News: Goddess of the Market by Jennifer Burns

[Chris Grieb]

ND,

Interesting.

O'Reilly's being his usual overbearing self. Burns waits for him to stop bloviating and then speaks in measured tones.

Beyond the "internment" of the Japanese-Americans on the West Coast, there was war propaganda against the Japanese that I think you could fairly call racist. (Dr. Seuss was one of many who drew it, for a Left-wing publication no less.)

But for Tom Hanks to attribute the bloodiness of Tarawa or Iwo Jima to American racism toward the Japanese is breathtakingly detached from reality.

Robert Campbell

There was racism on the part of American but there was also racism by the Japanese. The Japanese were in many cases prepared to fight till the death.

On Burn's point about nation building is somewhat true but there was a much more solid base than both Iraq and Afghanistan.

Tom Hanks has done some very good work. I recently re watching his series " From the Earth to the Moon" and found the production qualities outstanding. I could say the same about "Brand of Brothers". I hope he will regret his dumb comparison.

[BaalChatzaf]

There was racism on the part of American but there was also racism by the Japanese. The Japanese were in many cases prepared to fight till the death.

On Burn's point about nation building is somewhat true but there was a much more solid base than both Iraq and Afghanistan.

Tom Hanks has done some very good work. I recently re watching his series " From the Earth to the Moon" and found the production qualities outstanding. I could say the same about "Brand of Brothers". I hope he will regret his dumb comparison.

Very much so. I have it straight from one of my uncles who fought in the Pacific Theater that the Japanese were particularly hated. They were demonized and regarded as non-human beings. The propaganda of the time depicted Japanese as lice, bedbugs, rats and other loathsome creatures. Germans were never demonized by Americans in this manner, except perhaps among American Jews who had gotten word of the Holocaust (this did not become generally known until 1944-1945).

The Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor (a sneak attack) intensified already existing racial attitudes toward Asians in general and the Japanese in particular. The Japanese and Nisi (American born persons with Japanese parents) were particularly disliked on the West Coast prior to Pearl Harbor and thoroughly detested after. Japanese and nisi were rounded up and placed in internment camps for a good part of the war period. It was pretty ugly all around.

I find the Japanese Japanese (Japanese nationals who lived in Japan and supported the War Clique) particularly noxious people. I bear no hostility to Japanese who were either infants during the war or grew after the war any ill will. None what happened was their fault. I congratulate their generation for rejecting war. The only fault I find with them is that they want to ignore the rise of the Japanese Imperialists and the tormentors of China and Korea. Historical denial is not a good thing. I don't blame them for being ashamed of their parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles but they should face up to historical fact.

I enjoyed the first episode of the new -Pacific- series. As usual Tom Hanks and Stephen Spielberg have done their usual first rate production jobs. I expect that it will get bloodier and better.

At the Battle of Fredricksburg in the American Civil War, Robert E. Lee witnessed twelve Union charges up the hill toward Maries Heights. It was not war, it was slaughter. An insane frontal assault against a fortified front. Lee said: It is well that war is so terrible, else we should come to like it.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[9thdoctor]

Jennifer Burns was on local (South Florida) public radio on Tuesday (4/13). It was nothing earthshaking if you’ve heard her before.

http://204.13.1.19:81/

[George H. Smith]

Jennifer Burns was on local (South Florida) public radio on Tuesday (4/13). It was nothing earthshaking if you’ve heard her before.

http://204.13.1.19:81/

I haven't heard Burns before, so I found this interesting. I went on to listen to or watch some other appearances by Burns on NPR, Jon Stewart, and O'Reilly, and I found her impressive.

One mannerism that annoyed me a bit is Burns's tendency to superficially agree upfront with what someone says, such as Stewart's comment that Rand advocated a totalitarian system of individualists. Burns will sometimes say something like "That's right," even though she obviously knows the statement is bonkers. To her credit, she will then go on to explain why the statement isn't right, but I would prefer that she didn't go to such lengths to seem agreeable. Of course, this mannerism might stem from nervousness, a natural and understandable response for someone who isn't accustomed to television appearances.

Ghs

[George H. Smith]

I have it straight from one of my uncles who fought in the Pacific Theater that the Japanese were particularly hated. They were demonized and regarded as non-human beings. The propaganda of the time depicted Japanese as lice, bedbugs, rats and other loathsome creatures. Germans were never demonized by Americans in this manner, except perhaps among American Jews who had gotten word of the Holocaust (this did not become generally known until 1944-1945).

