High in Gun Ownership, Low in Homicides

[dennislmay]

Why, among 2nd Amendment enthusiasts, is there never a distinction drawn between gun control and gun prohibition?

Why does no one recognize that "We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" does not automatically translate to "They're coming to take my guns away!!!"

Because every instance of gun registration has translated into gun confiscation. In the US there has been no serious effort to enforce existing laws against criminals to reduce gun related crime - in fact just the opposite in Chicago in particular. You have to be entirely blind to all of history not to recognize how gun control leads to registration leads to confiscation leads to mass graves - time after time after time.

"We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" - the current administration purposefully sent thousands of guns to Mexican drug lords to stir up violence in promotion of their anti-gun agenda. They have no credibility in any discussion of law enforcement or guns. Or much of anything for that matter.

Dennis

[KacyRay]

You have to be entirely blind to all of history not to recognize how gun control leads to registration leads to confiscation leads to mass graves - time after time after time.

Wow...

I guess we're screwed.

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Part of the problem is storytelling.

The only stories that get widely told in a left-leaning media are stories of people victimized by guns.

The stories of people victimized by sleazeballs who defend themselves with guns are pushed out of the mainstream.

The odd thing is that there are far more stories of the second than the first. The difference is huge.

There's a book out by Glenn Beck where he put a crack research team together to document these things, pro and con.

Control: Exposing the Truth About Guns

This just came out, so expect some media buzz over the next few weeks.

I just ordered it.

Glenn says he kept the price on this one much lower than his other books because he wants more people to be able to buy it.

One day the libertarian-leaning people will learn for real that whoever controls the stories controls the images in people's minds. And if you control the images, you can lead them to agree or disagree with whatever you please. That doesn't work 100%, but it sure works most of the time.

The ideal is to align story with reality for the majority of stories. But that's hard to find in a bitterly polarized environment. Manipulation is so much more fun...

Michael

[dennislmay]

Part of the problem is storytelling.

The only stories that get widely told in a left-leaning media are stories of people victimized by guns.

The stories of people victimized by sleazeballs who defend themselves with guns are pushed out of the mainstream.

The odd thing is that there are far more stories of the second than the first. The difference is huge.

There's a book out by Glenn Beck where he put a crack research team together to document these things, pro and con.

Control: Exposing the Truth About Guns

This just came out, so expect some media buzz over the next few weeks.

I just ordered it.

Glenn says he kept the price on this one much lower than his other books because he wants more people to be able to buy it.

One day the libertarian-leaning people will learn for real that whoever controls the stories controls the images in people's minds. And if you control the images, you can lead them to agree or disagree with whatever you please. That doesn't work 100%, but it sure works most of the time.

The ideal is to align story with reality for the majority of stories. But that's hard to find in a bitterly polarized environment. Manipulation is so much more fun...

Michael

I ordered mine ahead and the price was lowered before shipping:

****

Greetings from Amazon.com.

You saved $1.75 with Amazon.com's Pre-order Price Guarantee!

The price of the item(s) decreased after you ordered them, and we gave you the lowest price.

The following title(s) decreased in price:

Control: Exposing the Truth About Guns

Price on order date: $9.73

Price charged at shipping: $7.98

Lowest price before release date: $7.98

Quantity: 1

Total Savings: $1.75

$1.75 is your total savings under our Pre-order Price Guarantee.

***

I was fortunate to have lived in a rural area growing up so the truth about guns was known to everyone

word of mouth - the Progressive media were just screw-up know nothings from the city to be ignored.

Guns deter criminals before they act and are used in huge numbers to stop crimes in progress.

I have personally known several people who have stopped crimes in progress with guns. The

Progressive media agenda is to tell one side of the story to support the political outcomes they

desire.

Dennis

[Selene]

Why, among 2nd Amendment enthusiasts, is there never a distinction drawn between gun control and gun prohibition?

Why does no one recognize that "We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" does not automatically translate to "They're coming to take my guns away!!!"

KacyRay:

What is the distinction between "gun control" and "gun prohibition?"

Secondly, D.C. v. Heller, clearly established the individual citizen's absolute right to possess arms.

Thirdly, when someone opines about the "right people" and Constitutional rights, a deep chill runs up my spine.

