moralist Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 An illegal immigrant who had been deported 5 times and who had even been arrested but not turned over to immigration authorities because San Francisco is a "Sanctuary City"......murdered a woman.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3149706/Family-Californian-woman-shot-dead-random-illegal-Mexican-immigrant-deported-FIVE-TIMES-condemn-officials-let-stay.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 An illegal immigrant who had been deported 5 times and who had even been arrested but not turned over to immigration authorities because San Francisco is a "Sanctuary City"......murdered a woman.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3149706/Family-Californian-woman-shot-dead-random-illegal-Mexican-immigrant-deported-FIVE-TIMES-condemn-officials-let-stay.htmlOne would think a Federal prosecutor would indict the Mayor and the City Council for being accessories before the fact that directly contributed to this murder.A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 (edited) I'm waiting for a Federal prosecutor to indict Janel Reno and Eric Holder and indict a few other Federal prosecutors too. Could start here, however, for practice (edit: but won't [see Greg])--Brantnow, about the IRS . . . Edited July 6, 2015 by Brant Gaede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 6, 2015 Author Share Posted July 6, 2015 An illegal immigrant who had been deported 5 times and who had even been arrested but not turned over to immigration authorities because San Francisco is a "Sanctuary City"......murdered a woman.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3149706/Family-Californian-woman-shot-dead-random-illegal-Mexican-immigrant-deported-FIVE-TIMES-condemn-officials-let-stay.htmlOne would think a Federal prosecutor would indict the Mayor and the City Council for being accessories before the fact that directly contributed to this murder.A...Never gonna happen, Adam...San Francisco is completely controlled by the same liberal Democrats who "compassionately" declared it a "Sanctuary City". Los Angeles is also a completely liberal Democrat controlled Sanctuary City.This is just one more of the many reasons why not to live in a city.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 An illegal immigrant who had been deported 5 times and who had even been arrested but not turned over to immigration authorities because San Francisco is a "Sanctuary City"......murdered a woman.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3149706/Family-Californian-woman-shot-dead-random-illegal-Mexican-immigrant-deported-FIVE-TIMES-condemn-officials-let-stay.htmlOne would think a Federal prosecutor would indict the Mayor and the City Council for being accessories before the fact that directly contributed to this murder.A...Never gonna happen, Adam...San Francisco is completely controlled by the same liberal Democrats who "compassionately" declared it a "Sanctuary City". Los Angeles is also a completely liberal Democrat controlled Sanctuary City.This is just one more of the many reasons why not to live in a city.GregGreg, I know your arguments as well as you do.I would greatly appreciate it if you just skipped regurgitating them as answers to my posts.Thanks.A...it just gets boring and you are better than that and should be more selective... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 Is it because you live in a city, Adam? Sorry for the reminder that your idea will never happen.In the future I won't quote you when posting.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 The perfect storm for victims is the combination of a liberal controlled sanctuary city with "gun free" zones. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 The perfect storm for victims is the combination of a liberal controlled sanctuary city with "gun free" zones. GregGreg, I know San Francisco well. When I made that statement about what should happen, I know full well it is not going to happen in that city.We agree.A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrakusos Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 An illegal immigrant who had been deported 5 times and who had even been arrested but not turned over to immigration authorities because San Francisco is a "Sanctuary City"......murdered a woman.Taking that at face value, it is fallacious on several grounds. First, few illegal immigrants commit any crimes. Second, the man had been arrested for non-violent crimes, selling marijuana, notably. Whatever the genesis of Francisco Sanchez's horrible crime, neither his status as an illegal, nor his prior arrests are related to it. The Daily Mail article brought us revealing details about Kathryn Steinle. Her death was a tragedy. But whether she was privileged or poor is irrelevant to her death. Making it political is wrong. Do you assert any of these claims, which are similar to yours?Bernie Madoff was a Jew, therefore Jews are swindlers.Whitey Bulger was Irish, therefore Irish are violent.Sixty-five percent of men in prison are African-American, but African-Americans comprise only 