Objectivism, Universalism, and Absolutism

[Xray]

The more I study and ponder, the more I think that morality and story are joined at the hip.

All moral values imply a story or a story template of some sort. I can't think of one that doesn't.

In othe words, story does not just illustrate a moral value, story is tied up in the very identity of it.

Imo the story/narrative aspect adresses a crucial issue: the contextuality of moral values. The 'story' provides the context, the specific situation in which moral decisions are made, and this specific situation can influence one's moral choices.

Example: honesty is generally considered as a moral value, but when it comes to e. g. protecting a hidden person from the secret police of a dictatorial regime, lying to them - in the context of this situaton - would not be considered as 'immoral', but as a necessary means to an end: saving the life of this individual.

[Brant Gaede]

The more I study and ponder, the more I think that morality and story are joined at the hip.

All moral values imply a story or a story template of some sort. I can't think of one that doesn't.

In othe words, story does not just illustrate a moral value, story is tied up in the very identity of it.

Imo the story/narrative aspect adresses a crucial issue: the contextuality of moral values. The 'story' provides the context, the specific situation in which moral decisions are made, and this specific situation can influence one's moral choices.

Example: honesty is generally considered as a moral value, but when it comes to e. g. protecting a hidden person from the secret police of a dictatorial regime, lying to them - in the context of this situaton - would not be considered as 'immoral', but as a necessary means to an end: saving the life of this individual.

Here lying would be considered moral and honesty immoral.

--Brant

[anthony]

The more I study and ponder, the more I think that morality and story are joined at the hip.... In othe words, story does not just illustrate a moral value, story is tied up in the very identity of it.

Brother, you said a mouthful.

Seconded. Why, because nothing expounds upon reality, or a perception of reality, as does narrative.

Without "show and tell", the statement: Man is autonomous, self-directing, and self-generating - is an abstraction

that sounds good, but is rather unsatisfying in its lack of concreteness. Story supplies reality.

Which is why Rand's novels are all important. Her (and Aristotle's) metaphysics are shown in action by Roark et al.

That's what grabbed our attention - her view of the nature of reality, and of Man.

The rest, epistemology, ethics, politics and aesthetics, are all rooted in the metaphysics. A metaphysics that

I consider badly misunderstood, and often over-looked. Very tellingly, too, I think ignored and hated/feared by some.

The Story either fits one's preconception of 'real' reality, or it doesn't. There's no half-way. Some readers of

particularly The Fountainhead will instantaneously grasp and approve of Rand's metaphysics (without even knowing

the meaning of the word, at that stage, possibly), while for others the narrative will merely be another literal tale of part

of one man's life. .

If the Story does not 'work' for you, all the rest of the philosophy is meaningless.

[Brant Gaede]

We've all got stories and the abstractions and reasoning etc. that fit or not and it all depends on what we do about it all. Rand's novels are so powerful they tend to displace stories which may or may not, in whole or part, be re-established, sometimes with resentment sometimes with gratitude and sometimes with I-don't-know-what-and you-don't-know-what because there are too many whos and whats. To Honor(ing) the Self we have to do it. Somehow individualism actually got lost in Objectivism.

--Brant

[Selene]

Somehow individualism actually got lost in Objectivism.

--Brant

Now that is an exceptionally fine point Brant.

[anthony]

We've all got stories and the abstractions and reasoning etc. that fit or not and it all depends on what we do about it all. Rand's novels are so powerful they tend to displace stories which may or may not, in whole or part, be re-established, sometimes with resentment sometimes with gratitude and sometimes with I-don't-know-what-and you-don't-know-what because there are too many whos and whats. To Honor(ing) the Self we have to do it. Somehow individualism actually got lost in Objectivism. --Brant

"We've all got stories..." is true - after a point. Somewhere prior to that, before we diverge in our

different ways, there is a singularity of identity, the universal 'story' of man.

That's what Rand appealed to, her metaphysics in the novels. What we are all born to.

From there on, everything is cognition and volition: but we have to know the "What?" - before the "Why? and How?"

In the confusion of living, checking one's hierarchies is as important as checking one's premises, I think.

[Brant Gaede]

We've all got stories and the abstractions and reasoning etc. that fit or not and it all depends on what we do about it all. Rand's novels are so powerful they tend to displace stories which may or may not, in whole or part, be re-established, sometimes with resentment sometimes with gratitude and sometimes with I-don't-know-what-and you-don't-know-what because there are too many whos and whats. To Honor(ing) the Self we have to do it. Somehow individualism actually got lost in Objectivism. --Brant

"We've all got stories..." is true - after a point. Somewhere prior to that, before we diverge in our

different ways, there is a singularity of identity, the universal 'story' of man.

That's what Rand appealed to, her metaphysics in the novels. What we are all born to.

From there on, everything is cognition and volition: but we have to know the "What?" - before the "Why? and How?"

In the confusion of living, checking one's hierarchies is as important as checking one's premises, I think.

Good premise.

--Brant

[Samson Corwell]

I read the post that said that Objectivist morality isn't a type of universalism. If so, then that seems problematic.

[BaalChatzaf]

Somehow individualism actually got lost in Objectivism.

--Brant

Now that is an exceptionally fine point Brant.

That is because Ayn Rand decided to become a Den Mother to a group of mis-fits who needed a "guru"

Take no umbrage from what I just wrote. I was born a misfit (Aspberger is that sort of a thing). However I needed nor need any guru.

Ba'al Chatzaf