One can personally verify the rabid racism against the Japanese by going through popular periodicals of the WWII era. Many years ago I spent a few days in the UCLA Research Library doing precisely this. The racism is pervasive, even in "respectable" magazines. I recall, for example, an account of Iwo Jima that appeared in Time Magazine. The title read "Rat Poison Wanted." References to the Japanese as "vermin" that should be "exterminated" were very common. And then there were the caricatures of the Japanese that you can still see in WWII cartoons. Here is one example:

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[Alfonso Jones]

Resentment of the Japanese still runs deep for many in China. Even for those who are a full generation or more removed from WWII. (Born in the 1980s, for example.)

Bill P

[Chris Grieb]

Resentment of the Japanese still runs deep for many in China. Even for those who are a full generation or more removed from WWII. (Born in the 1980s, for example.)

Bill P

I think that the longer the Japanese were in charge of a country the stronger you will find hatred of the Japanese. The Japanese were very bad imperialists.

The Japanese continue to refuse acknowledge the cruel treatment of their subject nations. They could be a great country but the refusal to admit these horrors keeps them from reaching that status.

[George H. Smith]

Gentlemen:

I will tell you that Ms. Burns needs to decided whether she is going to dress for the part because she looked poor to middlin as they say in the hills.

Moreover, someone needs to discuss eye contact on television because she kept looking predominantly right and then up and left on certain questions.

I wonder if she is ambidextrous.

However, the eye contact was virtually non existent.

Burns discusses her appearance on The O'Reilly Factor on her website. She obviously wasn't very happy with it, but some of that should be chalked up to the fact that O'Reilly has no interest in a serious discussion of ideas. In this case, he merely wanted Burns to confirm his own comments about Hanks, and he wasn't interested in anything else. I sometimes wonder why anyone bothers to go on that show, since O'Reilly typically talks more than his guests do.

Burns notes that she was stuck in a studio with an earpiece and was looking at nothing but a camera. (She never actually met O'Reilly in person.) I can fully understand if she didn't always focus on the camera to give the appearance of "eye contact." It can be unnerving to find oneself thrust into that environment.

I recall when I was flown from Tucson to Los Angeles in 1975 (after the publication of ATCAG) for an appearance on Tom Snyder's "Tomorrow" show. (Most of this appearance, which lasted for the entire hour, was a "debate" with the ham-handed preacher Bourbon Street Bob Harrington.) I had never done a television show before, and I didn't know what to expect.

On screen, that program gave the appearance of a fairly intimate interview setting. In fact, it was taped in a cavernous warehouse with many different sets. We walked directly across the Johnny Carson Show set to get to the Snyder set, after which I was miked up. Within a minute or two, Snyder sat down and offered a brief greeting, bright lights came on, and the cameras began to roll.

I don't know exactly what I expected, but it all happened very quickly, and I felt as if I were speaking in a huge auditorium. Very unsettling for a newbie. I didn't overtly feel nervous, but I came across as very stiff in the beginning. (The bright lights didn't help.) It took a while for me to warm up and feel comfortable, but at least I had some time to do so.

As for Burns's attire, I thought she looked just fine.

Ghs

[Jonathan]

I don't know exactly what I expected, but it all happened very quickly, and I felt as if I were speaking in a huge auditorium. Very unsettling for a newbie. I didn't overtly feel nervous, but I came across as very stiff in the beginning. (The bright lights didn't help.) It took a while for me to warm up and feel comfortable, but at least I had some time to do so.

My experiences have been the opposite (keeping in mind that I've never appeared on anything at the level of Snyder's or O'Reilly's shows). I haven't found camera and studio situations intimidating, but reassuring. The elimination of the distraction of the instant feedback of an audience makes me feel more comfortable and focused. The same was also true back when I was performing music. All of my band mates seemed to be much more comfortable than I was in live situations, but not in studio. They were very uptight while recording where I felt completely as ease. Sometimes it would take them hours to get over their nerves and stop making silly mistakes.

J

[George H. Smith]

I don't know exactly what I expected, but it all happened very quickly, and I felt as if I were speaking in a huge auditorium. Very unsettling for a newbie. I didn't overtly feel nervous, but I came across as very stiff in the beginning. (The bright lights didn't help.) It took a while for me to warm up and feel comfortable, but at least I had some time to do so.