A...

[Brant Gaede]

Why, among 2nd Amendment enthusiasts, is there never a distinction drawn between gun control and gun prohibition?

Why does no one recognize that "We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" does not automatically translate to "They're coming to take my guns away!!!"

I'm glad even you recognize that it does.

--Brant

no where to run no where to hide our freedoms slide

[Brant Gaede]

I was just waiting for you to trot out Lott again, Adam. That study is flawed and has been debunked six ways to Sunday at high noon yet. Meanwhile I will hold off moving to a place where nobody wants me dead and stay in a place where few possess the legal means to kill me within seconds.

It's the illegal means you should worry about.

--Brant

Ah, Canada--I means, O Canada!

I do, Brant, I do worry. Nearly all the illegal guns that kill gang members, and others just for the hell of it, come here from the US, at a nice markup.Capitalism in action/ See the recent Star series about this perversion of the underground railroad.

About being killed by legal hunting rifles such as the one I own I am not worried.

Stop making the damn handguns and assault weapons, would you [please?

A 5 yo just killed his 2 yo sibling with his gift .22 rifle left with a chambered bullet. How dare you own even a hunting rifle?!

Teenager + whiskey + car keys = vehicular mayhem. Solution: all whiskey bottles must be registered unless the bottles are labeled "Whisky".

--Brant

rye whiskey, rye whiskey, rye whiskey I cried, if I don't get rye whiskey I think I will die

[caroljane]

I was just waiting for you to trot out Lott again, Adam. That study is flawed and has been debunked six ways to Sunday at high noon yet. Meanwhile I will hold off moving to a place where nobody wants me dead and stay in a place where few possess the legal means to kill me within seconds.

It's the illegal means you should worry about.

--Brant

Ah, Canada--I means, O Canada!

I do, Brant, I do worry. Nearly all the illegal guns that kill gang members, and others just for the hell of it, come here from the US, at a nice markup.Capitalism in action/ See the recent Star series about this perversion of the underground railroad.

About being killed by legal hunting rifles such as the one I own I am not worried.

Stop making the damn handguns and assault weapons, would you [please?

A 5 yo just killed his 2 yo sibling with his gift .22 rifle left with a chambered bullet. How dare you own even a hunting rifle?!

Teenager + whiskey + car keys = vehicular mayhem. Solution: all whiskey bottles must be registered unless the bottles are labeled "Whisky".

--Brant

rye whiskey, rye whiskey, rye whiskey I cried, if I don't get rye whiskey I think I will die

Nae, ye will live if ye just get back to your weavin'

-Nancy W.

[dennislmay]

I was just waiting for you to trot out Lott again, Adam. That study is flawed and has been debunked six ways to Sunday at high noon yet. Meanwhile I will hold off moving to a place where nobody wants me dead and stay in a place where few possess the legal means to kill me within seconds.

It's the illegal means you should worry about.

--Brant

Ah, Canada--I means, O Canada!

I do, Brant, I do worry. Nearly all the illegal guns that kill gang members, and others just for the hell of it, come here from the US, at a nice markup.Capitalism in action/ See the recent Star series about this perversion of the underground railroad.

About being killed by legal hunting rifles such as the one I own I am not worried.

Stop making the damn handguns and assault weapons, would you [please?

A 5 yo just killed his 2 yo sibling with his gift .22 rifle left with a chambered bullet. How dare you own even a hunting rifle?!

Teenager + whiskey + car keys = vehicular mayhem. Solution: all whiskey bottles must be registered unless the bottles are labeled "Whisky".

--Brant

rye whiskey, rye whiskey, rye whiskey I cried, if I don't get rye whiskey I think I will die

[dennislmay]

I was just waiting for you to trot out Lott again, Adam. That study is flawed and has been debunked six ways to Sunday at high noon yet. Meanwhile I will hold off moving to a place where nobody wants me dead and stay in a place where few possess the legal means to kill me within seconds.

It's the illegal means you should worry about.

--Brant

Ah, Canada--I means, O Canada!

I do, Brant, I do worry. Nearly all the illegal guns that kill gang members, and others just for the hell of it, come here from the US, at a nice markup.Capitalism in action/ See the recent Star series about this perversion of the underground railroad.

