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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago, according to a new Gallup poll. Americans consistently report high levels of belief in the supernatural. About 80 percent of Americans believe in miracles and three-quarters believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, according to a 2013 Pew survey. [Discovery.com]

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I would like to see the framing of the questions, their sample and certain other internal criteria to give it any weight.

Also, did someone commission Pew for this poll?

Pew Research Center is a nonprofit, tax-exempt 501©3 organization and a subsidiary of The Pew Charitable Trusts. The center’s empirically driven research on a wide range of topics helps key stakeholders in society—policymakers, philanthropists, nonprofit organizations and the public at large—solve the world’s most challenging problems.

Pew Research Center’s primary funder and parent organization is The Pew Charitable Trusts. The Pew Charitable Trusts is an independent nonprofit organization – the sole beneficiary of seven individual charitable funds, established between 1948 and 1979 by two sons and two daughters of Sun Oil Company founder Joseph N. Pew and his wife, Mary Anderson Pew.

Pew Research Center also collaborates with strategic partners. All partnerships must meet guidelines established to maintain the independence and impartiality of our research and to advance our mission to inform the public.

Current and past donors and partners include charitable foundations such as the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the John Templeton Foundation, the John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, the William and Flora Hewlett Foundation, the John S. and James L. Knight Foundation, the Neubauer Family Foundation and the Lilly Endowment. Pew Research has also partnered with major news organizations such as The New York Times, The Washington Post, USA TODAY, National Journal, Smithsonian Magazine and The Economist.

Financial information is available upon request to Nikolas Wissmann, Director of Financial Administration, Pew Research Center.

For more information about partnering or supporting the Pew Research Center, contact Nicole Surber, Senior Director, Philanthropic Partnership Group, The Pew Charitable Trusts.

http://www.pewresearch.org/

A...

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Interesting:

http://www.aim.org/don-irvine-blog/p-u-to-l-pew-media-bias-survey/

But what makes the study so flawed is Pew’s methodology.

First of all Pew surveyed what they called 11,500 mainstream media outlets. There may be that many media outlets, but those that are considered mainstream or influential are a fraction of that number.

Second they used an algorithm they developed to determine what constitutes positive, neutral and negative stories using a computer to assess each story. For example, a story on how well Herman Cain is liked was coded a positive and a story about Michele Bachmann’s migraines was coded negative, though neither story discussed specific proposals or policies of the candidates, which would more easily determine the story’s level of fairness.

While the computer would seem to be impartial and a perfect judge of story content it can’t accurately judge the stories without context. The researchers say that they tested the algorithm until it matched 97% of the researchers’ answers, but due to the vast number of stories analyzed they didn’t check on all the stories the computer scored.

They also trusted the computer to analyze the tone of the stories they chose to evaluate. Therefore the computer viewed the tone of the Cain article as positive and the Bachmann article as negative even though the stories themselves would likely have little effect one way or another on their respective campaigns.

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Here's the link to Discovery.com

Thanks Wolf.

It was a Gallop poll so I have to look there. Additionally, my profession opinion is they have been seriously compromised in their methodology and modeling on public opinion.

They do not concentrate on registered voters who are prime voters.

They do get a "snap shot" of the total populace's "feeling." Useless on election day.

A...

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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago,

I'm one of the four... except that I hold the opinion that God personally formed the first morally accountable human beings with souls less than 10,000 years ago as described in Genesis... and that it is this unique moral quality that made them, and us as their offspring, "created in God's image". Since God has no image, that quality logically had to be a non-physical attribute such as being created as morally accountable beings, because the most notable quality of God is goodness.

It's also my opinion that humans were preceded by amoral humanoid animals who were not accountable for their behavior, and in that regard were similar in nature to the other animals.

