Horror File of Objectivist Living

[Jules Troy]

Turkey never did practice genocide against the Armenians. Qatar has not financed terrorist organizations. Pakistan was supposed to be our ally too but how many times did we broadcast to them a strike to be carried out and that target mysteriously disappeared? It was not until we stopped sharing Intel that Taliban leaders started getting smoked. I don't know I still think we should just pull the heck out if there. So many times one side is a friend, turns into an enemy, and round and round to the point were we become the real losers in this game.

[Wolf DeVoon]

Is it so hard a concept for the US government to understand that they have NO FRIENDS in the ME other than Israel

I am puzzled why you think Israel is a "friend" of the United States. Got any evidence?

[Jules Troy]

They share pretty much the same western values as us. They are a very compassionate people, and they actually warned us about 911 in that if we did not change and implement similar protocols that we would be vulnerable. No one else did, did we listen? No.

[Wolf DeVoon]

They share pretty much the same western values as us. They are a very compassionate people, and they actually warned us about 911 in that if we did not change and implement similar protocols that we would be vulnerable. No one else did, did we listen? No.

Rubbish. They trumped up lies about Saddam Hussein, stole refined uranium, bomb triggers, and top secret documents from us.

It's a one-way street. America is robbed blind, gives Israel $3 billion a year, guarantees Israel's security, gets nothing back.

http://fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf

http://www.newsweek.com/israel-flagged-top-spy-threat-us-new-snowdennsa-document-262991

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=123885&page=3

http://nypost.com/2013/12/15/inside-the-saudi-911-coverup/

[Jules Troy]

The "Lies" about Saddam having chemical weapons? Those same weapons that are now in Assad's hands that the Russians helped move to Syria because of all the UN pending inspections? Those same weapons that definitely were not used during the 8 year war with Iran and later on the Kurds?

[Wolf DeVoon]

The "Lies" about Saddam having chemical weapons? Those same weapons that are now in Assad's hands that the Russians helped move to Syria because of all the UN pending inspections? Those same weapons that definitely were not used during the 8 year war with Iran and later on the Kurds?

Cut it out. Rumsfeld supplied Saddam with chemical weapons. I'm talking about planted "yellowcake" and nuclear weapons lies -- and quit ducking the essential question: How is Israel a "friend" of the United States? All we got from the shakedown so far is the undying enmity of the Islamic world.

Israel can fend for itself, unless they wish to apply for admission to the Union, which would entitle them to

the protection of the United States, no different than Idaho or New Jersey. [Laissez Faire Law, p.2]

[Jules Troy]

Ok fair enough, so pulling out of the Middle East should also include cutting 1 billion in aid to Israel. Fair is fair. Does not however mean they cease to be trading partners.

As for them doing nothing in return? How about all the advances in medicine discovered by Israelis?

Or yes as you said joining the union would be an interesting option.

[Wolf DeVoon]

As for them doing nothing in return? How about all the advances in medicine discovered by Israelis?

mislabeled generics ... ecstacy ... expensive gadgets still in trials ... mud baths ... underfunded biotech ... drones (oops)

53% of all medical research money allocated to hospitals came from abroad, with only 7.8% from state sources. This statistic, together with the fact that a growing share of health services is paid for out of private pockets rather than the public purse, indicates that the Treasury is less and less interested in financing health and medical research. http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Statistics-show-government-is-less-interested-in-funding-health-services-and-medical-research-371690

[Brant Gaede]

Sovereign nations have various relationships for various reasons. Friendship is a tar baby. You can judge friendship by how much countries are stuck to each other. 1) is Israel, 2) Japan, 3) South Korea, 4) Taiwan (not considered a country but it is), 5) England, etc. These are all arbitrary except Israel--Saudi Arabia could be put in there somewhere.

--Brant

[Wolf DeVoon]

Sovereign nations have various relationships for various reasons. Friendship is a tar baby. You can judge friendship by how much countries are stuck to each other. 1) is Israel, 2) Japan, 3) South Korea, 4) Taiwan (not considered a country but it is), 5) England, etc. These are all arbitrary except Israel--Saudi Arabia could be put in there somewhere.

--Brant

I don't get it. We gain absolutely nothing.

[Brant Gaede]

Sovereign nations have various relationships for various reasons. Friendship is a tar baby. You can judge friendship by how much countries are stuck to each other. 1) is Israel, 2) Japan, 3) South Korea, 4) Taiwan (not considered a country but it is), 5) England, etc. These are all arbitrary except Israel--Saudi Arabia could be put in there somewhere.

--Brant

I don't get it. We gain absolutely nothing.

