, but I use Chrome with no issues. Firefox, too.

Why not install one of those, if they are not ones you use, and give it a whirl? They are free.

Also, have you tried cleaning out your cookies? That sometimes causes glitches like this.

If you have any more issues, just let me know and I will try to find a solution.

Michael

I have both IE and Chrome. The problem was with IE. Chrome works fine. Thanks.

Ghs

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Obama is a commie pinko rat bastard hows that for offensive? Perhaps I'll make a tee shirt and patent it.

Just shows how uninformed and ignorant , basically racist, those who oppose Obama really are. JQK! His parents were married, sheesh, the tshirt should read commie, pinko rat fink.

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MARK LEVIN: The Redskins still OWN their name, logo and will sue you and WIN if you try to use it

There's a 13 minute video at that link that does not embed. Very instructive for those who do not know much about intellectual property. I, myself, was not aware how much Common Law applied.

Levin talks about the fundamental legalities involved. As I thought, this issue is harassment, a tempest in a teacup. Nothing is going to come of it in practical terms.

In fact, the same stunt was tried twenty years ago and it was overturned on appeal.

At the end, he said something I resonate with: not one of the morons mouthing off about this as a civil rights issue has been on an Indian reservation. That was his word--morons--not mine. :smile:

I agree. They don't give a crap about Indians, not really. This is just a banner for them to try to get more power.

Michael

Not one, except these guys:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DT8Q1VY8_Bg

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The commercial says America Indians call themselves many things, but the one thing they don't is redskin.

Bullshit.

I'm part Indian (Cherokee) and the people in my family always called their Indian portion redskin. The whole idea of redskin being a degrading term never appeared in my upbringing. It would be like someone wanting you to feel shame for calling someone with red hair a redhead all of a sudden. You think WTF?

In fact, people who meet me always ask why my face is so red all the time. Well... it's because I am a redskin. :smile:

But wait. That's awful!

I guess I don't fit the oppressed class narrative so I must be a suck-up to power and betrayer of my heritage. How else to explain why I don't find the term redskin offensive? :smile:

I try to take this stuff seriously, but I just can't.

There is a practical consideration, though. One of the things that has stopped me from doing YouTube videos is trying to figure out what to do about my redness, not because of any crappy PC nonsense. It's because I don't want people to think I am blushing.

:smile:

It's odd, too, because I was on TV quite a bit in Brazil. Actually, I think this is just a vanity itch and I should stop being so goddam precious. Just do the fucking videos. :smile:

btw - On the trademark cancellation, it's all over the news now that the trademark is still in force until the appeals run out.

Michael

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The commercial says America Indians call themselves many things, but the one thing they don't is redskin.

Bullshit.

That commercial was made by the Yocha Dehe Wintun Nation, so no, not bullshit.

I'm part Indian (Cherokee) and the people in my family always called their Indian portion redskin. The whole idea of redskin being a degrading term never appeared in my upbringing. It would be like someone wanting you to feel shame for calling someone with red hair a redhead all of a sudden. You think WTF?

Did you ever maybe consider that not everyone had an upbringing and experiences that are exactly the same as yours?

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That commercial was made by the Yocha Dehe Wintun Nation, so no, not bullshit.

Population of 36... at least in 2011 according to Wikipedia: Yocha Dehe Wintun Nation

(I looked them up because I wanted to see if the Cherokees ever fought them.)

36 whole people saying they are speaking for an entire race?

That's not bullshit politics?

Really?

Did you ever maybe consider that not everyone had an upbringing and experiences that are exactly the same as yours?

Sure.

I doubt you would consider it, though.

I think you only consider the upbringing and experiences of those who follow the agenda you have bought into and want to exercise control over others about it through government force.

Michael

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That commercial was made by the Yocha Dehe Wintun Nation, so no, not bullshit.

Population of 36... at least in 2011 according to Wikipedia: Yocha Dehe Wintun Nation

(I looked them up because I wanted to see if the Cherokees ever fought them.)

36 whole people saying they are speaking for an entire race?

That's not bullshit politics?

Really?

It's not a numbers game. If just one Native American told me to not call Native Americans "redskins" because they find it offensive and racist, I don't know about you, but that would be enough for me.

Sure.

I doubt you would consider it, though.

I think you only consider the upbringing and experiences of those who follow the agenda you have bought into and want to exercise control over others about it.