Greg

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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago,

I'm one of the four... except that I hold the opinion that God personally formed the first morally accountable human beings with souls less than 10,000 years ago as described in Genesis... and that it is this unique moral quality that made them, and us as their offspring, "created in God's image". Since God has no image, that quality logically had to be a non-physical attribute such as being created as morally accountable beings, because the most notable quality of God is goodness.

It's also my opinion that humans were preceded by amoral humanoid animals who were not accountable for their behavior, and in that regard were similar in nature to the other animals.

Greg

Honesty is the best policy. Clears up a lot of puzzlement.

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and that it is this unique moral quality that made them, and us as their offspring, "created in God's image". Since God has no image, that quality logically had to be a non-physical attribute such as being created as morally accountable beings, because the most notable quality of God is goodness.

But a lazy kind of goodness. God did not get off His ass to help the Armenians and the Jews.

Some God that is.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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Peikoff and correct should rarely, very rarely appear in the same sentence.

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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago,

I'm one of the four... except that I hold the opinion that God personally formed the first morally accountable human beings with souls less than 10,000 years ago as described in Genesis... and that it is this unique moral quality that made them, and us as their offspring, "created in God's image". Since God has no image, that quality logically had to be a non-physical attribute such as being created as morally accountable beings, because the most notable quality of God is goodness.

It's also my opinion that humans were preceded by amoral humanoid animals who were not accountable for their behavior, and in that regard were similar in nature to the other animals.

Greg

Honesty is the best policy. Clears up a lot of puzzlement.

I'm glad to hear that, Wolf... and have stated this opinion here before when it was relevant to the discussion.

The way people behave today... I can believe they wish they could revert to the soulless amoral state of animals in their futile quest for immorality without consequence.

Greg

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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago,

I'm one of the four... except that I hold the opinion that God personally formed the first morally accountable human beings with souls less than 10,000 years ago as described in Genesis... and that it is this unique moral quality that made them, and us as their offspring, "created in God's image". Since God has no image, that quality logically had to be a non-physical attribute such as being created as morally accountable beings, because the most notable quality of God is goodness.

It's also my opinion that humans were preceded by amoral humanoid animals who were not accountable for their behavior, and in that regard were similar in nature to the other animals.

Let me see if I get this right. Of the four choices given in the survey, Greg would answer that God created human beings pretty much in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years or so.

Of course, Greg has not said anything in particular about the age of the universe, the age of the earth, and not a word yet on the reality of evolution.

The best spin I can put on these beliefs (and still place Greg in the world of Reason) is that Greg more or less accepts the Catholic position as enunciated by the pope John Paul II. The official Catholic position does not dispute what science tells about the age of the world, that evolution spawned human beings. At some point the god thing created human souls ... here is the pope Benedict summing it all up (from the church article Human Persons Created in the Image of God).

According to the widely accepted scientific account, the universe erupted 15 billion years ago in an explosion called the 'Big Bang' and has been expanding and cooling ever since. Later there gradually emerged the conditions necessary for the formation of atoms, still later the condensation of galaxies and stars, and about 10 billion years later the formation of planets. In our own solar system and on earth (formed about 4.5 billion years ago), the conditions have been favorable to the emergence of life. While there is little consensus among scientists about how the origin of this first microscopic life is to be explained, there is general agreement among them that the first organism dwelt on this planet about 3.5–4 billion years ago. Since it has been demonstrated that all living organisms on earth are genetically related, it is virtually certain that all living organisms have descended from this first organism. Converging evidence from many studies in the physical and biological sciences furnishes mounting support for some theory of evolution to account for the development and diversification of life on earth, while controversy continues over the pace and mechanisms of evolution.
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Let me see if I get this right. Of the four choices given in the survey, Greg would answer that God created human beings pretty much in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years or so.

Yes... and just to clarify the most important... in their present morally accountable form.

In my opinion, morally accountable human beings originated within 10,000 years ago, and before them there were only amoral humanoid animals.

Of course, Greg has not said anything in particular about the age of the universe, the age of the earth, and not a word yet on the reality of evolution.

