US Postal Service loses $2B this spring

[Backlighting]

A billion here, a billion there.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/us-postal-service-loses-2b-spring

[Francisco Ferrer]

This is a case where the taxpayers would be better off by seeing government property given away. Don't bother trying to sell it. Just give the whole damn thing to the postal workers. I'd rather see federal property fall into the hands of syndicalists than spend one more dime on the loser monopoly.

[Selene]

This is a case where the taxpayers would be better off by seeing government property given away. Don't bother trying to sell it. Just give the whole damn thing to the postal workers. I'd rather see federal property fall into the hands of syndicalists than spend one more dime on the loser monopoly.

Not sure about this, however, require amending the document.

I think we have had this discussion before on OL, and I think I was wrong then too!

A...

Post Script:

Article I Section 8:

To establish Post Offices and post Roads.

[BaalChatzaf]

The U.S.Postal Service(????) has a fucking legal monopoly on first class mail and they still loose money!! Amazing

[Francisco Ferrer]

This is a case where the taxpayers would be better off by seeing government property given away. Don't bother trying to sell it. Just give the whole damn thing to the postal workers. I'd rather see federal property fall into the hands of syndicalists than spend one more dime on the loser monopoly.

Not sure about this, however, require amending the document.

I think we have had this discussion before on OL, and I think I was wrong then too!

A...

Post Script:

Article I Section 8:

To establish Post Offices and post Roads.

A criminal judge has the power to impose a sentence of death. He need not exercise that power.

The Congress "shall have power to lay and collect taxes . . . To borrow money on the credit of the United States . . . To establish Post Offices and post Roads . . . To declare war . . . "

Congress is not obliged to exercise all powers delegated to it and at all times.

We don't always have to be at war or in debt.

Especially debt due to a money-losing stinker like the USPS.

[BaalChatzaf]

We don't always have to be at war or in debt.

Especially debt due to a money-losing stinker like the USPS.

Alexander Hamilton thought that national debt was a Good Thing.

It kept the pot boiling.

The amount the USPS is loosing is chump change. Two billion in the hole? That is almost break even.

Ba'al Chatzaf

[Selene]

The Congress "shall have power to lay and collect taxes . . . To borrow money on the credit of the United States . . . To establish Post Offices and post Roads . . . To declare war . . . "

Congress is not obliged to exercise all powers delegated to it and at all times.

Ah, the famous "shall" word...in Constitutions, law and language...

The word ‘Shall’ has the following meanings:

• An imperative command; has a duty to or is required to. For example, the notice shall be sent within 30 days. Usually ‘shall’ used here is in the mandatory sense.
• Should . Courts often interpret shall as should. For example, all claimants shall request mediation.
• May. When a negative word such as not or no precedes shall the word shall often means may. For example, no person shall enter the building without first signing the roster.
• Will . For example, the defendant shall then have a period of 30 days to object.

The following are some case law interpreting the word shall:

When used in statutes, contracts, or the like, the word "shall" is generally imperative or mandatory.[independent School Dist. v. Independent School Dist., 170 N.W.2d 433, 440 (Minn. 1969)]

"In common, or ordinary parlance, and in its ordinary signification, the term 'shall' is a word of command, and one which has always, or which must be given a compulsory meaning; as denoting obligation. It has a peremptory meaning, and it is generally imperative or mandatory. It has the invariable significance of excluding the idea of discretion, and has the significance of operating to impose a duty which may be enforced, particularly if public policy is in favor of this meaning, or when addressed to public officials, or where a public interest is involved, or where the public or persons have rights which ought to be exercised or enforced, unless a contrary intent appears; but the context ought to be very strongly persuasive before it is softened into a mere permission," etc.[People v. O'Rourke, 124 Cal. App. 752, 759 (Cal. App. 1932)]

Just guessing here, [not really] thinking they meant it in the highlighted section above.

A...

[Francisco Ferrer]

"Shall establish post offices" and "shall have the power to establish post offices" have very different meanings.

Consider that the Constitution says the President "shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two-thirds of the Senators present concur."

If we took that optional authority as an absolute requirement to act, then every President, once elected, would have to search the globe for some country, any country, to make a treaty with.

[Selene]

"Shall establish post offices" and "shall have the power to establish post offices" have very different meanings.

Consider that the Constitution says the President "shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two-thirds of the Senators present concur."

If we took that optional authority as an absolute requirement to act, then every President, once elected, would have to search the globe for some country, any country, to make a treaty with.

Excuse me, did you read post # 7 supra?

[BaalChatzaf]

The Congress "shall have power to lay and collect taxes . . . To borrow money on the credit of the United States . . . To establish Post Offices and post Roads . . . To declare war . . . "

Congress is not obliged to exercise all powers delegated to it and at all times.

Ah, the famous "shall" word...in Constitutions, law and language...

The word ‘Shall’ has the following meanings:

• An imperative command; has a duty to or is required to. For example, the notice shall be sent within 30 days. Usually ‘shall’ used here is in the mandatory sense.
• Should . Courts often interpret shall as should. For example, all claimants shall request mediation.
• May. When a negative word such as not or no precedes shall the word shall often means may. For example, no person shall enter the building without first signing the roster.
• Will . For example, the defendant shall then have a period of 30 days to object.

The following are some case law interpreting the word shall:

When used in statutes, contracts, or the like, the word "shall" is generally imperative or mandatory.[independent School Dist. v. Independent School Dist., 170 N.W.2d 433, 440 (Minn. 1969)]

"In common, or ordinary parlance, and in its ordinary signification, the term 'shall' is a word of command, and one which has always, or which must be given a compulsory meaning; as denoting obligation. It has a peremptory meaning, and it is generally imperative or mandatory. It has the invariable significance of excluding the idea of discretion, and has the significance of operating to impose a duty which may be enforced, particularly if public policy is in favor of this meaning, or when addressed to public officials, or where a public interest is involved, or where the public or persons have rights which ought to be exercised or enforced, unless a contrary intent appears; but the context ought to be very strongly persuasive before it is softened into a mere permission," etc.[People v. O'Rourke, 124 Cal. App. 752, 759 (Cal. App. 1932)]

Just guessing here, [not really] thinking they meant it in the highlighted section above.

A...

Whatever happened to "must??