"America's Power Is Under Threat" in an article by Peggy Noonan


GALTGULCH8

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Peggy Noonan wrote about an attack on a substation of the power grid which destroyed and disabled a portion of the power grid in the vicinity of Silicon Valley in an article in the WSJ.

She points out that it took a month to repair the damage and in the meantime power was supplied by circumventing the substation.

It was not an act of vandalism. Shells were found which were free of fingerprints and indicated that AK 47's were used in the attack.

The perpetrators were not found.

The attack occurred in darkness and piles of rocks were found which showed that positions from which to shoot were marked by those who planned this in advance. Vulnerable parts of the substation were targeted from those positions.

The attack demonstrates that there are in our midst enemies who have shown they know how to disable our electrical grid and could do it on a large scale nationwide.

I am unaware that this event received any media attention at the time.

One hopes that the Homeland Security Agency and others in the government are addressing this. It is not certain that they even know who did this but the threat is very real.

gg

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Peggy Noonan wrote about an attack on a substation of the power grid which destroyed and disabled a portion of the power grid in the vicinity of Silicon Valley in an article in the WSJ.

She points out that it took a month to repair the damage and in the meantime power was supplied by circumventing the substation.

It was not an act of vandalism. Shells were found which were free of fingerprints and indicated that AK 47's were used in the attack.

The perpetrators were not found.

The attack occurred in darkness and piles of rocks were found which showed that positions from which to shoot were marked by those who planned this in advance. Vulnerable parts of the substation were targeted from those positions.

The attack demonstrates that there are in our midst enemies who have shown they know how to disable our electrical grid and could do it on a large scale nationwide.

I am unaware that this event received any media attention at the time.

One hopes that the Homeland Security Agency and others in the government are addressing this. It is not certain that they even know who did this but the threat is very real.

gg

How is Peggy Noonan threatening our power grids?

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One hopes that the Homeland Security Agency and others in the government are addressing this. It is not certain that they even know who did this but the threat is very real.

So, you have not considered that this was a black ops operation of the Homeland Security Agency as a test run?
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This serves as one more reason to favor decentralization: both in energy and political control.

Decentralized power production is generally less economical that centralized power production. There is an economy of scale to be realized by using larger capacity generators. Of course this is offset to some extent by power losses over the the transmission lines so an optimal mix of generator size and distance to ship power has to be reckoned.

Putting a self contained power generator in every home or apartment building is the least economical way of powering up.

Here is the bare fact. To get electrical power at reasonable costs you have to ship it some distance from the point of generation to the point of consumption. Of course this creates a risk: power transmission lines can be blown up. Generators however can be protected, but that steal leaves the power lines most vulnerable.

Here is another thing. Hydrogen is not a primary power source (not since the Big Bang). There is very little free hydrogen on the planet. Most of it is locked up in molecules. Hydrogen is an active element and combines with lots of other atoms to form molecules. Hydrogen even combines with itself to form hydrogen gas. To make hydrogen gas, you have to break apart molecules which contain hydrogen. This requires energy. So free hydrogen stored as a a Gas H2 in a liquid state or as a metallic hydride has to be -made- using energy. The easiest way of getting H2 is breaking water molecules apart H20.. This can be done with either catalyzers or electricity. Once the hydrogen is either adhering to some metal as a hydride or stored in liquid for as a gas, it can then be burned which will get back a fraction of the energy that was required to free up the hydrogen. So hydrogen is really a way of storing and transporting energy.

I suppose if each house has its own fuel cell, or metallic hydride unit one could make electricity within each building but that would mean transporting the hydrogen. This is a tricky and expensive operation. I am not sure how practical it would be. Certainly not with current technology.

Ba'a Chatzaf

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This serves as one more reason to favor decentralization: both in energy and political control.

Decentralized power production is generally less economical that centralized power production. There is an economy of scale to be realized by using larger capacity generators. Of course this is offset to some extent by power losses over the the transmission lines so an optimal mix of generator size and distance to ship power has to be reckoned.

Putting a self contained power generator in every home or apartment building is the least economical way of powering up.

Great. Let's keep centralized power generation and protect it by having the government assign a platoon of soldiers to guard every station and sub-station. Since the government will be paying for this extra service, nobody's costs will go up.

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This serves as one more reason to favor decentralization: both in energy and political control.

Decentralized power production is generally less economical that centralized power production. There is an economy of scale to be realized by using larger capacity generators. Of course this is offset to some extent by power losses over the the transmission lines so an optimal mix of generator size and distance to ship power has to be reckoned.

Putting a self contained power generator in every home or apartment building is the least economical way of powering up.

Great. Let's keep centralized power generation and protect it by having the government assign a platoon of soldiers to guard every station and sub-station. Since the government will be paying for this extra service, nobody's costs will go up.

What would you recommend? That we all go off grid and keep warm by burning wood?

I can tell you from personal experience that trying to keep a moderate size house going off a gasoline or diesel generator costs a bloody fortune.