13% of the population. Therefore, African-Americans are five times more likely to be criminals than White people. Therefore, we need to control Black people more closely. The crime occurred in San Francisco, a town famous for its huge homosexual population, therefore, homosexuals cause crime.Let me be explicit: No connection exists between her death and his status as an immigrant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 I did not connect the murder to illegal immigration itself, Michael... but to the connected to the fact that when he was arrested, he was NOT turned over to immigration to be deported because San Francisco was declared to be a "Sanctuary City" by the liberal Democrats.The murder was allowed by the failure to deport.Liberal Democrat controlled California literally imports South American poverty through lax illegal immigration policies and huge government benefits programs. As the poverty capital of the US... out of the population of 38 million people, nearly 25%, or 8.9 million are living at or below the poverty level as reported by the Census Bureau. This is why you'll never find me living in the city. I'm way out at the edge on the border between rural and open unpopulated land.California is on the cutting edge of the future of America. If you want to see where America is headed... look at California. It has one party liberal Democrat rule with a liberal Democrat Governor and liberal Democrat majorities in both houses of Congress (26/14 Senate 52/28 House).. The liberal Democrat public sector employee unions have a lock on the state.It is rated as having the most hostile business climate in the nation.http://calwatchdog.com/2014/05/12/u-s-ceos-again-call-california-most-hostile-to-business/Whatever happens in California... the liberal Democrats OWN it.I tell you... this place is right out of Atlas Shrugged! Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Taking that at face value, it is fallacious on several grounds. First, few illegal immigrants commit any crimes. When MM is right, you can take that to the bank...well depends on your definition of bank and crime ....Search 8 U.S.C. § 1325 : US Code - Section 1325: Improper entry by alien - See more at: http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1325#sthash.m4Z4r4eM.dpuf(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both. (b) Improper time or place; civil penalties Any alien who is apprehended while entering (or attempting to enter) the United States at a time or place other than as designated by immigration officers shall be subject to a civil penalty of - (1) at least $50 and not more than $250 for each such entry (or attempted entry); or (2) twice the amount specified in paragraph (1) in the case of an alien who has been previously subject to a civil penalty under this subsection. Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be imposed. © Marriage fraud Any individual who knowingly enters into a marriage for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or fined not more than $250,000, or both. (d) Immigration-related entrepreneurship fraud Any individual who knowingly establishes a commercial enterprise for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, fined in accordance with title 18, or both. - See more at: http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/8/12/II/VIII/1325#sthash.m4Z4r4eM.dpuf Guess this means they committed a crime...A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 He obviously means what he did not say. You just gave him an English lesson in precision in thought and language. The actual amount and nature of any crime once they are in country is of more interest than the crime of entry*, which is a given**.--Brant*at least to me**at least to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 First, few illegal immigrants commit any crimes.Yep...seems like a few more than few in just the last few days...A six-time-deported illegal immigrant is charged in the felony hit-and-run of an Arizona mother and her two young children. The man allegedly admitted to being high on marijuana while causing the severe lacerations to a five-year-old boy. The five-year-old and a two-year-old were both taken to an area hospital.This tragedy comes within one week of two separate incidents involving previously deported illegal immigrants allegedly murdering women in two U.S. states: California and Texas. The California case involved a young woman in San Fransisco taking photos with her father on a pier when an illegal immigrant who had been deported five time prior allegedly murdered her. The Texas case involved an illegal immigrant who had been deported four time prior. Police say the man admitted to murdering his wife with a hammer.The Arizona hit-and-run case was first reported by inMaricopa.com, with a headline that simply asserted: “2 children injured in Papago crash.” The illegal immigrant is named Manuel Perez-Vasquez.Maybe this is just a glitch...although he was a six time criminal for starters...http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/07/07/illegal-immigrant-deported-6-times-charged-in-felony-hit-and-run-of-family-that-injured-young-children/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Hmmm more crime less truth?Following the influx of illegal immigrant minors from Central America, an official at the federal agency charged with protecting public health describes Barack Obama as “the worst pres we have ever had,” an “amateur” and “Marxist,” according to internal emails obtained by Judicial Watch.JW got the records as part of an investigation into the Center for Disease Control’s (CDC) activation of an Emergency Operations Center (EOC) to deal with the barrage of illegal alien minors last summer. Tens of thousands of Central Americans came into the United States through the Mexican border and contagious diseases—many considered to be eradicated in the U.S.