Michael

Hello, pot, my name is kettle.

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That's collectivist thinking in action, Naomi.

/sarcasm

I'll remember in future when you start being offensive to just let you know nicely, based on some generalization of my race, gender, etc that you are offending me, and I'm sure you'll sweetly submit. Oh wait, I could do that now. Because I have Cherokee heritage as well! I find the term "Native American" offensive and racist. Say it no more to any of my tribe, please. If Michael disagrees with me, well, his opinion doesn't count because it only takes one of us. Or, how about that covert reference to blowjobs you once made and that golfer hitman joke you found so hilarious. As a woman, I was utterly offended and even a little bit sexually harrassed. You're gonna knock off that kind of BS immediately then, right?

/sarcasm

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That's collectivist thinking in action, Naomi.

/sarcasm

I'll remember in future when you start being offensive to just let you know nicely, based on some generalization of my race, gender, etc that you are offending me, and I'm sure you'll sweetly submit. Oh wait, I could do that now. Because I have Cherokee heritage as well! I find the term "Native American" offensive and racist. Say it no more to any of my tribe, please. If Michael disagrees with me, well, his opinion doesn't count because it only takes one of us. Or, how about that covert reference to blowjobs you once made and that golfer hitman joke you found so hilarious. As a woman, I was utterly offended and even a little bit sexually harrassed. You're gonna knock off that kind of BS immediately then, right?

/sarcasm

Ok, I respect your feelings and will take responsibility for my actions, so I won't call anyone a "Native American" anymore. There, now what is so difficult about that?

(blowjobs and jokes aren't people and cannot take offense).

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Deanna,

Actually you did hit on something.

I do find the term "Native American" offensive. I am a mixture of Cherokee, Scottish (and maybe some Irish in that part), and English. The white part of my bloodline immigrated to the USA. The red part was presumably already here for generations.

But me. I am a "Native American" simply because I was born here. The white part of that experience is no less native or American than the redskin part. (Heh... I couldn't resist that. :) )

Hell, everyone born here is a Native American.

I find it offensive a minority wants to claim special privilege to the name.

Michael

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For that matter, just saying someone is an American is offensive.

People are people, not classes.

:smile:

Michael

EDIT: For the frumpy-minded, that's a quip...

If people are people, not classes, then maybe the team should change its name to the "Washington Individuals"?

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Lemme help some kids out a little (not an affiliate link):

Red Mesa High School Redskins Men's T-Shirts

btw - The Red Mesa High School is located on a Navajo reservation in Red Mesa, Arizona. Over 99% of the students are Indians. So if you need a good t-shirt, why not get a Redskins t-shirt from Red Mesa to help support their football team?

Just trying to be helpful...

:smile:

Michael

btw - These folks aren't offended by the name Redskins. Word has it they have fierce pride about the name. So would some do-gooder please go down there and be offended for them? :)

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That's collectivist thinking in action, Naomi.

/sarcasm

I'll remember in future when you start being offensive to just let you know nicely, based on some generalization of my race, gender, etc that you are offending me, and I'm sure you'll sweetly submit. Oh wait, I could do that now. Because I have Cherokee heritage as well! I find the term "Native American" offensive and racist. Say it no more to any of my tribe, please. If Michael disagrees with me, well, his opinion doesn't count because it only takes one of us. Or, how about that covert reference to blowjobs you once made and that golfer hitman joke you found so hilarious. As a woman, I was utterly offended and even a little bit sexually harrassed. You're gonna knock off that kind of BS immediately then, right?

/sarcasm

Ok, I respect your feelings and will take responsibility for my actions, so I won't call anyone a "Native American" anymore. There, now what is so difficult about that?

(blowjobs and jokes aren't people and cannot take offense).

What's so difficult about that is that every single thing you say or do will be offensive to someone somewhere. If you're going to cease and desist actions and behaviors based on the fact that there might be one offended person, then you're going to have to live the rest of your life having absolutely no interaction of any kind with anyone.

I didn't claim that blowjobs and jokes were people. I claimed that you offended me by making reference to them. Then it follows that you must agree that you will never again make such a reference or laugh at such a joke.

Oh yeah, I'm also offended by math so you'll happily agree to cut that out, too, I'm sure.

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Ok, I respect your feelings and will take responsibility for my actions, so I won't call anyone a "Native American" anymore. There, now what is so difficult about that?