Is a problem. But think of what "we" would lose if there was no Israel. It would be a disaster comparable to the Holocaust so "we" won't let it happen even to the point of helping Israel too much. It's like giving it welfare. On the gut level I can't stand to see all those brains at risk and wonder about all those brains destroyed by the Nazis--and the Jews who were never born consequently. How many? ten million, 20? That's my personal bias. I love intelligence and human ability to produce and create. When I was a little boy and heard about the Holocaust I wondered in a little murdered Jewish boy might have been reborn in me. Wondered or hoped? I had to discard the notion almost immediately as irrational. I suppose I was 5 or 6. Human brains and ability are my one great passion. No, I don't know where all this comes from. All I know is I started thinking the way I think now around the age of 2 1/2. That memory is pegged on my mother taking my photograph holding a toy when I sat on my tricycle. Shortly thereafter on the night before Halloween my sister took me out to bedevil the neighbors by moving their garbage cans around. I thought it was wrong and didn't like it all. What I'm saying is the kind of thinking I was doing was completely integrated with what I thought was morally right. This is a plus and a minus and doglegs this statement a little too much. But I think Americans as highly moralistic generally--that's the USA in action--has the same attitude as I do and there's no way in hell "we" will ever let Israel be existentially destroyed or over-run. But the inside out is another matter, for that would be saving Israel and its Jews from themselves. Can't be done.

I don't get into many arguments on OL. My ego is tied into making correct arguments and statements as honestly as I can. When I see me fucking it up I stop and correct. My ego is not running around in my head referring only to itself for sustenance. It is allied with reality, but since reality is so much bigger than I am I cannot have what is commonly referred to as a "big ego"--it's only a real ego. There is no traction anyone can get on me if I'm right and if wrong when I say I was wrong. That's the only time I care to devote to being wrong aside from fixing up any damage I can. Time to move on. You see, there isn't much time. The luxury of time belongs to insentient geology and the stars out there. But consider: out of the vastness of the universe where are its brains except in our puny heads? More such brains or greater brains are so far beyond us--or, except for us, reality as is known, is stupid. The only reason to go to the stars--via bodies or via in our heads--is to find intelligence. (Science [physics, chemistry, etc.] doesn't need to travel that way.) When we find that intelligence we will become that intelligence and finally know--we hope--WTF is really going on. The good bet is it won't be enough and the journey will continue.

--Brant

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Just so people know, I moved this thread from The Objectivist Living Room to newly created The Horror File Cabinet.

Here is the welcome thread:

Welcome to the Horror File Cabinet

Now if anyone has a new Horror, he or she can open a specific thread about it.

Michael

[Selene]

This is a very small example of a soft tyranny ... the garbage man Gestapo...

Notice that, as it's proponents explained, it is "only" a dollar.

It is, its proponents argue, a way of training the citizen to change their behavior.

Regulatory incrementalism will kill us just as the frog in the slowly heated water is killed ....

http://www.capitolhilltimes.com/2014/09/seattle-start-charging-1-much-food-garbage-bins/

Remember when you were young and your parents told you to finish your food because of all the starving kids in the world? Well, now you could be fined for it.

The Seattle City Council (good band name) recently passed an ordinance which would assess a $1 fine to residents if compostable items make up more than 10 percent of their trash. Compostable items include food scraps, food-soiled paper, and plant and yard waste. They don’t include an old Walkman from 1997.

So, if garbage collectors notice that your garbage bin is filled with more than 10 percent of watermelons and cheese wheels and cinnamon sticks (I have a weird diet), then they will slap a ticket on the bin indicating that a $1 charge will be added to your next bill. Currently, no one is technically required to use compost bins, but the city sort of wants you to.

A...

[Wolf DeVoon]

You see, there isn't much time. The luxury of time belongs to insentient geology and the stars

I know it and feel it every morning. I like to nudge things along in a positive fashion, not only for my kin but for folks I'll never know. That's why I say things that are obvious. I don't feel qualified to do much else, but I'm good at the obvious. Altruism is wrong always and in every context. And since I received much from America, where it was legally and culturally possible to live for one's own sake (more so than elsewhere in the world), I feel equitably bound to applaud the best attributes of the United States and to likewise decry and mourn its suicidal sacrifices, past and present.

Our national security was harmed irreparably by Truman's unilateral recognition of the Jewish State and by everything done by the U.S. since 1948 to supply and defend Israel -- proof of which was 9/11. It's insane to say that New York was attacked because we were free, sassy, innocent bystanders with clean hands, minding our own business. But there is a depravity beyond mental illness, like Peikoff advocating genocide by nuking Iran. That's where blind, nonnegotiable defense of Israel leads: the failed conquest of Iraq and Afghanistan, war with Iran, and perpetual paranoia about retribution by unstoppable commandos crossing porous homeland borders. End game is a walled Fortress America under constant attack -- like Israel itself.