—became a tremendous concern. The CDC, which operates under the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), responded by opening an emergency facility designed to monitor and coordinate response activities to eminent public health threats.When few is many, many want to stop the few from spreading disease.MM, ya think this is a good idea?A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 Now the blameshifting begins...http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2015/07/06/sf-sheriff-mirkarimi-pier-14-murder-could-happen-in-any-u-s-city-ice-needs-to-step-up/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Hmmm more crime less truth?Following [...]A... From whence came this quoat, please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikee Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Hmmm more crime less truth?Following [...]A...From whence came this quoat, please?http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2015/07/cdc-official-calls-obama-worst-president-amateur-marxist-after-influx-of-illegal-alien-minors/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Hmmm more crime less truth?Following [...]A...From whence came this quoat, please?http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2015/07/cdc-official-calls-obama-worst-president-amateur-marxist-after-influx-of-illegal-alien-minors/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) [from http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2015/07/cdc-official-calls-obama-worst-president-amateur-marxist-after-influx-of-illegal-alien-minors/ ]Tens of thousands of Central Americans came into the United States through the Mexican border and contagious diseases—many considered to be eradicated in the U.S.—became a tremendous concern. The CDC, which operates under the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), responded by opening an emergency facility designed to monitor and coordinate response activities to eminent public health threats. When few is many, many want to stop the few from spreading disease.As well they should. Many many few.I was curious about the 'contagious diseases' phrase, that many diseases considered to be eradicated in the US became a tremendous concern to the CDC. Or, er, an eminent threat ...It turns out that the underlying claims or concerns came in a letter from a Georgia Congressman to the US Center for Disease Control. From Judicial Watch's article Illegal Alien Minors Spreading TB, Dengue, Swine Flu :The hordes of illegal immigrant minors entering the U.S. are bringing serious diseases—including swine flu, dengue fever, possibly Ebola virus and tuberculosis—that present a danger to the American public as well as the Border Patrol agents forced to care for the kids, according to a U.S. Congressman who is also medical doctor.This has created a “severe and dangerous” crisis, says the Georgia lawmaker, Phil Gingrey. Most of the Unaccompanied Alien Children (UAC) are coming from Central America and they’re importing infectious diseases considered to be largely eradicated in this country. Additionally, many of the migrants lack basic vaccinations such as those to prevent chicken pox or measles, leaving America’s young children and the elderly particularly susceptible, Gingrey reveals.In a hard-hitting letter to the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), Congressman Gingrey demands that the agency keep Americans informed about its plan to handle the growing public health crisis posed by the influx of minors. “As the unaccompanied children continue to be transported to shelters around the country on commercial airlines and other forms of transportation, I have serious concerns that the diseases carried by these children may begin to spread too rapidly to control,” the congressman writes. “In fact, as you undoubtedly know, some of these diseases have no known cure.”The hard-hitting letter can be found in PDF format at the JW site ...So, if I understand the chain of claims correctly, a Congressman cries Ebola! Dengue Fever! No Cure! ... and then Judicial Watch includes his sentiments in a news blurb, carefully transferring the Congressman's concerns to the CDC, and then wrapping it up with some internal Adam Selene-style "Marxism" bows ...So, in the end, has no-cure Dengue and Ebola been found in any of the hordes? It's hard to know, perhaps. Sometimes