Ireland legalizes homosexuality....

[anthony]

There are many different kinds of gay people in their gayness, many different kinds of straight people in their straightness, and different sorts of mixtures between.

This could be the best thought that has emerged. After its genus and differentiae, there are so many variants and sub-variants of mankind, that no satisfactory explanation exists but that of one of a kind individualism.

Yes... one could almost say that there are fifty shades of grey.

Greg

Not nearly enough, more like several billion hues and tints of colours is my reckoning. A big 'if', is in one sometimes having to dig beneath the surface to recognise the unique "colours" of another individual, but the biggest 'if' is dependent first on that individual himself "realizing" (in both senses of the word) his originality. Conformity to group-thinking is largely the downfall of that.

[moralist]

There are many different kinds of gay people in their gayness, many different kinds of straight people in their straightness, and different sorts of mixtures between.

This could be the best thought that has emerged. After its genus and differentiae, there are so many variants and sub-variants of mankind, that no satisfactory explanation exists but that of one of a kind individualism.

Yes... one could almost say that there are fifty shades of grey.

Greg

Not nearly enough, more like several billion hues and tints of colours is my reckoning. A big 'if', is in one sometimes having to dig beneath the surface to recognise the unique "colours" of another individual, but the biggest 'if' is dependent first on that individual himself "realizing" (in both senses of the word) his originality. Conformity to group-thinking is largely the downfall of that.

I agree with Viktor Frankl, a psychiatrist who was in Nazi concentration camps in WWII and who lived to write in his book, "Man's Search for Meaning"...

"There are only two races... the decent and the indecent."

Cuts through all the bull s**t.

Greg

[Selene]

.

I'll bet a coke the US Supreme Court will hand down a 5-4 decision saying that States are not in violation of the US constitution in not granting marriage to same-sex applicants. (The conservatives and Catholics on the bench, you know.) And they will rule 9-0 in requiring all States to recognize marriages granted in other States.

I think that is a scenario that works for me.

An interesting issue has been meandering about in the culture for the last 15 or so years concerning bean counting the "homosexual" population in the United States.

In 2012, the Atlantic reported that Gary Gates, who is a "...Senior Research Fellow at The Williams Institute on Sexual Orientation Law and Public Policy, a think tank dedicated to the field of sexual orientation law and public policy...," explained in an interview that the folks in the US must go with the "...convention that 1 in 10 people..." are gay is a myth:

...and if so, what is the number?

That’s the single question that I’m asked the most. The answer is unfortunately not simple. I’ll respond with a question. What do you mean when you use the word “gay”? If you mean people who identify as gay, lesbian, or bisexual in a survey, then the answer is that it’s likely not one in ten, but closer to one in twenty. A recent government survey found that 4 percent of adults aged 18-45 identified as “homosexual” or “bisexual”. A similar proportion of voters identify as GLB. If you define gay as having same-sex attractions or behaviors, you do get higher proportions that are a bit closer to the one in ten figure. http://gaylife.about.com/od/index/a/garygates.htm

The Atlantic article: http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/05/americans-have-no-idea-how-few-gay-people-there-are/257753/

Does anyone have any other data?

A...

[Reidy]

3% - 4% is the range I've seen.

The 10% attributed to Kinsey came about, I've read, from two causes.

The first is that he said that 10% had been through a phase, not 10% are gay. To say that 80% of adults have attended high school is not to say that 80% are currently in high school.

The second is that his sampling methods were faulty by modern standards, as he mixed self-selecting with randomly-selected interviewees. The gays in the UI vicinity could have volunteered in disproportionate numbers in order to skew the results, and by some accounts that is just what they did.

[moralist]

In 2012, the Atlantic reported that Gary Gates, who is a "...Senior Research Fellow at The Williams Institute on Sexual Orientation Law and Public Policy, a think tank dedicated to the field of sexual orientation law and public policy...," explained in an interview that the folks in the US must go with the "...convention that 1 in 10 people..." are gay is a myth:

I'd never underestimate the political strength of the political minority homosexual lobby because of their political majority liberal allies, the activist liberal judges, as well as the liberal mainstream media constantly controlling the language and shaping the narrative of homosexual marriage as already being an inevitable "done deal".

Californians voted for the definition of marriage as being between a man and a woman...

...and then it was overturned against the will of the people by liberal activist judges.

Greg

[Brant Gaede]

Voting for a legal definition means voting for a certain use of force which is not retaliatory. In this case majority suppression of a minority.

The idea of marriage defined by law instead of private contract is so deeply embedded in common consciousness gays want a share of that legal and moral wealth. What gays want they shouldn't have but neither should straights and since straights have it they want it too. The marriage ceremony is essentially religious and represents the melding of state and religion. There's little or no cultural room in that for homosexual marriage. Homosexuals who want marriage have no choice but to fight their way in. Absent marriage they can legally take steps to protect their relationship respecting each other.