[anthony]

Sorry Wolf, but you are making too much of the causal nature of Islamists hating the US, supposedly for its traditional ties with Israel. That's what they want us to believe. It is akin to Libyans blaming that dumb movie for the attack in Benghazi.

America stands in their way -they knew this long ago- for what it is, and what it represents. Whatever has happened would have happened one way or other, friend and supporter of Israel or not. (I suspect that it could have been worse if not for 60 years of Israel's quiet advice to the US - but I can't substantiate this, except for what I've heard personally from Israelis).

[Brant Gaede]

You see, there isn't much time. The luxury of time belongs to insentient geology and the stars

I know it and feel it every morning. I like to nudge things along in a positive fashion, not only for my kin but for folks I'll never know. That's why I say things that are obvious. I don't feel qualified to do much else, but I'm good at the obvious. Altruism is wrong always and in every context. And since I received much from America, where it was legally and culturally possible to live for one's own sake (more so than elsewhere in the world), I feel equitably bound to applaud the best attributes of the United States and to likewise decry and mourn its suicidal sacrifices, past and present.

Our national security was harmed irreparably by Truman's unilateral recognition of the Jewish State and by everything done by the U.S. since 1948 to supply and defend Israel -- proof of which was 9/11. It's insane to say that New York was attacked because we were free, sassy, innocent bystanders with clean hands, minding our own business. But there is a depravity beyond mental illness, like Peikoff advocating genocide by nuking Iran. That's where blind, nonnegotiable defense of Israel leads: the failed conquest of Iraq and Afghanistan, war with Iran, and perpetual paranoia about retribution by unstoppable commandos crossing porous homeland borders. End game is a walled Fortress America under constant attack -- like Israel itself.

Somewhat debatable but also water under the bridge. Wherever we go there we are. Wherever we will go there we will be. All that past-tense stuff is gone and done with. Mistakes come with the human territory. Most of history is about mistakes. They are good to learn from, that's all.

--Brant

[Wolf DeVoon]

Sorry Wolf...

Appalled by the remark "America stands in their way" and Brant calling it "water under the bridge." Horror file stuff indeed.

Where is Ragnar when we need him?

[Brant Gaede]

Sorry Wolf...

Appalled by the remark "America stands in their way" and Brant calling it "water under the bridge." Horror file stuff indeed.

Where is Ragnar when we need him?

LOL. All I meant is we cannot go back in time and undo what Truman did. We take the world as it is and go on although the past informs us.

--Brant

[Wolf DeVoon]

In 1988, I was babysitting a Macintosh for a client while he fought with his soon-to-be-ex-wife, and I discovered a game called Balance of Power -- the object of which was to match wits with and confront the USSR in various hot spots around the world. Naturally, the USSR always replied with force and unless the USA backed down, it quickly escalated into thermonuclear war, which was not illogically deemed losing the game. I lost a lot of games trying to bribe or bully East Germany, Cuba, Lebanon, etc.

There was only one country in the world that you could not alter a relationship with. Go ahead, guess.

[Brant Gaede]

That's too easy, Wolf. But this seems to be a GIGO.

--Brant

[Wolf DeVoon]

I agree. The trap was sprung long ago.

Sisters from the womb shared
a holy place, once the temple of another, now dead.

-- Mars Shall Thunder, p.268

April 2006, Latino protesters in Costa Mesa, CA

[Brant Gaede]

I agree. The trap was sprung long ago.

What were Jews to do? Can you blame them? The European war against the Jews has shifted to the Middle East where it continues by proxy. European intellectuals just love to indulge their anti-Semitism in the clothes of sympathy for the "Palistinians."

Does humanity deserve the Jews? Do the Jews deserve humanity? The Jews are humanity too, after all.

Like all of us, Jews have to learn, and are learning, not to be victims. Jews have a very high wall to climb for that.

--Brant

[Wolf DeVoon]

...free, sassy, innocent bystanders with clean hands, minding our own business

[Wolf DeVoon]

I've changed my mind. There are more important things to fret about.

Kim Kardashian was almost knocked down by an absolutely unstaged red carpet prankster!

-- the distressed celebrity shown here being rescued by a vigilant plainclothes security hunk.

see the whole incredibly shocking video at E!

[Brant Gaede]

I've changed my mind. There are more important things to fret about.

Kim Kardashian was almost knocked down by an absolutely unstaged red carpet prankster!

-- the distressed celebrity shown here being rescued by a vigilant plainclothes security hunk.

see the whole incredibly shocking video at E!

Is she okay?

Could this be a publikity skunk?

--Brant