it is better to be an alarmist.Highlights from the letter:infectious diseases remain in the top ten causes of death in the United Statesreports of illegal migrants carrying deadly diseases such as swine flu, dengue fever, Ebola virus, and tuberculosis are particularly concerningReports have indicated that several border agents have contracted diseases through contact with the unaccompanied minors. I have serious concerns that the diseases carried by these children may begin to spread too rapidly to controlI think activation of the EOC is an important step in recognizing the severe and dangerous nature of this crisis I firmly believe the public deserves to know the specific actions the EOC and other departments of the CDC are taking to combat and prevent the spread of communicable diseases. I strongly feel that the public should be notified of this riskI am curious about the Dengue Fever. The CDC has an interactive World Dengue Alert page, that shows the menace in several ways. This is a screenshot of the map showing the continental USA, parts of Mexico and the Caribbean.There are two spots/alerts noted in the USA. It turns out that both Alerts mention that the particular mosquito that can transmit Dengue viruses has been found in Hayward California. The second element of the Alert mentions a Malaysian outbreak and urges traveler caution.I wonder if the risk of catching Dengue in Mexico as a traveler is greater than the risk of catching Dengue from mosquito that has fed on a Mexican unaccompanied minor under the care of HHS/CDC?Who knows? Should one be skeptical of alarmism or pile on? Should the USA screen all citizens returning from Dengue hotspots?I hesitate to include a link to a skeptical news story, but in the interest of 'balance' I must. Here is a tale from NBC that tends to disbelieve 'reports' of infection ... Vectors or Victims? Docs Slam Rumors That Migrants Carry Disease. The story goes on about false rumours and "hysteria," but those are probably just liberal code-words for Trump.See also the lone Marxist at Forbes giving the former Congressmen a spanking. Edited July 7, 2015 by william.scherk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Had you attended one of my courses on Rhetoric/persuasion, you would know, or, at least understand that you have to get your selected audience's attention.A rhetorical trope of exaggeration/hyperbole is used in both Deliberative and Judicial oratory.Enter Style...Style concerns the artful expression of ideas. If invention addresses what is to be said; style addresses how this will be said. From a rhetorical perspective style is not incidental, superficial, or supplementary: style names how ideas are embodied in language and customized to communicative contexts (see Content / Form).Without more information about the letter writer, I would see this as raising a general alarm and using the mysterious fever as a meme works real well to get people's attention.Now if I knew that he had collaborated on the photo shopped fraudulent photo of the Polar Bear on the small ice floe, that would cause me to be very suspicious of his statements now.You know, like the hockey stick dude...A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) Thanks, Adam, for pointing out there was no explicit mention of the Trump remarks about diseases flowing across the border from Mexico. You are right to point to a dangling connection; I will add a link back to "tremendous infectious disease is pouring across the border."Your style notes are cribbed from Gaud Noes Wear, but hey. I think you are making several points and smudging them into one. It is hard to tease apart condescending waffle from what is cogent to my discussion above. On to the dance of the veils regarding former Congressman Whosit and his letter to the CDC. You apparently would take his letter seriously, or not, if he was an editor at Science, or an employee at Istockphoto or wielded a hockey stick. Then you might, or might not. You do not do any independent investigation of truth claims, because that is mumble finger-wag blah. Or something. I deduce that you are borrowing from the Telegraph's former reigning anti-agua guy, the journalist James Delingpole. He had a sneery fit in 2010 about a polar bear photo:Did you ever see a more moving picture? (Well, apart from all the other moving pictures involving polar bears). What particularly moves me is how wafer thin that ice is and how oh-so-far it is from land. Weep, oh readers, weep for the terrible plight of poor Ursus maritimus, the bear we all helped kill because of our selfish refusal to change our lifestyles! (Hat tip: Philippe Monthoux)Well, anyway that's what 255 members of America's National Academy of Sciences want you to believe. The floating Polie was used to illustrate a letter they've just had printed in Science magazine in which they whinge about the McCarthy-esque persecution they've been suffering at the hands of those evil truth-seeking types who so unfairly think it's wrong of scientists to lie and embezzle grant money and fake data and exaggerate risks and hide evidence and bully rival scientists into silence.We