My experiences have been the opposite (keeping in mind that I've never appeared on anything at the level of Snyder's or O'Reilly's shows). I haven't found camera and studio situations intimidating, but reassuring. The elimination of the distraction of the instant feedback of an audience makes me feel more comfortable and focused. The same was also true back when I was performing music. All of my band mates seemed to be much more comfortable than I was in live situations, but not in studio. They were very uptight while recording where I felt completely as ease. Sometimes it would take them hours to get over their nerves and stop making silly mistakes.

J

I have always felt more comfortable speaking in front of an audience than in a television studio, but I eventually got better at the latter.

In the late 1970's, I appeared several times on the L.A. based regional television program "Talkabout," hosted by a very interesting and intelligent black guy named Truman Jacques. Truman was sympathetic to my atheistic perspective, so he liked to include me in panel discussions with priests, ministers, and the like. I always felt comfortable in those settings.

I don't know if Truman was an outright atheist, but he liked to tell amusing anecdotes, such as the following: When Christian missionaries went to Africa, they had the Bibles and the Africans had the land. It wasn't long before the Africans had the Bibles and the Christians had the land.

My weirdest television appearance was my last. Around 1990 (I can't recall the exact year) two atheist kids were expelled from the Boy Scouts, after which their father sued the Scouts. I wrote an op-ed defending the Boy Scouts that was published in the New York Times (and which got me a lot of flak from fellow freethinkers).

Shortly thereafter, I got a call from a morning L.A. television program that was broadcast throughout California. They wanted me to debate the father about the Scouts and atheists. The host was a liberal female attorney that I didn't like, so I initially refused. (They didn't pay anything, of course, and I wasn't selling anything, so I didn't see the point of taking the better part of a day to drive from Long Beach to Hollywood and do the show.)

The program called again, so I finally relented and agreed. But only on one condition -- I would debate the father, but I didn't want the the two boys present when I did so, since I would come across like a villain in those circumstances. The production assistant agreed and assured me that only the father would appear on the program with me.

Well, guess what? After I got to the studio, the whole damned family was there, including the two chubby and obnoxious boys fully decked out in their Scout uniforms. I immediately suspected the worst, so I located the production assistant and reminded her of our agreement. No problem, she said; the family was just there to observe.

Then, while I was in the make-up room with the father, the host (I think her first name was Sylvia) came in and told the father that she had a great idea. How about if his boys appeared on the program with him? He readily agreed, and before I could register a protest, she walked out of the room.

I tried to talk to Sylvia before the show began, but there wasn't time. The taping began almost immediately, and to make matters worse, the couch on which the two original guests were to sit was quite small, not nearly large enough for four people.

Nevertheless, the father was seated next to the host, with his two boys seated to his left. I, meanwhile, was squeezed in -- and I do mean squeezed -- at the far end.

I figured I would make the best of a bad situation and not complain, but what I expected would happen is exactly what happened. A lot of time was spent talking about the trauma supposedly suffered by those two spoiled brats, and I barely got a chance to say anything. But Sylvia did finally get to me shorty before the first break, so I gave a brief explanation of why I thought private organizations should be able to set whatever membership conditions they wish.

Then, during the commercial break, Sylvia said to me, in a very snotty, tone: "You're one of those libertarians, aren't you?" I replied, "Yes, I am one of those libertarians, and I told your assistant that on the phone. Do you ever talk to your assistant?"

I wasn't given a chance to say anything else during the second half of the show.

Ghs

[Chris Grieb]

I don't know exactly what I expected, but it all happened very quickly, and I felt as if I were speaking in a huge auditorium. Very unsettling for a newbie. I didn't overtly feel nervous, but I came across as very stiff in the beginning. (The bright lights didn't help.) It took a while for me to warm up and feel comfortable, but at least I had some time to do so.

My experiences have been the opposite (keeping in mind that I've never appeared on anything at the level of Snyder's or O'Reilly's shows). I haven't found camera and studio situations intimidating, but reassuring. The elimination of the distraction of the instant feedback of an audience makes me feel more comfortable and focused. The same was also true back when I was performing music. All of my band mates seemed to be much more comfortable than I was in live situations, but not in studio. They were very uptight while recording where I felt completely as ease. Sometimes it would take them hours to get over their nerves and stop making silly mistakes.