I'm fine with 4.5 billion years for the earth, and 15 bil or whatever for the universe. Neither has any bearing on human moral accountability.

and not a word yet on the reality of evolution.

I'm just fine with evolution, too... as it is completely subject to the intelligent design of a whole host of exquisitely logical well-ordered physical and biological laws.. without which evolution would not be possible.

And just to repeat... the genesis of human moral accountability is not connected to the purely physical process of evolution. It is an added factor personally installed by a Moral Creator.who also created those same self evident truths about inalienable human rights recognized by Americans today... but not by everyone who inhabits America.

Greg

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self evident truths about inalienable human rights

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

That's fine, Wolf.

You've clearly declared that you're one who believes that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government, and not inherent rights granted to you by God.

Greg

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self evident truths about inalienable human rights

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

That's fine, Wolf.

You've clearly declared that you're one who believes that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government, and not inherent rights granted to you by God.

Greg

Sir, you cannot put words into other people's mouths. You're welcome to speak for yourself, not for me.

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self evident truths about inalienable human rights

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

That's fine, Wolf.

You've clearly declared that you're one who believes that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government, and not inherent rights granted to you by God.

Greg,

Do you have a quote where Wolf declared this? If there is nothing explicit, maybe something he said you interpreted this way?

These aren't leading questions. I'm just trying to understand what you see that I don't (or maybe missed).

Michael

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self evident truths about inalienable human rights

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

That's fine, Wolf.

You've clearly declared that you're one who believes that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government, and not inherent rights granted to you by God.

Greg,

Do you have a quote where Wolf declared this?

Yes, I do, Michael.

It's in Wolf's own words just above here...

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

He clearly disagrees with that statement concerning Divinely granted inalienable rights, and made it clear that he considers those words in the Declaration of Independence to be baseless, lacking a foundation, or even possessing a reasoned argument to support them. That's a normal Objectivist response to anything even alluding to a higher order than the purely secular physical world.

Perhaps Wolf could further clarify the nature of his disagreement with that D of I statement. It's obvious he has a problem with it.

Greg

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Greg,

I don't understand your logic.

Even if he disagrees that rights are divinely bestowed on humans, how does that mean that he has "clearly declared" that "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government"?

The government?

Really?

Aren't you aware of the standard non-religious libertarian argument on the origin of rights? That they are innate in human nature? This is common enough you should know it.

What's more, I'm not even sure that is Wolf's view, although that is one of the most common ones (i.e., non-God and non-government origin of rights) in the libertarian neck of the woods. But there are even other theories on the origin of rights that get discussed in Objectivist and libertarian circles.

In other words, Wolf did not "clearly declare" the government was the source of rights. You inferred that (for whatever reason, and knowing you, I believe it was a mistake), but you said he clearly declared that.

I thought bearing false witness was a sin to religious folks...

:)

(I say that as friend, not foe.)

Michael

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Allow me to offer a secular nod to the assertion that morality applied to humans only since the last Ice Age. That said, the other discussion is pointless. Just because God did not give us our rights does not mean that they come from the government. Even so, I have to acknowledge Greg's point, in that perceptions matter. Just because Wolf did not say it, does not mean that Greg did not hear it. I went around with Baratheon on a different point by the same means.

We have a lot of owls here. They sound like Kiowas. So far, no arrows in the door...

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Four in 10 Americans believe God created the Earth and anatomically modern humans, less than 10,000 years ago, according to a new Gallup poll. Americans consistently report high levels of belief in the supernatural. About 80 percent of Americans believe in miracles and three-quarters believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, according to a 2013 Pew survey. [Discovery.com]

Thanks. I agree that progress is coming and that we have a lot to look forward to.

[i have followed these polls closely for about eight years. (My freshman year was 1967. My wife and I gathered up all of our various credits and completed our degrees in 2008 and 2010. Mine are in criminology and social science, so I had a lot of sociology classes. Analyzing these polls was fruitful for me several times. I wrote a paper on the sociology of atheism for one class.)]