are deeply disturbed by the recent escalation of political assaults on scientists in general and on climate scientists in particular. All citizens should understand some basic scientific facts. There is always some uncertainty associated with scientific conclusions; science never absolutely proves anything. When someone says that society should wait until scientists are absolutely certain before taking any action, it is the same as saying society should never take action. For a problem as potentially catastrophic as climate change, taking no action poses a dangerous risk for our planet.I wonder if they approach their scientific research with the same rigour and integrity which went into their picture research. The polar bear photo can be found at Istockphoto. Here is the description:A polar bear managed to get on one of the last ice floes floating in the Arctic sea. Due to global warming the natural environment of the polar bear in the Arctic has changed a lot. The Arctic sea has much less ice than it had some years ago. (This images is a photoshop design. Polarbear, ice floe, ocean and sky are real, they were just not together in the way they are now)If any non-mind-readers wonder about the kerfuffle beyond the Telegraph and Adam's dance of the veils, you can read the letter to Science here. I post the correction notice published at the time:Science 7 May 2010: vol. 328 no. 5979 pp. 689-690 DOI: 10.1126/science.328.5979.689Climate Change and the Integrity of Science P. H. Gleick et al.CorrectionDue to an editorial error, the original image associated with this Letter was not a photograph but a collage. The image was selected by the editors, and it was a mistake to have used it. The original image has been replaced in the online HTML and PDF versions of the article with an unaltered photograph from National Geographic.The original image published in error can be seen here (credit: iStockphoto.com). Now, how to connect Trump, diseases raging across the southern border, Delingpole, Bears & Doms, Science and hockey-sticks? Well, by reading between the lines. Here's what I think Style King Rhetorical Waffle housekeeper is attempting to say:-- if Congressman Whosit had written a letter to Science with a stock picture of a bear, I would mistrust him. But since he didn't I have no opinion. If he was named James Hansen, of course, I would know that everything he wrote was utter and complete bullshit because I read anti-agua materials, and I used to have a class on Dancing With Veils. And Trump.As always, Adam, I appreciate your attempts to poison the well and score own goals and take quoats from Gaud Noes Wear. Edited July 7, 2015 by william.scherk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Ah, a feud! Right here on OL. I'm too old to join in, but pass the popcorn!--Brantsame thing happens with basketball--I'm to old, but . . .soon I'll be too old to be President and save the world!goodbye world--in case I outlast you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william.scherk Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) Ah, a feud! Right here on OL. I'm too old to join in, but pass the popcorn!--Brantsame thing happens with basketball--I'm to old, but . . .soon I'll be too old to be President and save the world!goodbye world--in case I outlast you President Trump will build a wall to keep the feuding disputants separate. He will call it The Forty-Ninth Parallel. As Ann Coulter might say, since the Supremes have ratified ACA, it's time to move to Canada (where they have single-payer socialized medicine). Best hurry before the Wall goes up. Edited July 8, 2015 by william.scherk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Sorry to disappoint you Brant. However, William insists on making personal attacks and unsubtle statements like "cribs." This is what I taught and is Aristotelian in nature. I have recommended this site the http://humanities.byu.edu/rhetoric/sIilva.htm I think William commented on how nice the site is. I stand by my arguments and can back them up. However, I will back up what I choose to back up. So, unfortunately, open some Tequila and invite the neighborhood illegal alien in for an illegal party, as we know from Last Tango In Paris, butter is multifunctional. A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Ah, a feud! Right here on OL. I'm too old to join in, but pass the popcorn!--Brantsame thing happens with basketball--I'm to old, but . . .soon I'll be too old to be President and save the world!goodbye world--in case I outlast you President Trump will build a wall to keep the feuding disputants separate. He will call it The Forty-Ninth Parallel. As Ann Coulter might say, since the Supremes have ratified ACA, it's time to move to Canada (where they have single-payer socialized medicine). Best hurry before the Wall goes up.Gee. No F-16s? How are you going to defend yourself from the Colossus of the South?No wonder you guys are so nice to us.--Brantnice airplanes, looks like fun--did they have permission to enter US airspace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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