About being killed by legal hunting rifles such as the one I own I am not worried.

Stop making the damn handguns and assault weapons, would you [please?

A 5 yo just killed his 2 yo sibling with his gift .22 rifle left with a chambered bullet. How dare you own even a hunting rifle?!

Teenager + whiskey + car keys = vehicular mayhem. Solution: all whiskey bottles must be registered unless the bottles are labeled "Whisky".

--Brant

rye whiskey, rye whiskey, rye whiskey I cried, if I don't get rye whiskey I think I will die

I watched 2 1/2 episodes of Moonshiners when traveling out of town year and caught this one.

Dennis

[Brant Gaede]

My Mom took me to a Pete Seeger outdoor concert just south of San Francisco in the summer of 1963. I enjoyed it.

--Brant

he announced he was soon off to India, something to do with studying music or more deeply philosophical, which would have been the same thing to him

[dennislmay]

Part of the problem is storytelling.

The only stories that get widely told in a left-leaning media are stories of people victimized by guns.

The stories of people victimized by sleazeballs who defend themselves with guns are pushed out of the mainstream.

The odd thing is that there are far more stories of the second than the first. The difference is huge.

There's a book out by Glenn Beck where he put a crack research team together to document these things, pro and con.

Control: Exposing the Truth About Guns

This just came out, so expect some media buzz over the next few weeks.

I just ordered it.

Glenn says he kept the price on this one much lower than his other books because he wants more people to be able to buy it.

One day the libertarian-leaning people will learn for real that whoever controls the stories controls the images in people's minds. And if you control the images, you can lead them to agree or disagree with whatever you please. That doesn't work 100%, but it sure works most of the time.

The ideal is to align story with reality for the majority of stories. But that's hard to find in a bitterly polarized environment. Manipulation is so much more fun...

Michael

I ordered mine ahead and the price was lowered before shipping:

****

Greetings from Amazon.com.

You saved $1.75 with Amazon.com's Pre-order Price Guarantee!

The price of the item(s) decreased after you ordered them, and we gave you the lowest price.

The following title(s) decreased in price:

Control: Exposing the Truth About Guns

Price on order date: $9.73

Price charged at shipping: $7.98

Lowest price before release date: $7.98

Quantity: 1

Total Savings: $1.75

$1.75 is your total savings under our Pre-order Price Guarantee.

***

I was fortunate to have lived in a rural area growing up so the truth about guns was known to everyone

word of mouth - the Progressive media were just screw-up know nothings from the city to be ignored.

Guns deter criminals before they act and are used in huge numbers to stop crimes in progress.

I have personally known several people who have stopped crimes in progress with guns. The

Progressive media agenda is to tell one side of the story to support the political outcomes they

desire.

Dennis

My copy of "Control" just arrived.

Dennis

[caroljane]

Never play poker with a guy called Abe, never eat at a place called Mom's, never believe a writer who Exposes the Truth.

[KacyRay]

Why, among 2nd Amendment enthusiasts, is there never a distinction drawn between gun control and gun prohibition?

Why does no one recognize that "We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" does not automatically translate to "They're coming to take my guns away!!!"

KacyRay:

What is the distinction between "gun control" and "gun prohibition?"

Secondly, D.C. v. Heller, clearly established the individual citizen's absolute right to possess arms.

Thirdly, when someone opines about the "right people" and Constitutional rights, a deep chill runs up my spine.

A...

"What is the distinction between "gun control" and "gun prohibition?"

Gun control = Treating the legal sale, possession, handling, and trade of guns with a degree of oversight congruous with the gravity inherent in the responsibility of gun ownership.

Gun prohibition = prohibiting the ownership of guns.

"Secondly, D.C. v. Heller, clearly established the individual citizen's absolute right to possess arms."

Really? Didn't know that. Thanks.

"Thirdly, when someone opines about the "right people" and Constitutional rights, a deep chill runs up my spine."

They control medication. They control gasses. They control explosives. They control poisons. They control nuclear fission. Many dangerous things are controlled by government regulation because they are recognized as being dangerous in the hands of people who either will not, can not, or don't know how to use them responsibly.

So the government already recognizes that the sale and possession of dangerous items needs oversight. This is generally not disputed by anyone until you bring up guns.