I note that the rise of disbelief comes at the expense of the middle of the road. We are polarizing on the core questions. (Adam's citation to the Gallup supports Wolf's pointing to the Pew.)

If I remember correctly, I found it funny that 3% of those who self-identify as "fundamentalist" question the divinity of Jesus. You have to re-consider the difference between those who are religious and those who report that they are religious. Religiousness is a norm in our society.

While I do not have Adam's strong skepticism about the Pew poll, I do note that words matter. What is a "miracle" that spontaneous remission from cancer is not - even if there is no God?

Also, this poll was for Americans. Globally (regionally) these numbers will be different - and mean different things. A few years ago, I saw a video about manufacturing in China and in the home of one factory manager, the wife was burning incense by a Buddha. Tradition runs deep. On a related view, many people in Japan celebrate Christmas with even less understanding than you find here. They just integrate whatever comes along into their social behavior. So, then, would we find that some astounding or troubling percentage of people who celebrate Christmas also believe that Buddha was divine and that robots have souls?

The important thing is not that so many are ignorant, but that such a large number are educated and intelligent.

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self evident truths about inalienable human rights

You mean the assertion of (without foundation or reasoned argument for) "inalienable rights."

That's fine, Wolf.

You've clearly declared that you're one who believes that life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government, and not inherent rights granted to you by God.

Greg

Sir, you cannot put words into other people's mouths. You're welcome to speak for yourself, not for me.

He does this all the time, Wolf. He keeps doing it in spite of objections. He either cannot understand or does not care about this basic lack of courtesy. It does keep pissed off people engaged with him. His too much done reductionist simplicities result in overly broad generalizations such as all homosexuality is caused by improperly dealt with childhood sexual traumas, and to hell knowing anything about the subject except from his own alleged direct experiences and observations. (Introspection?) Studies? We don't need no stinkin' studies!

--Brant

thank you for strongly objecting to what is a straw man (you!) argumentum ad hominem

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Greg,

I don't understand your logic.

Even if he disagrees that rights are divinely bestowed on humans, how does that mean that he has "clearly declared" that "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness were all given to you by the government"?

The government?

Really?

Aren't you aware of the standard non-religious libertarian argument on the origin of rights? That they are innate in human nature? This is common enough you should know it.

If Wolf wants to clarify exactly what his disagreement with those words in the D of I is... I'll be happy to retract my comment and to apologize to him for inferring something that he did not imply.

This topic raises another issue: Where did the laws that make the "rights innate to human nature" possible come from? The secular answer is that they either came from nothing, or were created from nothing by men.

Being an Objectivist who believes these rights are "innate to human nature", have you ever asked yourself: From where did the government get the power to take them away from you today? This is well worth consideration for to honestly inquire follows a line of reasoning that leads back to how each of us is living our life today.

Do realize that the men who made possible this nation we enjoy today regarded those clearly stated truths to be so completely obvious as to be totally beyond any reasonable logical denial? Clearly the paradigm from which they were operating was not only entirely foreign to the popular collective societal consensus in America today... but it is actually held in such contempt as to even be subject to public ridicule.

I've always found it ironic that those who eat the fruit today can actually deny the truth of the experience of God which motivated people to shed their own blood to plant the very tree which bears that fruit...

...and those who do, will not eat it for long.

In my opinion, this explains why the government is able to take those freedoms away as it is doing right now. By moral law, the government is given the right to take away the freedom from everyone who does not deserve it. What I see happening with the cancerous intrusive growth of government today is nothing other than perfect moral justice. I see people who don't deserve freedom simply getting it taken away from them. And even worse... they're actually throwing it away by their own stubborn willful failure to properly order their own lives.

The government cannot take away those self evident inalienable rights from Americans who govern themselves, because they were given to them by God... and not by government.

Greg

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