J

I have always felt more comfortable speaking in front of an audience than in a television studio, but I eventually got better at the latter.

In the late 1970's, I appeared several times on the L.A. based regional television program "Talkabout," hosted by a very interesting and intelligent black guy named Truman Jacques. Truman was sympathetic to my atheistic perspective, so he liked to include me in panel discussions with priests, ministers, and the like. I always felt comfortable in those settings.

I don't know if Truman was an outright atheist, but he liked to tell amusing anecdotes, such as the following: When Christian missionaries went to Africa, they had the Bibles and the Africans had the land. It wasn't long before the Africans had the Bibles and the Christians had the land.

My weirdest television appearance was my last. Around 1990 (I can't recall the exact year) two atheist kids were expelled from the Boy Scouts, after which their father sued the Scouts. I wrote an op-ed defending the Boy Scouts that was published in the New York Times (and which got me a lot of flak from fellow freethinkers).

Shortly thereafter, I got a call from a morning L.A. television program that was broadcast throughout California. They wanted me to debate the father about the Scouts and atheists. The host was a liberal female attorney that I didn't like, so I initially refused. (They didn't pay anything, of course, and I wasn't selling anything, so I didn't see the point of taking the better part of a day to drive from Long Beach to Hollywood and do the show.)

The program called again, so I finally relented and agreed. But only on one condition -- I would debate the father, but I didn't want the the two boys present when I did so, since I would come across like a villain in those circumstances. The production assistant agreed and assured me that only the father would appear on the program with me.

Well, guess what? After I got to the studio, the whole damned family was there, including the two chubby and obnoxious boys fully decked out in their Scout uniforms. I immediately suspected the worst, so I located the production assistant and reminded her of our agreement. No problem, she said; the family was just there to observe.

Then, while I was in the make-up room with the father, the host (I think her first name was Sylvia) came in and told the father that she had a great idea. How about if his boys appeared on the program with him? He readily agreed, and before I could register a protest, she walked out of the room.

I tried to talk to Sylvia before the show began, but there wasn't time. The taping began almost immediately, and to make matters worse, the couch on which the two original guests were to sit was quite small, not nearly large enough for four people.

Nevertheless, the father was seated next to the host, with his two boys seated to his left. I, meanwhile, was squeezed in -- and I do mean squeezed -- at the far end.

I figured I would make the best of a bad situation and not complain, but what I expected would happen is exactly what happened. A lot of time was spent talking about the trauma supposedly suffered by those two spoiled brats, and I barely got a chance to say anything. But Sylvia did finally get to me shorty before the first break, so I gave a brief explanation of why I thought private organizations should be able to set whatever membership conditions they wish.

Then, during the commercial break, Sylvia said to me, in a very snotty, tone: "You're one of those libertarians, aren't you?" I replied, "Yes, I am one of those libertarians, and I told your assistant that on the phone. Do you ever talk to your assistant?"

I wasn't given a chance to say anything else during the second half of the show.

Ghs

Ghs; You're insisting that the boys not be there probably assured that they would be invited. This whole story sounds like a low level mugging.

[George H. Smith]

Ghs; You're insisting that the boys not be there probably assured that they would be invited. This whole story sounds like a low level mugging.

I don't know if the television people planned it that way, but why would the two boys show up in Scout uniforms unless the father hoped to get them on the show?

Anyway, when one of the boys told how he cried after being kicked out of the Scouts, what the hell was I supposed to say without looking like a villain? Given how obnoxious those kids were -- they clearly enjoyed all the attention, and before the show began, they were running around with chocolate smeared on their faces -- a few things occurred to me that would have made W.C. Fields proud. But I restrained myself. 8-)

Plus, I was so squeezed in on that couch that my arms stuck out, making me feel like a seal, and probably making me look like one as well. It was difficult to carry on a serious conversation in that position. 8-)

Ghs

[Philip Coates]

> a few things occurred to me that would have made W.C. Fields proud.

Isn't that the one where he was constantly being upstaged by an adorable small child?

So he whips out his hip flash and surreptitiously spikes the toddler's glass of milk with enough whiskey that the kid keeps staggering around the studio, falling down, puking. Fields: "That kid's no trouper! Walk him around, walk him around."