An irony is how more and more straights aren't marrying at all. It's a massive shift.

--Brant

[moralist]

Voting for a legal definition means voting for a certain use of force which is not retaliatory. In this case majority suppression of a minority.

Laws against incest are also a not retaliatory use of force... and are also the majority suppression of a minority.

Homosexuals can already have all of the government granted legal rights in same sex unions...

...but that is NOT enough for them.

They want their relationships CALLED marriage.

Why? Because homosexuals are predominantly secular liberals for whom government is their god. So they naturally petition their god for its blessing on their relationships.

Whenever internal approval is lacking... external approval is sought.

This is a breach of moral protocol which is thousands of years old. But it's happened before and is happening again. Moral degeneration will simply continue until it reaches the point of "as it was in the days of Noah" when the toilet gets flushed again...

...because human nature has not changed in thousands of years.

Greg

[moralist]

An irony is how more and more straights aren't marrying at all. It's a massive shift.

That "massive shift" is a symptom of males who fail to become men... and will continue until males are the majority.

Greg

[Brant Gaede]

I'm not aware of laws against incest involving consenting adults.

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too. This is a turf fight--government turf.

--Brant

[Brant Gaede]

An irony is how more and more straights aren't marrying at all. It's a massive shift.

That "massive shift" is a symptom of males who fail to become men... and will continue until males are the majority.

Greg

You mean "'men' are the majority."

--Brant

always glad to help the old lady across the street (learned that in the Boy Scouts but couldn't find any for a Merit Badge but did notice some of them walking boys across the street instead and decided a boy helping an old lady helping a boy was too much even for a goody, goody Boy Scout--besides, look at the headline if I failed: "BOY SCOUT HELPING OLD LADY HELPING BOY CROSS THE STREET ALL WIPED OUT BY WOMBAT 12 [or whatever] DRUNK DRIVER")

[moralist]

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too.

It was already there because of the Judeo Christian values that pre existed the government and formed the moral foundation of not only the US government but of civilization itself.

In my opinion, America's physical protection was removed in 2001... It's financial protection removed in 2008... and is now fair game for what's next.

Greg

[Brant Gaede]

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too.

It was already there because of the Judeo Christian values that pre existed the government and formed the moral foundation of not only the US government but of civilization itself.

In my opinion, America's physical protection was removed in 2001... It's financial protection removed in 2008... and is now fair game for what's next.

Greg

Where have all the condoms gone, long time passing

Where have all the condoms gone, long time ago

Where have all the condoms gone, gone to babies every one

When will they ever learn, when will they learn?

Petr, Paul, Brant and Mary

(My Father's best friend at Antioch was Mary's)

https://youtu.be/pYii6nxhvUk

[BaalChatzaf]

I'm not aware of laws against incest involving consenting adults.

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too. This is a turf fight--government turf.

--Brant

No. They want all the legal rights that pertain to married folks....

[Selene]

I'm not aware of laws against incest involving consenting adults.

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too. This is a turf fight--government turf.

--Brant

No. They want all the legal rights that pertain to married folks....

Like tax breaks?

[moralist]

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too.

It was already there because of the Judeo Christian values that pre existed the government and formed the moral foundation of not only the US government but of civilization itself.

In my opinion, America's physical protection was removed in 2001... It's financial protection removed in 2008... and is now fair game for what's next.

Greg

Where have all the condoms gone, long time passing

Where have all the condoms gone, long time ago

Where have all the condoms gone, gone to babies every one

When will they ever learn, when will they learn?

Petr, Paul, Brant and Mary

(My Father's best friend at Antioch was Mary's)

https://youtu.be/pYii6nxhvUk

I was big fan of PP&M "long time passing".

Had all their albums, and went to one of their at concerts at the Hollywood Bowl.

Greg

[moralist]

I'm not aware of laws against incest involving consenting adults.

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too. This is a turf fight--government turf.

--Brant

No. They want all the legal rights that pertain to married folks....

I'm not aware of laws against incest involving consenting adults.

Heterosexuals want the blessings of government in marriage too. This is a turf fight--government turf.

--Brant

No. They want all the legal rights that pertain to married folks....

In many states homosexuals already enjoy the same rights as marriage in legal same sex unions.

But that's not enough. They want their relationships called marriage.

Greg

[Brant Gaede]

Puff the Magic Dragon lived by the sea . . .

____________

With her apron wrapped about her he took her for a swan,

Alas and alack, it was she, Polly Von

____________

Five hundred miles, five hundred miles . . .