Have you heard anyone complain that there are controls in place that govern the distribution and possession of cyanide? Anthrax vaccines? Nuclear warheads? Nitrous Oxide? Codine? Of course not - we all recognize that these things are best handled by experts who know how to handle them. So no one complains.

But when a 5 year old is handed a gun and shoots his 2 year old sister, [am I allowed to use a GSTP^™?] because some dipshit Kentucky mother decided to give a 5 year old a gun for his freaking birthday, 2nd Amendment enthusiasts seem not to be able to recognize that this is what happens when dangerous items are permitted to bought, sold, and handed off with no controls in place whatsoever.

I guarantee you that if that 5 year old had killed his sister by handing her a bottle of poison that was provided to him by his mother, everyone - to include 2nd Amendment enthusiasts - would be outraged, saying "What in the hell was she thinking, giving him something like that to play with? And why would she even have something like that in a place where either of her kids can access it? This lady should be tried for criminal neglect!!

But no.. in this case, the incident was ruled an accident.

"The shooting that took the life of Caroline Sparks in southern Kentucky has been ruled an accident, Kentucky State Police Trooper Billy Gregory said."

Sure, it was just an accident, right? Not criminal neglect. Just an accident. I mean, who could've known that handing a 5 year old a gun would be a bad idea?

But did this Kentucky momma have to get licensed to buy a gun? Did she have to demonstrate any degree of proficiency and responsibility before owning one? Did she have to do anything at all that would have been indicative of the gravity involved in gun ownership prior to owning one?

Nope. Because 2nd Amendment enthusiasts have no concept that the right to own a gun carries with it a corresponding responsibility. It's all about guns, man. Screw the responsibility part.

So you see, I am not disputing anyone's right to own a gun. And when I talk about the "right people" owning them, I'm talking about people who have demonstrated a degree of responsibility and proficiency that is commensurate with the gravity inherent in gun ownership.

We are more careful about who we let behind the wheel of a car than we are with who we let behind the trigger of a gun. That needs to be corrected.

[Selene]

They control medication. They control gasses. They control explosives. They control poisons. They control nuclear fission. Many dangerous things are controlled by government regulation because they are recognized as being dangerous in the hands of people who either will not, can not, or don't know how to use them responsibly.

So the government already recognizes that the sale and possession of dangerous items needs oversight. This is generally not disputed by anyone until you bring up guns.

Have you heard anyone complain that there are controls in place that govern the distribution and possession of cyanide? Anthrax vaccines? Nuclear warheads? Nitrous Oxide? Codine? Of course not - we all recognize that these things are best handled by experts who know how to handle them. So no one complains.

KacyRay:

Solid arguments which can be opposed with rational argumentation. However, they do not apply to "arms," and, the right of "the people" to bear them.

The failure of your argumentation in equating "arms" [guns] with other "dangerous" items is that pesky Second Amendment and the reason that the Second Amendment was vital to the creation of this limited Constitutional Republic.

None of the other dangerous items you mentioned are mentioned in the Bill of Rights and this places arms in a distinct and separately protected class along with speech, press, assembly, safety from search and seizure, safety from self incrimination, jury trials and the other specific rights in the Bill of Rights.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZS.html <<<<From the Cornell Law website which gives some of the key points, references and links to pieces of the decision.

http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/07pdf/07-290.pdf <<<This is the entire 157 pages of Decision and Dissents from the Supreme Court website

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/District_of_Columbia_v._Heller <<<< Wiki did an excellent job on this decision. Also, FYI, this was only the second case on the 2nd Amendment that ever got decided by SCOTUS. The first was in 1939 and did not deal with the actual meaning of the right of "the people" to bear arms. It dealt with the interstate sale of machine guns if my memory serves me correctly.

Hope this helps.

A...

[caroljane]

Argumentation is on the side of the big battalions.

- God

[Selene]

Argumentation is on the side of the big battalions.

- God

So, now we all need to sing, With God On Our Side, along with Joan Baez, hit it!:

[caroljane]

How apt. You know that this song is a straight steal from "The Patriot Game".

[Selene]

How apt. You know that this song is a straight steal from "The Patriot Game".