Edited April 17, 2010 by Philip Coates

[George H. Smith]

> a few things occurred to me that would have made W.C. Fields proud.

Isn't that the one where he was constantly being upstaged by an adorable small child?

So he whips out his hip flash and surreptitiously spikes the toddler's glass of milk with enough whiskey that the kid keeps staggering around the studio, falling down, puking. Fields: "That kid's no trouper! Walk him around, walk him around."

Here are some quotes from W.C. Fields that might have worked:

"I like children. If they're properly cooked."

"Anyone who hates children and animals can't be all bad."

"Children should neither be seen or heard from - ever again."

"I never met a kid I liked."

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[Xray]

One mannerism that annoyed me a bit is Burns's tendency to superficially agree upfront with what someone says, such as Stewart's comment that Rand advocated a totalitarian system of individualists.

"Totalitarian system of indivdualists" - quite an oxymoron.

Was this a deliberately sarcastic comment by the interviewer?

Edited April 18, 2010 by Xray

[George H. Smith]

One mannerism that annoyed me a bit is Burns's tendency to superficially agree upfront with what someone says, such as Stewart's comment that Rand advocated a totalitarian system of individualists.

"Totalitarian system of indivdualists" - quite an oxymoron.

Was this a deliberately sarcastic comment by the interviewer?

The expression that Jon Stewart used is "totalitarian State of individulalists," and he wasn't being sarcastic. The remark occurs at around 2:50 into the video clip, which can be seen at:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-october-15-2009/jennifer-burns

Ghs

[Jonathan]

I figured I would make the best of a bad situation and not complain, but what I expected would happen is exactly what happened. A lot of time was spent talking about the trauma supposedly suffered by those two spoiled brats, and I barely got a chance to say anything. But Sylvia did finally get to me shorty before the first break, so I gave a brief explanation of why I thought private organizations should be able to set whatever membership conditions they wish.

Then, during the commercial break, Sylvia said to me, in a very snotty, tone: "You're one of those libertarians, aren't you?" I replied, "Yes, I am one of those libertarians, and I told your assistant that on the phone. Do you ever talk to your assistant?"

I wasn't given a chance to say anything else during the second half of the show.

Sometimes it's hard to have the presence of mind to be willing to walk off, especially when your mind is on what you're going to do or say, but I've reached a point where I'm usually aware that I need to be ready and willing to abandon any event or project and disappoint everyone involved if there's any indication that my requirements, upon which everyone agreed, are going to be ignored, especially when I'm doing them a favor. There's nothing worse than someone asking you to help them, and then trying to manipulate or embarrass you into giving them even more. Well, actually, I guess there are a lot of things that are worse, like murder and starvation and such.

J

[George H. Smith]

Sometimes it's hard to have the presence of mind to be willing to walk off, especially when your mind is on what you're going to do or say, but I've reached a point where I'm usually aware that I need to be ready and willing to abandon any event or project and disappoint everyone involved if there's any indication that my requirements, upon which everyone agreed, are going to be ignored, especially when I'm doing them a favor. There's nothing worse than someone asking you to help them, and then trying to manipulate or embarrass you into giving them even more. Well, actually, I guess there are a lot of things that are worse, like murder and starvation and such.

I considered opting out before the show began, but it is a long, tedious drive from Long Beach to Hollywood on a weekday morning, so I figured I would stick around. I was annoyed, however, by how little time I got to speak-- probably not more than 3 or 4 minutes total in a 30 minute segment. Most of the questions were put to the two boys.

"How did you feel when you learned that you couldn't be a Scout any more?"

"I cried. I really liked being a Scout."

"Aw, what a shame." Etc., etc.

Not exactly a good atmosphere for discussing the rights of private organizations. 8-)

In retrospect, you're right. I should have left. The egotistic "high" of being on television probably got the better of me.

Ghs

[jriggenbach]

In retrospect, you're right. I should have left. The egotistic "high" of being on television probably got the better of me.

How odd. I myself have always thought of being on a TV news or talk show as a badge of embarrassment. I've always thought, "If I did that, how could I ever live it down? Everyone would know how low I'm willing to sink in order to bring my name and face to the attention of the sweaty, insensate herd."

