Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Bullet points on colonial America and cultural contextMassachusetts Puritan slave trading began in 1637 http://slavenorth.com/massachusetts.htmWilliam Penn and Quakers owned slaves http://www.quaker.org/wmpenn.html (paragraph 4)Ben Franklin owned slaves http://www.benjaminfranklinhouse.org/site/sections/about_franklin/Issue%205%20Spring-Summer%20200%20Benjamin%20Franklin%20and%20Slavery.pdfJefferson says deport negroes http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433081883005;view=1up;seq=154 http://founders.archives.gov/documents/Jefferson/98-01-02-4020Slavery was source of Jackson's wealth http://thehermitage.com/learn/mansion-grounds/slavery/Lincoln favors deportation of negroes http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v13/v13n5p-4_Morgan.htmlDred Scott v. Sandford, "altogether unfit to associate with the white race"Debates in the Federal Convention"The morality or wisdom of slavery are considerations belonging to the states themselves." (Ellsworth)"If slavery be wrong, it is justified by the example of all the world." (Pinckney)"Southern States could not be members of the Union, if slavery be rejected." (Williamson)"The subject should be considered in a political light only." (King)"The people of those states will never be such fools as to give up so important an interest." (Rutledge)"Two states might be lost to the Union" (Randolph)My writings on the subject:To put things in perspective, please consider that among the 3,317,000 people in the newly-organized United States of America, less than 20% could vote. Slightly more than half of these voters consented to the new form of government. A total of 142 electors were chosen to represent The People during the first presidential election. George Washington was selected by 69 of them... If anyone or anything is "sovereign", it is each individual man, woman, and child, who is presumed to be endowed by nature with an equal right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Significantly, these principles, although prominently featured in the Declaration of Independence, somehow never found their way into the U.S. Constitution. Human rights were all well and good when there was an external tyrant, but when the Founding Fathers turned their attention to establishing their own brand of sovereignty, it was no longer expedient to speak in terms of natural justice. [Laissez Faire Law, pp.18-19]Every Fourth of July, my fellow countrymen celebrate the mistaken notion that the United States was conceived in liberty. This reveals how little our constitutional history is studied. The U.S. Constitution was not conceived at all — it was a bastard product of compromise and contentious debate, winning ratification by a slim margin among the 20 percent of colonial population who were eligible to vote for assemblies of state politicians who narrowly approved it... The U.S. Constitution did not provide any definition of justice. [Constitution of Government in Galt's Gulch, p.122] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf:Anyone who has even done a rudimentary examination of American history would be aware of the limited franchise and the fact that compromises were made.Was this somehow, with your knowledge of human nature a surprise to you?Secondly, the Thanksgiving story of the original Bradford Colony is a stirring story of survival, free enterprise and courage.A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Thanksgiving story of the original Bradford Colony is a stirring story of survival, free enterprise and courage.I guess so. Squanto saved them http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-miracle-of-squantos-path-to-plymouth-1448406073 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Not to change the subject too radically, of all the places I've lived and worked, Australia was best. (don't watch the pix, just listen to the tune, if you haven't heard it before) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:Bullet points on colonial America and cultural contextMassachusetts Puritan slave trading began in 1637 http://slavenorth.co...ssachusetts.htmWilliam Penn and Quakers owned slaves http://www.quaker.org/wmpenn.html (paragraph 4)Ben Franklin owned slaves http://www.benjaminf...and Slavery.pdfJefferson says deport negroes http://babel.hathitr...iew=1up;seq=154 http://founders.arch...n/98-01-02-4020Slavery was source of Jackson's wealth http://thehermitage....rounds/slavery/Lincoln favors deportation of negroes http://www.ihr.org/j...p-4_Morgan.htmlDred Scott v. Sandford, "altogether unfit to associate with the white race"None of those invalidate the exceptional nation that was created......the fruits of which are still savored today by those who live by American values.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:Bullet points on colonial America and cultural context•Massachusetts Puritan slave trading began in 1637 http://slavenorth.co...ssachusetts.htm•William Penn and Quakers owned slaves http://www.quaker.org/wmpenn.html (paragraph 4)•Ben Franklin owned slaves http://www.benjaminf...and Slavery.pdf•Jefferson says deport negroes http://babel.hathitr...iew=1up;seq=154 http://founders.arch...n/98-01-02-4020•Slavery was source of Jackson's wealth http://thehermitage....rounds/slavery/•Lincoln favors deportation of negroes http://www.ihr.org/j...p-4_Morgan.html•Dred Scott v. Sandford, "altogether unfit to associate with the white race"None of those invalidate the exceptional nation that was created......the fruits of which are still savored today by those who live by American values. Sure. "Trouble is, most humans prefer fantasies." [comment at Zero Hedge]Read em and weep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catpop Posted November 26, 2015 Author Share Posted November 26, 2015 One of the most troubling things I notice these days, is that emotions tend to take presidence over facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 One of the most troubling things I notice these days, is that emotions tend to take presidence over facts.Emotions are the water of the human river. Sometimes they overflow the rational banks (if there are any).That's a fact. Respect that. These days are the old days.--Brantthings are getting better (the future's so bright, I gotta wear shades)https://youtu.be/8qrriKcwvlY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:Sure.You didn't read what I said, Wolf..."None of those invalidate the exceptional nation that was created......the fruits of which are still savored today BY THOSE WHO LIVE BY AMERICAN VALUES.."Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:Sure.You didn't read what I said, Wolf..."None of those invalidate the exceptional nation that was created......the fruits of which are still savored today BY THOSE WHO LIVE BY AMERICAN VALUES.."No way. If you abstracted yourself from the rest of America, fine. But 300 million suckers are on the hook for American values that reward people who don't work and penalize those who do. Higher ed is a toxic dump burning $1 trillion a year, producing Obama clones. 250,000 jobs were lost this year in oil services, because demand collapsed. Your exceptional nation is long gone past the point of no return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:Sure.You didn't read what I said, Wolf..."None of those invalidate the exceptional nation that was created......the fruits of which are still savored today BY THOSE WHO LIVE BY AMERICAN VALUES.."No way. If you abstracted yourself from the rest of America, fine. But 300 million suckers are on the hook for 'American values' that reward people who don't work and penalize those who do. Higher ed is a toxic dump burning $1 trillion a year, producing Obama clones. 250,000 jobs were lost this year in oil services, because demand collapsed. Your exceptional nation is long gone past the point of no return.The exceptional people within her are not my friend...As an individual, I am not, nor do I work with the enemy to advance their ends...A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes:No way. If you abstracted yourself from the rest of America, fine.Because I'm an American, what I abstract myself from is not America.But 300 million suckers are on the hook for 'American values' that reward people who don't work and penalize those who do. Higher ed is a toxic dump burning $1 trillion a year, producing Obama clones. 250,000 jobs were lost this year in oil services, because demand collapsed. Your exceptional nation is long gone past the point of no return.What others choose to do with their American freedom is their business and not mine. So if you aren't enjoying a happy prosperous meaningful life in America, you have only yourself to blame for failing to become an American because you aren't living by American values.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf DeVoon Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Bill Orton used to speak of us as The Remnant, some thousands or tens of thousands like you and Greg and me."Living free has its awkwardnesses." http://www.objectivistliving.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14458#entry211359 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 26, 2015 Share Posted November 26, 2015 Wolf writes: Your exceptional nation is long gone past the point of no return. That's just fine with me, Wolf... because I'm not going along with it. I am America. What goes past the point of no return is not America. That's just people harvesting what they planted. I plant different crops so my harvest is different. That's how to avoid becoming collateral damage from the stupidity of others. AMERICAN FREEDOM: The ability to go your own direction... ...regardless of where others go... ...or how many go there. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrakusos Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Monopolies can only persist by government decree. Businesses are free to merge, and when they get too large, natural economic forces come into play to destroy them...Do you have an example of that to offer? Computering is the most vibrant sector that I know of and IBM still survives. Moreover, the demise of DEC, Commodore, Digital Research and very manyt others had nothing to do with their growing too large but their being crushed by the conformism of huge corporations. "You cannot get fired for recommending IBM" was the by-word of computer-illiterate managers. The failures of the far superior Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, and the Macintosh to capture market share was purely a market phenomenon. It had nothing to do with the government. The market is completely amoral. If everyone chooses idiocy, then idiocy is produced better, faster, and cheaper. Take Microsoft... please, take it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Seems like you are both describing the same phenomenon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Michael writes: Do you have an example of that to offer? General Motors. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brant Gaede Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 I do believe when GM had 55 to 60 percent of the US market it was helping Ford on the side--if not Chrysler too--to stay in business if for no other reason than to hold off any anti-trust action. Each of the big three came out with quad headlights in 1958 by way of one above-board example. I read decades ago GM gave Ford management advice.Microsoft was distracted for several years by anti-trust here, and then in Europe.It's really not the damage a monopoly does respecting consumer choice and prices but how the monopoly was created and maintained. A lot of that has to do with government. We do not know what would have happened to Standard Oil if it hadn't been trust busted. That could have been a wonderful data source. (Didn't Rockefeller help save the whales?)Technology seems to be the best trust buster. No buggy whip manufacturer survived, not in any substantial sense. The auto drove horses and horse-shit off the streets of New York. No manufacturer of steam locomotives made the transition to diesel-electric. Amazon is destroying brick and mortar.--Brant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Brant writes:It's really not the damage a monopoly does respecting consumer choice and prices but how the monopoly was created and maintained.That is the salient point.Bailout RecipientsLast update: Nov. 18, 2015We're tracking where taxpayer money has gone in the ongoing bailout of the financial system. Our database accounts for both the broader $700 billion bill and the separate bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. For each entity, we provide a Net Outstanding amount, which shows how deep taxpayers are in the hole after accounting for any revenue the government has received (usually through interest or dividends). Companies that failed to repay the government and resulted in a loss are shaded red. You can see a list of those investments here. All other investments either returned a profit to the government or might still be repaid. Recipients of aid through TARPs housing programs (such as mortgage servicers and state housing orgs) received subsidies that were never intended to be repaid, so we dont mark those as losses.. Note: Subsidies are listed separately from the investment programs. So, for instance, Bank of America is listed twice both as a mortgage servicer and as a bank. Want just the numbers all in one place? See the detailed view here.https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/listThe list is way too long to post but well worth a look.Note General Motors is the standout in that the poorly run unionized liberal socialist government took a loss propping up another poorly run unionized liberal socialist dinosaur thus preventing new and better auto manufacturers from filling the vacuum.Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Brant writes:It's really not the damage a monopoly does respecting consumer choice and prices but how the monopoly was created and maintained.That is the salient point.Bailout RecipientsLast update: Nov. 18, 2015We're tracking where taxpayer money has gone in the ongoing bailout of the financial system. Our database accounts for both the broader $700 billion bill and the separate bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.For each entity, we provide a “Net Outstanding” amount, which shows how deep taxpayers are in the hole after accounting for any revenue the government has received (usually through interest or dividends).Companies that failed to repay the government and resulted in a loss are shaded red. You can see a list of those investments here. All other investments either returned a profit to the government or might still be repaid. Recipients of aid through TARP’s housing programs (such as mortgage servicers and state housing orgs) received subsidies that were never intended to be repaid, so we don’t mark those as losses..Note: Subsidies are listed separately from the investment programs. So, for instance, Bank of America is listed twice – both as a mortgage servicer and as a bank.Want just the numbers all in one place? See the detailed view here.https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/listGregThanks Greg. I will be using this in a particular Federal suit as evidence.Wasn't this the job that O'bama gave to Joe "the dumbest Vice President in history" Biden?Or, is this another job that American marxists won't do?A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moralist Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 You're welcome, Adam. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dldelancey Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Anyone who has even done a rudimentary examination of American history would be aware of the limited franchise and the fact that compromises were made.Would you consider fifth-grade social studies a "rudimentary examination of American history?" Because I don't see much of the limited franchise and compromises being addressed in my fifth-grader's lessons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted November 30, 2015 Share Posted November 30, 2015 Anyone who has even done a rudimentary examination of American history would be aware of the limited franchise and the fact that compromises were made.Would you consider fifth-grade social studies a "rudimentary examination of American history?" Because I don't see much of the limited franchise and compromises being addressed in my fifth-grader's lessons.D...Not having seen what is being addressed by the 5th grade social studies in your son's school makes it difficult to comment.Is it a "Common Core" history program in the Catholic school?A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dldelancey Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Anyone who has even done a rudimentary examination of American history would be aware of the limited franchise and the fact that compromises were made.Would you consider fifth-grade social studies a "rudimentary examination of American history?" Because I don't see much of the limited franchise and compromises being addressed in my fifth-grader's lessons.D...Not having seen what is being addressed by the 5th grade social studies in your son's school makes it difficult to comment.Is it a "Common Core" history program in the Catholic school?A...I was asking for your opinion based on prior general experience. I only have my own fifth grade experience (which I barely remember) and that of my child's fifth grade experience to judge. I honestly am not sure at what point one should be considered to have been exposed to a "rudimentary examination of American history." Perhaps that is not something one should be expected to get as part of a typical grade school curriculum?To answer your question, my son's school has only implemented Common Core in Math and English Language Arts. However, they are this year attempting to integrate more of a reading component to history which is a very Common Core-ish thing to do. I don't quite see the evidence of this reading component, but that's what they said in August. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Anyone who has even done a rudimentary examination of American history would be aware of the limited franchise and the fact that compromises were made.Would you consider fifth-grade social studies a "rudimentary examination of American history?" Because I don't see much of the limited franchise and compromises being addressed in my fifth-grader's lessons.D...Not having seen what is being addressed by the 5th grade social studies in your son's school makes it difficult to comment.Is it a "Common Core" history program in the Catholic school?A...I was asking for your opinion based on prior general experience. I only have my own fifth grade experience (which I barely remember) and that of my child's fifth grade experience to judge. I honestly am not sure at what point one should be considered to have been exposed to a "rudimentary examination of American history." Perhaps that is not something one should be expected to get as part of a typical grade school curriculum?To answer your question, my son's school has only implemented Common Core in Math and English Language Arts. However, they are this year attempting to integrate more of a reading component to history which is a very Common Core-ish thing to do. I don't quite see the evidence of this reading component, but that's what they said in August. My experience is that the Constitutional convention was covered in my 4-5-6th grade history...as well as the Civil War and the Westward expansion...Moreover we read about it in books and comics and acted it out with our toy guns. It was total immersion lol.Davy Crocket on TV, Danial Boone, the Swamp Fox ...A... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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