Self Quarantine

[Derek McGowan]

unless we can at least agree on the straightforward issue of Galt.

I cant agree when he was very explicit on the desired outcome- the expressed collapse of society. He saw a society or at least he saw where it was going (in the meeting at the car manufactures) , he said it was wrong and wanted to bring it down. He then took concrete steps to accomplish that goal, knowing full well (they even talked about the death destruction and danger that would take place while at the gulch) what it would lead to.

I can only believe that he did it on purpose

[George H. Smith]

unless we can at least agree on the straightforward issue of Galt.

I cant agree when he was very explicit on the desired outcome- the expressed collapse of society. He saw a society or at least he saw where it was going (in the meeting at the car manufactures) , he said it was wrong and wanted to bring it down. He then took concrete steps to accomplish that goal, knowing full well (they even talked about the death destruction and danger that would take place while at the gulch) what it would lead to.

I can only believe that he did it on purpose

I don't recall any indication in Atlas Shrugged that Galt wanted society to collapse. If you know of any passage to support your contention, please fill us in. As I said before, Galt may have expected society to collapse if producers withdrew their cooperation, but to expect something to happen is not the same as wanting it to happen. I expect America to undergo a severe financial crisis in the near future, owing to the destructive idiocy of the government, but I don't want that to happen. No rational person would.

Ghs

[Ellen Stuttle]

"I'm going to stop the motor of the world."

I think that's what Galt said.

Ellen

[dldelancey]

Even if there were any part of me that could be okay with that (which there isn't), that's quite an infringment on his rights and most definitely an initation of force.

Does this mean that even the transmitting of a common cold to others could be interpreted as an infringement on others rights? Should you be able to sue a co-worker who knew they were sick and yet still came to work?

Can you sue if someone infected you with AIDS and they knew they had it? With Ebola? With Chicken Pox? With Pink eye?

In the US, there are criminal laws regarding knowingly transmitting HIV, and 30 states have carried out successful prosecutions based on them. Google "criminal transmission of HIV." You'll get lots of hits.

It's a matter of proportion, Derek. Your scenario included a 100% contagious, 100% fatal disease. We can rationally make a distinction between that kind of disease and the common cold.

I don't know if I could sue a coworker who came to work with a cold. I'm pretty sure I could try to sue anyone for anything. Whether or not I win is another story. All I can say is that I wouldn't.

[dldelancey]

Someone please define altruism for me. and if it is putting others before you, explain how it is not putting others before you if you self quarantine yourself for life...

I'm only re-asking because we have begun talking about the negative side of exposing people and we haven't touched the negative side of self quarantine. Their is no negative side of self quarantine? Or does the positive of everyone else's life out balance the positive of your own

Again, I think it's a matter of proportion, and it's also extremely important for the disease-ridden person to know specifically what she values. When "quarantine yourself for life" means 5 days, as your original scenario posited, that's a very small inconvenience when I weigh it against the remainder of my child's life when, by averages, he has probably 60+ more years to live. I value 60 years of my child's life (during which I can expect him to finish school, meet his first love, learn to drive, become a parent, maybe cure cancer, etc etc) more than I value 5 days of my own life (a lot of living left, yes, but a whole lot behind me, too).

Point being, my decision is based on the fact that I personally value those specific 60 years of my son's life more than I value those specific 5 days of my life. That may seem altruistic on the surface, but it isn't.

Now, if the terms of the scenario were to change, some new information is found, I might make a different choice. For instance, if I somehow knew for a fact that my son would die in some other way, perhaps by horrible violence, the day after my own death in space, but that if I returned I could spare him that tragic and scary ending and instead die together with him...... see?

[anthony]

You've a misinterpretation of 'rational' and 'egoist'. Rational: as in adhering to objective reality with one's reason -- not, shrewdly or 'logically' adapting or discarding one's convictions to suit one's momentary needs and whims (subjectivity).

I'll have to look into this. I actually dont know the difference at the current time and according to the philosophy

That's good, checking it out for yourself. The novels, you'll know, are a representation of Rand's ideas in the form of her characters and their exploits, the 'practical' which fleshes out the theory. You may find you need the theory for complete understanding.

Altruism is essentially self-sacrifice, which preceding any physical actions by the perpetrator (i.e. in service and duty), necessitates "surrender", "self-abnegation" of his mind... which means his relationship with reality and his principles, virtues and values.

[Brant Gaede]

Altruism: making inferior use of your time respecting what you value.

--they don't call me "Brant" for nothing!

[anthony]

Altruism: making inferior use of your time respecting what you value.

--they don't call me "Brant" for nothing!

Absolutely.

"Since a value is that which one acts to gain and/or keep, and the amount of possible action is limited by the duration of one's lifespan, it is a part of one's life that one invests in everything one values. The years, months, days or hours of thought, of interest, of action devoted to a value are the currency with which one pays for the enjoyment one receives from it.

[Concepts of Consciousness ITOE]

[Jules Troy]

Gee honey I missed you so much! Oh.. I have this alien plague with 100% transmission and 100% lethality, mind if I drop by to see you and the kids?"

I think she would be the first one to ask the government to blow your ship up in space...

[anthony]

haha - exactly! ("And which alien floozie did you catch it off?!! Tell me that!")

[Peter]

I got my flu shot at the VA last week as I may have already mentioned. October seemed a little early but it was free, so who would pass it up? I have not had the flu in years in spite of being near a child and a teacher who do get the flu and I rarely get a cold. The shot is nearly painless, though I did feel a bit woozy the next day.  Oddly using a CPAP machine helps when I have had a cold and I have only sneezed in it one time. Without the CPAP I would get a clogged shnoz and sneeze a lot. I remember trying to sleep in my lazy boy chair, but no longer.  Peter   

Notes. “I’ve never had one. And thus far I’ve never had the flu. I don’t like the idea of injecting bad stuff into your body. And that’s basically what they do. And this one (latest flu vaccine) has not been very effective to start off with. I have friends that religiously get the flu shot and then they get the flu. You know, that helps my thinking. I’ve seen a lot of reports that the last flu shot is virtually totally ineffective.” ~President Trump