(blowjobs and jokes aren't people and cannot take offense).

I understand why you continue to be an imbecile in your responses to OL questioners. It feeds your disability.

I got it now.

A...

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What's so difficult about that is that every single thing you say or do will be offensive to someone somewhere. If you're going to cease and desist actions and behaviors based on the fact that there might be one offended person, then you're going to have to live the rest of your life having absolutely no interaction of any kind with anyone.

I didn't claim that blowjobs and jokes were people. I claimed that you offended me by making reference to them. Then it follows that you must agree that you will never again make such a reference or laugh at such a joke.

Oh yeah, I'm also offended by math so you'll happily agree to cut that out, too, I'm sure.

The point of not being a racist is not to avoid giving offense to anybody, it's about treating people with human dignity and respect. The reason that the term "redskin" is so offensive is because it is a dehumanizing term that represents a bloody history of genocide and racism. When you call someone a "redskin", you're effectively saying that the things that their ancestors suffered through were insignificant or justified or both because only humans can have rights, not "redskins" or "niggers" or "untermenschen".

Before you start thinking that these terms have no relevance to the modern day because those injustices are "in the past", here is Ayn Rand spewing the usual bigotry about how Native Americans have no rights because they are "savages":

Now, I don't care to discuss the alleged complaints American Indians have against this country. I believe, with good reason, the most unsympathetic Hollywood portrayal of Indians and what they did to the white man. They had no right to a country merely because they were born here and then acted like savages. The white man did not conquer this country. And you're a racist if you object, because it means you believe that certain men are entitled to something because of their race. You believe that if someone is born in a magnificent country and doesn't know what to do with it, he still has a property right to it. He does not. Since the Indians did not have the concept of property or property rights--they didn't have a settled society, they had predominantly nomadic tribal "cultures"--they didn't have rights to the land, and there was no reason for anyone to grant them rights that they had not conceived of and were not using. It's wrong to attack a country that respects (or even tries to respect) individual rights. If you do, you're an aggressor and are morally wrong. But if a "country" does not protect rights--if a group of tribesmen are the slaves of their tribal chief--why should you respect the "rights" that they don't have or respect? The same is true for a dictatorship. The citizens in it have individual rights, but the country has no rights and so anyone has the right to invade it, because rights are not recognized in that country; and no individual or country can have its cake and eat it too--that is, you can't claim one should respect the "rights" of Indians, when they had no concept of rights and no respect for rights. But let's suppose they were all beautifully innocent savages--which they certainly were not. What were they fighting for, in opposing the white man on this continent? For their wish to continue a primitive existnece; for their "right" to keep part of the earth untouched--to keep everybody out so they could live like animals or cavemen. Any European who brought with him an element of civilization had the right to take over this continent, and it's great that some of them did. The racist Indians today--those who condemn America--do not respect individual rights.

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The point of not being a racist is not to avoid giving offense to anybody, it's about treating people with human dignity and respect. The reason that the term "redskin" is so offensive is because it is a dehumanizing term that represents a bloody history of genocide and racism.

What genocide? The Aboriginals were never wiped out entirely. There was never a concerted effort to wipe out all the Aboriginals. Must of the injustice was cutting their supply of buffalo meat (in the plains area) and shoving them off the land they were accustomed to hunt and roam on.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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Adam,

Naomi's a good kid.

She's been taught wrong and brought up on the victimization storyline. I don't think the millions of fans over decades who thoroughly enjoyed themselves with Redskins games is a reality to her. She has had an indoctrination that a victim inherently has a moral high-ground and, anyway, how dare people have fun when someone else is suffering? That's disgusting!

:)

But I mean this literally. Our brains are mostly made up of neurons that are not conscious--they feed our conscious, but they pick up information from the outside. So we do adopt storylines from our environment. One set of people (a huge majority) has years and years of plain old football fun built up and the other (a generation I believe that sadly has been lost to progressive education) has years and years of listening to how some oppressive class or other (generally white) bullies little guy groups.

I think her perspective impedes her to see the full reality. But I don't think she is trying to manipulate people from a position of full awareness. I think she just passes on lots of arguments she has heard from others.

Young folks always think older folks are fucked up and they are morally superior. I know I did when I was that age. :)

If only they knew how much a product of indoctrination they are... (like I used to be). :) They tend to get really pissed when you point it out, too.

I think she is going to be all right in the end.

Michael

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