On one occasion, back in the mid '80s, I was invited to appear on "Good Morning, America" to discuss the issues I had raised in a guest column I had written for the editorial page of USA Today. I attempted to explain the sense of deep shame I would feel if I did something like that, but the ABC producer was uncomprehending.

JR

[George H. Smith]

In retrospect, you're right. I should have left. The egotistic "high" of being on television probably got the better of me.

How odd. I myself have always thought of being on a TV news or talk show as a badge of embarrassment. I've always thought, "If I did that, how could I ever live it down? Everyone would know how low I'm willing to sink in order to bring my name and face to the attention of the sweaty, insensate herd."

On one occasion, back in the mid '80s, I was invited to appear on "Good Morning, America" to discuss the issues I had raised in a guest column I had written for the editorial page of USA Today. I attempted to explain the sense of deep shame I would feel if I did something like that, but the ABC producer was uncomprehending.

JR

I've always had a big ego, Jeff, sometimes to the point of embarrassing myself rather than risk not being noticed at all. Surely that fact has not escaped you during the nearly forty years we have known each other.

Plus, there are a lot of good looking women among "the sweaty, insensate herd," and being called to their attention can sometimes produce good results. I believe it's called "culling the herd." 8-)

I will probably pay for writing this whimsical post....

Ghs

[Greybird]

I've always had a big ego, Jeff, sometimes to the point of embarrassing myself rather than risk not being noticed at all. Surely that fact has not escaped you during the nearly forty years we have known each other.

Plus, there are a lot of good looking women among "the sweaty, insensate herd," and being called to their attention can sometimes produce good results. I believe it's called "culling the herd." 8-)

I will probably pay for writing this whimsical post. ...

You betcha, as the possible next Repukelican and first woman president (may the gods help us) loves to assure her audiences. You'll all get to hear how close I came to being on "The Rosie O'Donnell Show," speaking of the sweaty herd of the public {rueful smile}

In January 2002, I was interviewed by USA Today in a story about the enduring fan response to Baz Luhrmann's musical "Moulin Rouge." My quote happened to follow one from Rosie O'Donnell.

A week later, the producers for her talk show called me. Since she and I shared passions for not only "MR," but also Barbra Streisand's "Yentl," they wanted to have me appear on the show and talk with Rosie, pulling up our favorite clips from both movies. They would fly me to New York from L.A. I would be on the same show as actresses Laura Linney and Kate Winslet.

I agreed. They began the preliminaries, including getting my choice of clips. And then I started to get cold feet. I wondered if this was too superficial a matter for which to be getting my 15 minutes (more like 8 or 9) of fame.

It would be a transcontinental adventure, I'd get an appearance fee, I'd meet three actresses I'd always admired (two of them gorgeously good-looking) ... but was it of any real substance?

And more directly, since my only claim to attention was in matching Rosie's tastes and in having seen these movies endlessly in the theater, and my only resemblance to anything in the movies was in looking like, well, Roger Ebert (if I wore a sweater) ... did I belong there?

Finally, I didn't trust myself to not drop a comment critical of, for example, O'Donnell's raging hypocrisy about the Second Amendment. I did, and do, like her as an actress, but — as with Streisand — not at all politically.

So with my churning stomach being a subconscious affirmation of my conscious decisions, I called the line producer back, gave my regrets, and received hers. The show aired on 24 January 2002 with a third actress, Laura Prepon, in my place — in her 20s, with Winslet in her 30s and Linney in her 40s, a more interesting contrast, methinks. (I didn't see it.)

Narrowly missed eternal fame, or embarrassment. Ah well. If only, in the years since, I could avoid seeing, say, Winslet's lovely turn in "The Holiday," or the rise and fall of her marriage ... without thinking about What Might Have Been ... Yeah. Right. {sigh}

[George H. Smith]

I've always had a big ego, Jeff, sometimes to the point of embarrassing myself rather than risk not being noticed at all. Surely that fact has not escaped you during the nearly forty years we have known each other.

Plus, there are a lot of good looking women among "the sweaty, insensate herd," and being called to their attention can sometimes produce good results. I believe it's called "culling the herd." 8-)

I will probably pay for writing this whimsical post. ...

You betcha, as the possible next Repukelican and first woman president (may the gods help us) loves to assure her audiences. You'll all get to hear how close I came to being on "The Rosie O'Donnell Show," speaking of the sweaty herd of the public {rueful smile}

In January 2002, I was interviewed by USA Today in a story about the enduring fan response to Baz Luhrmann's musical "Moulin Rouge." My quote happened to follow one from Rosie O'Donnell.

