merjet Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 NYSE re-opens but cause of glitch not yet revealed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 NYSE re-opens but cause of glitch not yet revealedNYThttp://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/09/business/dealbook/new-york-stock-exchange-suspends-trading.html?emc=edit_na_20150708&nlid=53564225&ref=cta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 8, 2015 Author Share Posted July 8, 2015 Several of the responders on this thread have been proven correct. Way to go. What a difference a day makes. Now based on your success and the SUPPOSED reason for the US stock market shrugging what will happen tomorrow?I don't know. I don't gamble. I only invest in my own business because I know it always turns a decent profit on my investment regardless of economic or political conditions.However, I do know that the climax to this confluence of events will occur on September 13th this year.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 11, 2015 Author Share Posted July 11, 2015 Here one confirmation that the US debt situation is WORSE than in 2008...http://cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/cbo-debt-headed-103-gdp-level-seen-only-wwii-no-way-predict-whetherLive long enough and you get to see stupid people doing exactly the same stupid things over and over and over and over and...It's high time to fleece the dumb suckers again. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Here one confirmation that the US debt situation is WORSE than in 2008...http://cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/cbo-debt-headed-103-gdp-level-seen-only-wwii-no-way-predict-whetherLive long enough and you get to see stupid people doing exactly the same stupid things over and over and over and over and...It's high time to fleece the dumb suckers again. Gregoops wrong thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Private debt is a problem, not Federal public as such. Just make more dollars to pay it. Now, if no one wants to buy Federal debt because the interest rates are too low, just buyer raise the rates at the regular auction until the buyers come in. It happens all the time--this isn't even monetization which is the next step up--every time if you include lowering or maintaining a rate too. The main problem is rates going up meaning private debt rates (for corporate bonds) go up making that debt more expensive to serve and create. Not a problem for the Feds; they'll simply sell all they need to sell to get the money they want. If they want money that no one has they'll monetize--that is, push a button making a bank account they issue checks against to pay any bills they want to or need to. The biggest joke is the Wall Street worry that a little rate increase by the Federal Reserve will dry up liquidity for borrowing to support stock prices. It would take more than a little. But the Fed, as I said, has no real control on interest rates. The bond market does. All the Fed does is get the lowest possible market interest rate because T-Bills are perceived to be without risk, beyond the risk of the bond price subsequently going down as interest rates go up, for it's the principal itself that is risk judged at the time of purchase in either the primary or secondary markets.Now, when it comes to monetization it may be used somewhat to control interest rates. This is the exception to what I said above.That is, if the Fed doesn't want rates to go up it will monetize to keep equivalent value T-Bills out of the market keeping the supply lower so what money is chasing those bonds will have to pay more than true market value (lower interest rate) and the true market value is thus grossly distorted making money too cheap feeding unsustainable business models carrying too much debt and mal-investments in businesses which cannot withstand debt service when interest rates go up--which is why the Fed will monetize when strictly speaking it doesn't have to. This is the Fed equivalent of holding your breath, but it need only breathe every few years or so. When it does, though, it could cause a recession or worse.--Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 11, 2015 Author Share Posted July 11, 2015 This is the Fed equivalent of holding your breath, but it need only breath every few years or so. When it does, though, it could cause a recession or worse.No one escapes the inevitable consequences of violating economic law:Not people... and certainly not government they created in their own fiscally irresponsible image.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Why do you assume they want to escape? That's your implicit claim. Every choice has a price. It is frequently hard or difficult to see what the price will be, but choices will be made regardless. The objective consequences will be subjectively experienced and value evaluated by those affected. The outside observer can wag his tongue and shake his finger and be objectively right even, but not get into the heads of the actors, only suppose to. An extreme example would be a long-term inmate being released from prison and tries to get back in. Some inmates go in and out of prison so much one is a vacation from the other.--Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 11, 2015 Author Share Posted July 11, 2015 Why do you assume they want to escape?People always believe they can escape causality.Those who borrow money believing in the fantasy that there's no tomorrow......are always blindsided by reality when tomorrow arrives. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why do you assume they want to escape?People always believe they can escape causality.Those who borrow money believing in the fantasy that there's no tomorrow......are always blindsided by reality when tomorrow arrives. GregI have borrowed money and I have repaid the loans. What is the big deal. Normal business requires credit to even out the disparity between the need for money and its availability. People have been borrowing, lending and repaying loans for over 10,000 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why do you assume they want to escape?People always believe they can escape causality.Those who borrow money believing in the fantasy that there's no tomorrow......are always blindsided by reality when tomorrow arrives. GregI have borrowed money and I have repaid the loans. (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society. Some people have more cash than they can use at times, other people have less. Borrowing evens out the money, puts it in motion and helps to keep the pot boiling. It is called business. Without loans, the Interstate Highway System would not have been built. Without loans no earth man would have walked on the Moon in the 20 th century. Without loans I would have been doomed to pay rent for 45 years. Now I own my house outright except for the property taxes I am compelled to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society. Some people have more cash than they can use at times, other people have less. Borrowing evens out the money, puts it in motion and helps to keep the pot boiling. It is called business. Without loans, the Interstate Highway System would not have been built. Without loans no earth man would have walked on the Moon in the 20 th century. Without loans I would have been doomed to pay rent for 45 years. Now I own my house outright except for the property taxes I am compelled to pay.Greg attacked you in lieu of simply repeating himself. Repeating is his superficial favorite. Deep down he's an argumentum ad hominem man who hardly ever engages in a real give and take discussion. "Never" might be truer than "hardly ever" except when talking about his water system. Regardless, we're all walking around displaying ourselves, but for some reason the females find it off-putting and don't stick around. What does it mean? We aren't reproducing. We are going to go the way of the Shakers. If you make children you can make Objectivists. This is the real problem. We guys simply need to go grab some gals by the hair and drag them into our caves. Problem solved!--Brantif Ayn Rand had only known . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society.Does that mean you have your own business, Bob? Debt collapses like 2001, and 2008 are also a normal part of doing business in a "market society". The present "Great Recession" is a normal part of doing business in a "market society"......a debt based "market society". I've run a successful business for 35 years without ever borrowing one cent. And because of that I've been untouched by the debt collapses of 2001 and 2008... ...and I'll be untouched by the next one in 2015 because I'm a Capitalist... not a Creditist. You people had better get ready for what's coming... and just because you feel all fat and sassy safe and secure because you're cashing government checks doesn't necessarily mean you'll be immune from it! Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Some farmers still leave patches of corn and other commodities in the fields for the human gleaners or for the geese. I think our nature is to trade surpluses using barter or the promise to repay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 Some farmers still leave patches of corn and other commodities in the fields for the human gleaners or for the geese. I think our nature is to trade surpluses using barter or the promise to repay.That's a far cry from living on credit cards, home lines of equity, student loans, and cashing government benefits checks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Some farmers still leave patches of corn and other commodities in the fields for the human gleaners or for the geese. I think our nature is to trade surpluses using barter or the promise to repay.That's a far cry from living on credit cards, home lines of equity, student loans, and cashing government benefits checks! An interest payment to far ... a sequel to that WWII bridge thingy ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 Some farmers still leave patches of corn and other commodities in the fields for the human gleaners or for the geese. I think our nature is to trade surpluses using barter or the promise to repay.That's a far cry from living on credit cards, home lines of equity, student loans, and cashing government benefits checks! An interest payment to far ... a sequel to that WWII bridge thingy ...It's ironic, the government debt to GDP ratio today hasn't been this high since just after WWII.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society.Does that mean you have your own business, Bob? Debt collapses like 2001, and 2008 are also a normal part of doing business in a "market society". The present "Great Recession" is a normal part of doing business in a "market society"......a debt based "market society". I've run a successful business for 35 years without ever borrowing one cent. And because of that I've been untouched by the debt collapses of 2001 and 2008... ...and I'll be untouched by the next one in 2015 because I'm a Capitalist... not a Creditist. You people had better get ready for what's coming... and just because you feel all fat and sassy safe and secure because you're cashing government checks doesn't necessarily mean you'll be immune from it! GregWhen the government checks stop so will everything else and your debts will be effectively wiped out too. Then you better have real, usable assets like food, guns, water and the ability to turn your starving, begging neighbors away.--Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 The ability and the will Brant. A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society.Does that mean you have your own business, Bob? Debt collapses like 2001, and 2008 are also a normal part of doing business in a "market society". The present "Great Recession" is a normal part of doing business in a "market society"......a debt based "market society". I've run a successful business for 35 years without ever borrowing one cent. And because of that I've been untouched by the debt collapses of 2001 and 2008... ...and I'll be untouched by the next one in 2015 because I'm a Capitalist... not a Creditist. You people had better get ready for what's coming... and just because you feel all fat and sassy safe and secure because you're cashing government checks doesn't necessarily mean you'll be immune from it! GregWhen the government checks stop so will everything else and your debts will be effectively wiped out too. Then you better have real, usable assets like food, guns, water and the ability to turn your starving, begging neighbors away.--BrantThe possibility of green double zero coming up on the wheel while everyone is betting red and black always exists. I already live like it's green double zero every day, so it doesn't make any difference to me. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaalChatzaf Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society.Does that mean you have your own business, Bob? Debt collapses like 2001, and 2008 are also a normal part of doing business in a "market society". The present "Great Recession" is a normal part of doing business in a "market society"......a debt based "market society". I've run a successful business for 35 years without ever borrowing one cent. And because of that I've been untouched by the debt collapses of 2001 and 2008... ...and I'll be untouched by the next one in 2015 because I'm a Capitalist... not a Creditist. You people had better get ready for what's coming... and just because you feel all fat and sassy safe and secure because you're cashing government checks doesn't necessarily mean you'll be immune from it! GregI needed a house before I had enough money to buy the house. I borrowed it. The house was collateral for the debt. I paid off the mortgage, the house was mine. No problem. Very few people have the money to buy a house when they need a house the most (married and children etc.). I see no great problem in incurring such a debt. The loan is secured by the house. And there is plenty of time to earn the money to pay off the loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 The possibility of green double zero coming up on the wheel while everyone is betting red and black always exists. I already live like it's green double zero every day, so it doesn't make any difference to me. GregGood example, however a player can still bet on OO green, a better illustration of your house wins double green is that in Blackjack the ties go to the dealer/house.Studio will know the gambling numbers cold.A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Galt gultch: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (shrug) So what?Do you want a pat the head? GregFor doing what I should? No. I just point out borrowing and repaying is a normal part of doing business in a market society.Does that mean you have your own business, Bob? Debt collapses like 2001, and 2008 are also a normal part of doing business in a "market society". The present "Great Recession" is a normal part of doing business in a "market society"......a debt based "market society". I've run a successful business for 35 years without ever borrowing one cent. And because of that I've been untouched by the debt collapses of 2001 and 2008... ...and I'll be untouched by the next one in 2015 because I'm a Capitalist... not a Creditist. You people had better get ready for what's coming... and just because you feel all fat and sassy safe and secure because you're cashing government checks doesn't necessarily mean you'll be immune from it! GregI needed a house before I had enough money to buy the house. I borrowed it. The house was collateral for the debt. I paid off the mortgage, the house was mine. No problem. Very few people have the money to buy a house when they need a house the most (married and children etc.). I see no great problem in incurring such a debt. The loan is secured by the house. And there is plenty of time to earn the money to pay off the loan.Greg sees debt in moral terms. You see it in practical economic ones. You're talking past each other.--BrantGreg will say the moral is the practical, like Ayn Rand (or any good Objectivist would), but debt per se is not immoral; this country was build on massive amounts of debt and much of the lent capital was destroyed even as it was deployed--that is capital changed ownership as in deployment of wages that fed millions of workers or the re-assignment of assets in bankruptcies, but capital used that way is just sperm chasing the egg and babies result that grow into robust adults so don't be dismayed or even put off by Gregg's understanding of his success which is at least 50% correct anyway (it doesn't matter if he over-generalizes here [he does] and elsewhere--just parse his generalizations) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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