Several years ago central New Jersey experienced a seven day (!!!!) outage. My neighbor who had a diesel generator was able to keep his refrigerator and a few electric lamps burning. He could only power up has all electric heating (in our community we are all on electric heating) by not powering his refrigerator (it kept cold over night). It cost him over 50 gallons of diesel to get minimal heating and minimal lighting.

The economic of powering up a house are very much against individual generators. Industry could work if big enough firms clustered in a limited area share a largish generator. Since there would be no long distance power transport it would be easy to feed all the participants with underground wires.

If we want to get chicken shit then communities would have to pay for medium size units that could light up area of less than a square mile and trasnport power under ground. Getting to that point will cost a bloody fortune.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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Several years ago central New Jersey experienced a seven day (!!!!) outage. My neighbor who had a diesel generator was able to keep his refrigerator and a few electric lamps burning. He could only power up has all electric heating (in our community we are all on electric heating) by not powering his refrigerator (it kept cold over night). It cost him over 50 gallons of diesel to get minimal heating and minimal lighting.

Bob, out of curiosity, what time of year was it?

Did he atempt to keep the electric heating between 45 to 50 degrees?

Finally, did he have separate thermostats in each room?

That sounds like a lot of diesel.

A...

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This serves as one more reason to favor decentralization: both in energy and political control.

Decentralized power production is generally less economical that centralized power production. There is an economy of scale to be realized by using larger capacity generators. Of course this is offset to some extent by power losses over the the transmission lines so an optimal mix of generator size and distance to ship power has to be reckoned.

Putting a self contained power generator in every home or apartment building is the least economical way of powering up.

Great. Let's keep centralized power generation and protect it by having the government assign a platoon of soldiers to guard every station and sub-station. Since the government will be paying for this extra service, nobody's costs will go up.

What would you recommend? That we all go off grid and keep warm by burning wood?

I can tell you from personal experience that trying to keep a moderate size house going off a gasoline or diesel generator costs a bloody fortune.

Several years ago central New Jersey experienced a seven day (!!!!) outage. My neighbor who had a diesel generator was able to keep his refrigerator and a few electric lamps burning. He could only power up has all electric heating (in our community we are all on electric heating) by not powering his refrigerator (it kept cold over night). It cost him over 50 gallons of diesel to get minimal heating and minimal lighting.

The economic of powering up a house are very much against individual generators. Industry could work if big enough firms clustered in a limited area share a largish generator. Since there would be no long distance power transport it would be easy to feed all the participants with underground wires.

If we want to get chicken shit then communities would have to pay for medium size units that could light up area of less than a square mile and trasnport power under ground. Getting to that point will cost a bloody fortune.

Ba'al Chatzaf

I'm not telling anybody where to buy their energy. I will only point out that the configuration of how energy is produced at present is largely the result of utility monopolies granted by cities and states a century ago.

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I'm not telling anybody where to buy their energy. I will only point out that the configuration of how energy is produced at present is largely the result of utility monopolies granted by cities and states a century ago.

The power companies used the most efficient technology available.

There is still no better way of making electricity than turning a generator by steam. The real question is what is the most cost effective way of making steam.

BTW photovoltaic units are not going to power industry.. The energy from the sun is about 1000 watts per sqare meter. That is the upper bound. Our current p.v. technology does not get a tenth of that. To get enough electricity energy from sunlight vast areas would have to have p.v. receptors and the power would have be shipped over long distance power lines. And we are back to be vulnerable. Ditto for windmills. Until we get photoconversion that can respond to the total spectrum of the sun, p.v. is a poor source. Perhaps when we get really good p.v. we can finally generate respectable amounts of power, but it would still have to be shipped because not all places are sunny enough, and the sun still goes down at night. So we still have to ship the power from where it is to where it ain't.

And we are not going to have minature nuclear generators either. Any kind of a nuke has to have really big heat exchange units so forget about having a mini-nuke in your basement.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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As usual I find your responses to be odd.

I am sure you are all aware that a natural or man made electromagnetic pulse, as mentioned in the article by Peggy Noonan, would be able to destroy the entire electrical grid as well as your computers in your homes and automobiles. It is certainly an objective of our enemies who could accomplish this by detonating a nuclear device over the country. That is one reason to fear the capability of totalitarian or dictatorial regimes around the world.

However this attack using AK 47s shows that the country is vulnerable to a coordinated attack if done on a large scale simultaneously.

As if there weren't enough things to worry about given the profoundly incompetent leadership who have abandoned our Constitution and violate their oath of office every time they cast a ballot for more government power not authorized in it.

Well you folks don't seem the least bit disturbed by this attack so I guess it is safe to go to bed now.

gg

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Well you folks don't seem the least bit disturbed by this attack so I guess it is safe to go to bed now.

gg

Do you need a nightlight, or, are you glowing from the Fukishima Nuclear Fallout Wave that you predicted?

Just askin...

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I'm not telling anybody where to buy their energy. I will only point out that the configuration of how energy is produced at present is largely the result of utility monopolies granted by cities and states a century ago.