A week later, the producers for her talk show called me. Since she and I shared passions for not only "MR," but also Barbra Streisand's "Yentl," they wanted to have me appear on the show and talk with Rosie, pulling up our favorite clips from both movies. They would fly me to New York from L.A. I would be on the same show as actresses Laura Linney and Kate Winslet.

I agreed. They began the preliminaries, including getting my choice of clips. And then I started to get cold feet. I wondered if this was too superficial a matter for which to be getting my 15 minutes (more like 8 or 9) of fame.

It would be a transcontinental adventure, I'd get an appearance fee, I'd meet three actresses I'd always admired (two of them gorgeously good-looking) ... but was it of any real substance?

And more directly, since my only claim to attention was in matching Rosie's tastes and in having seen these movies endlessly in the theater, and my only resemblance to anything in the movies was in looking like, well, Roger Ebert (if I wore a sweater) ... did I belong there?

Finally, I didn't trust myself to not drop a comment critical of, for example, O'Donnell's raging hypocrisy about the Second Amendment. I did, and do, like her as an actress, but — as with Streisand — not at all politically.

So with my churning stomach being a subconscious affirmation of my conscious decisions, I called the line producer back, gave my regrets, and received hers. The show aired on 24 January 2002 with a third actress, Laura Prepon, in my place — in her 20s, with Winslet in her 30s and Linney in her 40s, a more interesting contrast, methinks. (I didn't see it.)

Narrowly missed eternal fame, or embarrassment. Ah well. If only, in the years since, I could avoid seeing, say, Winslet's lovely turn in "The Holiday," or the rise and fall of her marriage ... without thinking about What Might Have Been ... Yeah. Right. {sigh}

Anyone with the fortitude to watch Moulin Rouge 17 times and Yentl 23 times surely has the fortitude to risk offending Rosie O'Donnell in front of the sweaty, insensate herd -- especially when you would have had the chance to meet two prime, nonsweaty members of the herd, Laura Linney and Kate Winslet. (They may be insensate, but who cares?)

Seriously, good post.

Ghs

[Xray]

One mannerism that annoyed me a bit is Burns's tendency to superficially agree upfront with what someone says, such as Stewart's comment that Rand advocated a totalitarian system of individualists.

"Totalitarian system of indivdualists" - quite an oxymoron.

Was this a deliberately sarcastic comment by the interviewer?

The expression that Jon Stewart used is "totalitarian State of individulalists," and he wasn't being sarcastic. The remark occurs at around 2:50 into the video clip, which can be seen at:

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-october-15-2009/jennifer-burns

Ghs

Thanks for directing me to the passage. That was an astute remark by the interviewer as he pointed out that Rand, "on the other side" was almost as purely ideological as the Communists she fought against.

"Totalitarian State of individualists" is an oxymoron; I found Galt's Gulch more totalitarian than individualistic, with Galt having having quite few traits in common with a Big Brother is Wachting You. Just think of how he stalked Dagny for twelve years.

Edited April 21, 2010 by Xray

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

I think I am a little too touchy-feely to consider normal everyday people as "the sweaty, insensate herd." Even normal everyday TV audiences.

I did a bit of TV in Brazil and I never worried about looking down on my audience. I always felt pleasure about being on stage. To be honest, in the beginning, I had stage fright. But I learned how to deal with that early on. I admit, I gravitate more towards producing than performing, but I like being in the public eye.

So there. I'm a media whore.

Without a tinge of guilt.

Now that I am migrating to Internet marketing, I hold the same view. I'll even be putting out my own videos before too long. I'm doing it wrong, though. I'm producing and performing. Don't ever do that. When a doubt arises on one end, it paralyzes the other. But hell, I'm hardheaded and I will get this thing done and done right, even if it is taking 10 times more effort than it should.

Back to the point. In addition to trying to appeal to the good in folks (and I believe almost all folks have some good in them), that "sweaty, insensate herd" happens to be my "sweaty, insensate customers." I don't think I could even sell bar soap and deodorant to those sweaty folks if I felt contempt for them.

Michael

[merjet]

Charles Murray's review of the two recent Rand biographies.