Objectivist Fundamentalism,

[Michael Stuart Kelly]

Phil,

Most definitely Italy and Spain (which is almost at the edge of going down the tubes right now). Political corruption is wildly rampant in both.

Not France so much.

Still, the effect outside of Europe seems to be stronger than inside.

Michael

[Robert Campbell]

Phil,

Italian politics has been and remains notoriously corrupt.

The Italian government has been going after the Sicilian Mafia for about a generation now. In the mob's Neapolitan and Calabrian counterparts—the Camorra and 'Ndrangheta—they've yet to make a dent.

Robert Campbell

[Philip Coates]

When I said "I don't think that applies" I was referring to being close to the equator...not to corruption.

[Dennis Hardin]

Dennis H,

...Wherever there is a country with Catholicism at its main religion, notice that the level of political corruption is much higher than other similar countries, and it's economy is usually worse, especially in terms of bribery and the gap between the rich and the poor. This is particularly true of Latin American countries.

I boiled the reason for this down to the Catholic ritual of confession... Then if you devise an exclusive system where a person can cleanse himself/herself of that guilt, you have a strong motivating draw for repeat customers.

People in these countries usually say about politicians, "What can you do? All politicians are corrupt." ...Underneath, they approve of the corrupt politicians because they are the same.

In their favor, the common sense level of plain old decency is high in people in these countries. They are good people,... I think that lesson ultimately needs to be exposed.

Michael

Michael,

I agree that the same corruption occurs on the individual level but on a smaller scale. We just see more public evidence of it when the political leaders are involved. But corruption is essential to the Christian religion itself.

The late George Walsh pointed out that much of Christianity’s appeal derived from the built-in structural superficiality of its moral code. He gave the founders of Christianity credit for crafting a morality that only demands proper behavior one day out of the seven. Wow. Nifty bit of fancy prescriptive footwork there. Look at the pay-off. People can act pious while devoting much of their time to the most disgusting forms of debauchery, corruption and evil. It all hinges on whether you repent on Day 7. (Or, as you say in the case of Catholics, go to Confession.)

It’s why Capitalism has proven uniquely compatible with Christianity despite its fundamental tenets extolling sacrifice and service to others. There’s plenty of time for paying lip service to that happy horsecrap on Sunday. Until then, it’s deuces wild. Sheer genius.

I don’t know about the prevalence of the “plain old decency” you refer to. Whether a given Christian is genuinely moral (i.e., honest, productive) is largely unrelated to his “religious values.” It may even be inversely proportional to his belief in those values.