The power companies used the most efficient technology available.

I do not know that it is efficient at all. In every industry I am aware of that has competition, there is a steady, continuous and predictable supply of the product or service. However, when it comes to electric power, I have to put up with frequent outages. Instead of shopping for a new provider, my only option is to phone a mentally handicapped employee of the public utilities commission.

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According to this article, the record for photovoltaic efficiency is 44.7%. That includes infrared and ultraviolet.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/09/130923204214.htm

I read somewhere something about 90%. Maybe that was on the drawing board and not yet on the market.

Then there is the nanotech capacitor. It's only on the drawing board but if they can get this thing happening, it's supposed to store about a hundred times as much energy as a battery its size.

Put these 2 inventions together and you might have something.

And add a third invention. If aerogel insulation can be made cheap enough, then you wouldn't need much energy to heat a house.

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According to this article, the record for photovoltaic efficiency is 44.7%. That includes infrared and ultraviolet.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/09/130923204214.htm

Current p.v. efficiencies run between 5 and 15 percent. This is far too low to power industry.

As to this new development, if the front end production costs, installation costs and maintenance costs, and length of effective lifetime of the p.v. unit are all factored in what is the cost per kilowatt hour at the point of product. After transmissions costs are factored in what is the cost per kilowatt hour at the point of use or consumption?

How does it compare kilowatt hour for kilowatt hour with other forms of electrical power generation?:

It is the number that will determine which forms of generation are used. Bottom line. That is all that counts.

You are aware that this is an experimental product and that most p.v. units currently deployed are much less efficient.

You are also aware that the sun sets at night and darkness falls. So what is missing here?

A good storage battery system that can efficiently store power while the sun shines and dispense it when the sun does not shine.

Any kind of practical power system for industry must supply power -on demand-. Right now no matter how efficient the p.v. devices are power must be supplied during the dark hours from stand-by generators which deliver their power over transmission lines and we are right back to the vulnerability question.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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  • 2 weeks later...
Well you folks don't seem the least bit disturbed by this attack so I guess it is safe to go to bed now.

gg

Do you need a nightlight, or, are you glowing from the Fukishima Nuclear Fallout Wave that you predicted?

Just askin...

Adam,

There appears to be no doubt that the earthquake and the resultant tsunami did destroy the Fukushima nuclear power plants which are still emitting radioactive particles into the water of the Pacific or the air flowing over the plant. Spent fuel rods in the fourth floor pool were to be removed from their vulnerable position but whether that was accomplished without incident of not remains to be seen. That exercise was likened to a "pick up sticks" child's game but fraught with dangers if rods touched other rods causing uncontrolled reactions, melt downs, release of nuclear material directly into the air, etc.

So I am baffled that this is being treated on OL as if it is of no concern to us.

I do sleep nights but I am not buying salmon caught in the Pacific Ocean.

http://rt.com/news/fukushima-new-leak-toxic-832/

gg

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Well you folks don't seem the least bit disturbed by this attack so I guess it is safe to go to bed now.

gg

Do you need a nightlight, or, are you glowing from the Fukishima Nuclear Fallout Wave that you predicted?

Just askin...

Adam,

There appears to be no doubt that the earthquake and the resultant tsunami did destroy the Fukushima nuclear power plants which are still emitting radioactive particles into the water of the Pacific or the air flowing over the plant. Spent fuel rods in the fourth floor pool were to be removed from their vulnerable position but whether that was accomplished without incident of not remains to be seen. That exercise was likened to a "pick up sticks" child's game but fraught with dangers if rods touched other rods causing uncontrolled reactions, melt downs, release of nuclear material directly into the air, etc.

So I am baffled that this is being treated on OL as if it is of no concern to us.

I do sleep nights but I am not buying salmon caught in the Pacific Ocean.

http://rt.com/news/fukushima-new-leak-toxic-832/

gg

The pacific is large and the particles will sink. It is air borne particulates that may be of some concern. In the worst case he density of the fallout is low and very few additional cases of cancer will be produced on our side of the ocean. Civilization will not come to an end because of the Fukishima mishap.

Ba'al Chatzaf

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The sinking particles will find their way into the bodies of microscopic organisms such as plankton which will be eaten by larger fish in turn eaten by still larger fish and so on until they are caught in nets, or hooked by fisherman. Ultimately someone will eat in on his or her plate for dinner.

But I hope you are correct.

this is still another distraction from the economic collapse which is heading our way so long as the unconstitutional central bank continues to print the currency into oblivion.

gg

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Ifffff you were to pick a seafood not to eat I would stay away from bottom feeding organisms like shrimp, crab and other shellfish that syphon particles like clams. I think the hazards are blown out of proportion.

I would be more concerned with the 4million barrels of oil spilled into the ocean over the three months BP Horizon well was gushing in 2006. Chances are it was a lot higher.

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Jules,

I agree with not eating bottom-feeders.

They're only good to vote for.

:smile:

Michael

Now that was hilarious.

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