With Harrison Ford?

[caroljane]

lol and up yer kilt, Adam! With or without Ford.

[Selene]

lol and up yer kilt, Adam! With or without Ford.

I was sure you had some different reference in mind. I was not aware of the controversy. I thought it was Bob Dylan, however there appears to be a serious dispute.

I like yours better.

History

The song concerns an incident during the Border Campaign launched by the Irish Republican Army during the 1950s. It was written by Dominic Behan, younger brother of playwright Brendan Behan, to the tune of an earlier folksong, "The Merry Month of May" (recorded by Jo Stafford and Burl Ives as "The Nightingale").^[2] It tells the story of Fergal O'Hanlon, an IRA Volunteer from Ballybay, County Monaghan who was killed at the age of 20 in an attack on Brookeborough Royal Ulster Constabulary barracks in County Fermanagh on 1 January 1957. The operation was devised and led by Sean Garland, an IRA man from Dublin. Another volunteer, Seán South from Limerick, was also killed during the raid.

Behan later became close friends with Sean Garland, officiating as the best man at Garland's wedding. Garland gave the eulogy at Behan's funeral in 1989.^{[citation needed]}

The song is one of the best known to emerge from the Irish nationalist struggle and has been popular amongst the IRA, as well as other groups. "The Patriot Game" has been recorded by numerous artists, including the Kingston Trio, The Bluebells, The Dubliners, The Wolfe Tones, and The Clancy Brothers. It also appears on the Judy Collins LP record Whales and Nightingales.

The last line of the song was originally "For the cowards who sold out the patriot game", but most recent versions say "... Quislings who sold out the patriot game". This change featured on Harvey Andrews's 1975 version of the song. The cover by the Bluebells altered many of the lyrics to make their song clearly anti-war.

Controversies

Like Behan, Bob Dylan used the melody of "The Merry Month of May" for his own song "With God on Our Side".^[1] Behan chided Dylan publicly by claiming the melody as an original composition.^[3] He was annoyed because the first two verses of Dylan's song were a parody of his own song. Dylan's refusal to credit Behan's lyrical structure was the main issue at hand, and in response, Behan took the view that the provenance of Dylan's entire body of work must be questioned. Ironically, Behan exercised the same folk tradition as Dylan in writing the song, having himself borrowed the tune from the traditional "The Merry Month of May".^[1]

Behan also took issue with the Clancy Brothers, who chose not to sing the verses which sanctioned the murders of Irish police officers or which criticized Éamon de Valera:^{[citation needed]}

This Ireland of mine has for long been half free,

Six counties are under

John Bull

's tyranny.

And still de Valera is greatly to blame

For shirking his part in the patriot game.

====================================================

"With God on Our Side" is a song by Bob Dylan, released as the third track on his 1964 album The Times They Are A-Changin'. Dylan first performed the song during his debut at The Town Hall in New York City on April 12, 1963. Dylan is known to sing the song only rarely in concert.

[caroljane]

Thanks for the background Adam, "My name is O'Hanlon, I've just gone sixteen" was the only version I ever heard until I clicked on your video!

[Brant Gaede]

A 5 yo shooting a 2 yo with a .22 rifle has nothing to do with "gun control" and everything to do with stupid control. Unfortunately, stupidity is everywhere.

--Brant

[Selene]

A 5 yo shooting a 2 yo with a .22 rifle has nothing to do with "gun control" and everything to do with stupid control. Unfortunately, stupidity is everywhere.

--Brant

Exactly Brant.

Incompetent parent(s) like these would have caused death or serious injury sooner or later.

[Dglgmut]

Why, among 2nd Amendment enthusiasts, is there never a distinction drawn between gun control and gun prohibition?

Why does no one recognize that "We want to ensure that only the right people have guns" does not automatically translate to "They're coming to take my guns away!!!"

What objective criteria can qualify "the right people"?

If someone ever was in the position where they could benefit from the rightful use of a gun, but had been denied the right to own one, I don't think that is "right".

In the case of the 5-year-old being given a gun, that is clearly negligence. But what does the mother's right to buy a gun have to do with her responsibility to not give it to a 5-year-old?? The poison analogy is the same case... Should she need a license to buy cleaning agents, too?