____________

Everybody going to prey pray, on the very last day . . .

____________

I once had a race horse . . .

--Brant

of which the French made a stew, Stewball!

[moralist]

Puff the magic dragon lived by the sea

And frolicked in the autumn mist in a land called Honali

Together they would travel on a boat with billowed sail
Jackie kept a lookout perched on Puff's gigantic tail
Noble kings and princes would bow whene'er they came
Pirate ships would lower their flags when Puff lifts up his leg.

[Selene]

The news of his acts upon his sisters came via a (since expunged) 2006 police report. The offences occurred and were discovered by Jim-Bob in 2002/2003. The media scandal coverage has been wall-to-wall since it broke in celebrity-news organs People and In Touch. It is now in the thirteenth iteration of the ferocious all-media wash/spin/rinse storm.

William, I am not a tv watcher and was unfamiliar with this "story."

How did this police report "come" to be "public?"

These reports apparently described underage victims. Those records should have been sealed.

It is a crime to "leak" them.

A...

[william.scherk]

The news of his acts upon his sisters came via a (since expunged) 2006 police report. The offences occurred and were discovered by Jim-Bob in 2002/2003. The media scandal coverage has been wall-to-wall since it broke in celebrity-news organs People and In Touch. It is now in the thirteenth iteration of the ferocious all-media wash/spin/rinse storm.

William, I am not a tv watcher and was unfamiliar with this "story."

How did this police report "come" to be "public?"

These reports apparently described underage victims. Those records should have been sealed.

It is a crime to "leak" them.

Adam, most of the details were in the links I provided. The initial report of the scandal came via the celebrity news site/magazine InTouch. It is not clear to me just how the mag came into possession of an old police report, or what law their reporting may have broken. The InTouch story that contained a redacted police report is here. One small quote from that story: "The magazine obtained the police report, hidden since 2006, through a Freedom of Information Act request."

At the risk of being a copy-pasta, here's some salient details from Josh Duggar's Wikipedia page. Above and below this lengthy excerpt are further details that will probably answer your question better than my paraphrases ...

Upon Josh's return home in July 2003, Jim Bob brought Josh to Arkansas State Trooper Jim Hutchens, an acquaintance.^[37][38] This was reportedly the first time that police or other public authorities were made aware of this abuse.^[37][38] According to Jim Bob's account, Josh admitted to these actions at that time and apologized.^[37][38] Speaking via a lawyer, Hutchens disputes part of the reported account, saying that he was only told of a single act of incestuous molestation, and that he would have responded differently if he had known of additional instances and victims.^[42][43][44] Hutchens did not take any official action but reportedly gave Josh a "stern talk".^[37][38][44] Under Arkansas law, Hutchens was a mandated reporter who would have been expected to call the Arkansas Child Abuse Hotline.^[39]Hutchens was later arrested and convicted on unrelated charges of child pornography and is serving a 56-year prison sentence.^[45][46][42]

In 2005 and 2006, the first four TV specials featuring the Duggar family would be released. In December 2006, the family was scheduled to appear on The Oprah Winfrey Show.^[37] At this time, an anonymous source emailed Harpo Studios and called the Arkansas Child Abuse Hotline to reveal Josh's past sexual misconduct.^[37] The producers of the The Oprah Winfrey Show alerted the Department of Human Services and canceled the Duggar's scheduled appearance on the show.^[37] As a result of these reports, the Springdale Police Department investigated.^[37][38] Initially, Jim Bob "attempted to hire a lawyer and refused to produce his son for questioning" according to In Touch magazine; however, police did speak to Jim Bob, Michelle and several other family members.^[37][38] The family described the sexual misconduct that occurred in 2002 and 2003. The family reported that no further incidents had occurred since he had returned to the home in late 2003.^[31][37] The family members interviewed by police said that they felt safe in their home and had forgiven Duggar for his past behavior.^[31][36] Under Arkansas law, child sexual abuse charges for the offenses must be filed within three years of being reported to a police officer.^[39] Due to the family's earlier contact with State Trooper Jim Hutchens, the three-year statute of limitations had run out by the time of the 2006 investigation and no charges were filed.^[39][47]

The police report of this 2006 investigation was the one eventually obtained by In Touch Weekly in 2015. After the initial reporting on the redacted police report, an unidentified victim, reportedly still a minor, requested that any remaining products of the investigation be destroyed.^[48][49] Judge Stacey Zimmerman granted this request to protect that person's privacy.^[49][50]

[Selene]

Thanks.

I need to confirm something with a friend of mine.

However, I am reasonably sure that minors records are sealed and in this particular specific type of crime, the seal is virtually impossible to acquire with a FOIL, or, OPRA request.

My gut tells me someone got bribed to violate that seal.

A...